Emrakul, the Promised End vs game loss
Asked by chosenone124 7 years ago
I cast Emrakul, the Promised End in a multiplayer game and target an opponent, and the trigger resolves. Before their turn, they kill me at instant speed. Do they get an extra turn?
chosenone124 says... #2
So the person who plays the extra turn spell "owns" the extra turn? Turns can be owned by players?
March 4, 2017 5:13 a.m.
Turns aren't owned by players, and I think GearNoir might've read the card wrong. The only triggered ability Emrakul has triggers when it's cast, and resolves even before Emrakul enters the battlefield (and independant of that event). If it were a delayed triggered ability that would trigger at the beginning of target player's next turn, their answer would be the end of it.
However, it's a little more or less complicated than that, depending on how you're looking at it.
First, Gatherer (as most of the time) already gives a very relevant answer:
If the targeted player skips his or her next turn, you'll control the next turn the affected player actually takes, and the extra turn the player takes will be after that turn.
The reason for this is that the ability is worded in a way that grants the affected player an extra turn after the turn that has been taken control over. In other words, as long as there's no control taken by you over their turn, they won't get an extra turn out of nowhere.
Now, the actual part of 800.4 that's relevant is this one:
800.4b. (...) If a player would be controlled by a player who has left the game, he or she isn't.
In short, you never take control over their turn, so they never get an extra turn.
March 4, 2017 11 a.m.
Sorry if that was confusing. What I meant to show was that all objects are cleared, including the stack, when it comes to the player who lost.
I thought the stack objects for "take control of target player their next turn" and the "target player gets extra turn" would reside there until they were performed. When the player who. Castes Emrakul leaves the game/loses those game objects are cleared immediately on next pass of priority after the loss. So the opponent would get their regular turn but no extra. Is that not true?
I saw that clearing of the stack as the most relevant answer. Sorry if I misunderstood. :)
March 4, 2017 12:10 p.m.
What's happening is, as BlueScope pointed out, the extra turn is part of the control effect, not a delayed triggered ability. If the control effect doesn't happen, either because it is removed or overwritten, the extra turn doesn't happen. rule 804 is still responsible for the lack of an extra turn:
800.4a When a player leaves the game, all objects (see rule 109) owned by that player leave the game and any effects which give that player control of any objects or players end.
March 4, 2017 12:20 p.m.
chosenone124 says... #6
I see. So what would happen if the controlling player lost the game while controlling the other player? I get that the control would end, but would the controlled player receive his extra turn?
March 4, 2017 7:50 p.m. Edited.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #7
As long as Emrakul's on-cast trigger resolves, the targeted player will get the extra turn regardless. As written, the extra turn is not in any way dependent on whether or not you actually gained control of the player. The "that turn" in the last sentence of the effect simply refers to "that player's next turn".
There's really no direct comparison in the game for Emrakul, the Promised End, so here's my best shot: Consider the example (and rulings) of Thundermaw Hellkite. It says it "deals 1 damage to each creature with flying your opponents control", and then tells you to "Tap those creatures". The words "those creatures" refer to "each creature with flying your opponents control", and even creatures from that set who don't take any damage will still get tapped.
March 4, 2017 8:13 p.m. Edited.
Ah, true, I actually thought about it the wrong way. As I said, "as long as there's no control taken by you over their turn, they won't get an extra turn", but since they do take their turn, there will be an extra turn.
I object to name colors determining the quality of answers, though, even if in this case it happens to be accurate ;)
GearNoir says... #1
The Comprehensive Rules equate losing the game with leaving the game and vice versa:
104.5. If a player loses the game, he or she leaves the game. If the game is a draw for a player, he or she leaves the game. The multiplayer rules handle what happens when a player leaves the game; see rule 800.4.
Among other things, the 800.4 rules go on to state that all objects owned by the losing player are removed from the game, including triggers.
March 4, 2017 2:31 a.m.