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I have also a question - how's been Sensei's Divining Top performing for you? I think about adding it to my list but I'm not sure if it's worth it or if I know the best ways to use it.
May 25, 2019 5:31 a.m.
Hmm... I actually think that Gemstone Mine doesn't belong here because we need EVERY. SINGLE. MANA. every turn so losing a land after 3 usages might hurt more than help. Tarnished Citadel might be third copy of City of Brass , however, I don't like this card and it's 3 life cost per color at all - we're already losing too much life from fetches and shocks (or at least me since you've upgraded your deck with ABUR duals) to take more masochistic steps towards perfect fixing. Especially in (as you've correctly stated) midrange deck like this, where we might get punished for slower start. That's why there's a need to rely a little more on dorks and artifacts.
May 24, 2019 5:53 p.m.
I think that you can safely cut 1 land since you have 35 + 2x rocks, which is the amount of mana producers that I personally run in my The Ur-Dragon deck with higher curve and avg. CMC at 3.00. Also with the amount of draw/card filtering/tutors you're in good position to see enough lands each game.
Also isn't your manabase perfect enough so you don't actually need to use Chromatic Lantern ? My point is that in Slivers Gemhide Sliver and Manaweft Sliver are already making it's job in 2 copies at 2 CMC.
_Delta_ I actually think that in Tribal deck like this, where creatures also act as a some kind of toolbox (in which Slivers excel at) Eladamri's Call is too good to cut it. I'd personally try to find some room for Worldly Tutor as an easy way to find Sliver Queen or new Lavabelly Sliver before turn we gonna win.
May 24, 2019 5:02 p.m.
Unfortunately I didn't have enough occasions to playtest my deck as lately I've been working a lot and acquiring some of the more expensive cards, so I can't tell much about newest version - it looks solid when I goldfish but it might need a little more test-runs in actual play.
About Earthquake - if you want to get rid of dorks then I'd go for Electrickery since it's overload costs just like Earthquake but it can hit Birds of Paradise AND stay away from our creatures. Also when you start paying more it actually might get a little worse since it's for worse Pyroclasm or for worse Anger of the Gods . I'd personally just think about creatures that I'd like to wipe most often with this kind of card and search for better version. The only redeeming quality of Earthquake is it's flexibility so it can be actually tested during games to answer the question "how much damage is enough?". Anyway it's symmetrical so our poor dorks might die from it too. Fire Covenant might be better as an asymmetrical effect.
I think that Chrome Mox is better in more cEDH builds where you can dump a dork early game and just roll with it since these kind of builds run 10+ dorks or redundant draw/tutor effects so players often get rid of extra copies in hand to get more speed.
With Mox Diamond however, I think that if you can afford it then it can certainly go here instead of 1 land. That's because we've got to a point where our ways to draw cards look good so there's no worry in losing 1 land card early and mid/late-game it can be used as a great color fixing artifact. Also counting artifacts as lands we still have 37 total so it looks good in higher CMC decks like our builds.
May 23, 2019 6:01 p.m. Edited.
I'm trying to build Vampire tribal deck that is focused on casting low-cost Vampires so I get food for aristocrats subtheme as a main win-con (while overrun with tokens might still be a plan B) and gain advantage of cards like Dark Confidant or Ad Nauseam so your build is a great place to start.
Any advice for that take on Edgar Markov ?
May 22, 2019 9:35 p.m.
There are some great slivers spoiled today including The First Sliver (, 7/7 with cascade, your other Slivers have cascade) and Dregscape Sliver (, 2/2 with Unearth , other slivers have this ability) - do you think they deserve a spot in the deck?
May 22, 2019 11:10 a.m. Edited.
May 22, 2019 8:47 a.m.
Lately I also had a thought about Chromatic Lantern - in 5 colors I tend to keep it since this is game of variables and you might not always be able to fix mana producers perfectly.
However in 2-4 color decks (besides maybe Breya, Etherium Shaper ) if you have perfect collection of fetches, shocks, maybe duals (not necessary), painlands and a few basics then you don't need it. If you have some budget cuts and sub-optimal options then I'd give it a try but 3 color deck is a place where fixing gets more important but it's still not that hard to get done right during early game.
May 19, 2019 2:03 p.m.
Looks way better - have you had a chance to playtest newer version of the deck?
May 19, 2019 1:54 p.m.
Yeah, 5 CMC is a problem here because usual decks that create tokens are Elves, Cats, maybe Knights so their CMC is between 2-4 and Doubling Season or Parallel Lives are great curve toppers. Here as I stated before 4+ CMC is where we want to have Dragons and support for them already established on board. Besides that we have like 6-7 cards that would benefit from doubling tokens/counters, which might not be enough since we want combos that secure the wins BUT they're good on their own as single cards and I feel like there's just not enough to interactions to justify this addition. I'm more into Greater Good rather than this.
The two Sarkhans you've mentioned are good only for their ultimates and nothing else really, that's why I slowly started to cut them down and settled on only one, which might win on a spot. Newest set brought us not only more hate on planeswalkers but also more competition, which really makes it hard to find a reason to play these (in my opinion) very casual-oriented walkers.
May 19, 2019 4:58 a.m.
Cruel Celebrant from newest set might be 3rd win con here, right?
May 19, 2019 2:58 a.m.
Yeah, that's one of reasons why I don't run them. Also BFZ lands with the amount of basics I have are able to come untapped from fetch. And why do I run 6 basics here? Simply because Path to Exile , Ghost Quarter and Assassin's Trophy exist besides the usual Blood Moon or Back to Basics .
However, Battlebond duals are amazing budget options, when someone doesn't want to run full fetch cycle, which nowadays got expensive (AGAIN...)
May 17, 2019 5:06 p.m. Edited.
One more quick thought: you don't need huge amount of dragons in deck to really feel the theme, because, when you increase card draw you increase the amount of cards you dig through during each game. At this point some suboptimal dragons should be replaced with more card draw and tutors to find the ones that stand out as the best. Another thing is the fact that playing token producers allows us to get more dragon bodies from a single card without need to increase the amount of creatures - consider this a 2 or even 3 dragons in 1.
May 12, 2019 9:12 p.m.
If you want more flexible fixing and you're not afraid to pay a little life then I'd go with slow fetches, since they can take your ABUR Duals / Shocklands, while Evolving Wilds grabs only basics.
I understand that you want to be as much 'on theme' as possible but some cards are just bad... That's why I use other creatures and as I saw that these are birds, elves, bears, etc. I decided to call them 'Forest Servants' because every being can become a Dragon servant.
While at that - interactions can be viewed as your spells as a mage so you don't need Spit Flame as an excuse for a targeted removal. For me it's as much on theme as Assassin's Trophy and you probably already know which one is better.
And point about growing tokens - they will get huge with Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury and/or Dromoka, the Eternal anyway and main reason we're running cards that produce them is to just hit as hard and as often as possible with Scourge of Valkas or Dragon Tempest so their power is a secondary thing. That's where reanimation from Living Death / Patriarch's Bidding comes in handy.
May 12, 2019 9:05 p.m.
About that - main problem here is that you want to have too much high CMC cards that make 'cool things' but it's better to settle for less and actually get there. Playing Dragon tribe already fills your high end of the curve so we need to focus on lower CMC interaction/ramp/draw to get to cast as many of the mentioned creatures as possible.
That's why Crucible of Fire and Sight of the Scalelords are bad but you seem to discover another way to win besides fight with big beaters - it's reanimator strategy. So I'd rather get 4/4 or 5/5 Dragon with Animate Dead for AND do something else than cast one of those enchantments and pass, hoping that it survives on board. I personally use reanimation with Dragon Tempest as a secondary strategy to kill as many people as possible with damage from dragons coming back and then smash the rest with them, since they get haste.
Abrupt Decay has that advantage of hitting NONLAND permaments... so creatures, enchantments, artifacts, planeswalkers all go down. While Vraska's Contempt is overpriced Path to Exile in black since planeswalkers can be overrun with Dragons and 2 life gain is negligible. It's not about hitting someone's Craterhoof Behemoth or in your case Hellkite Overlord it's about dealing with Sylvan Library / Phyrexian Arena , Chromatic Lantern or Yisan, the Wanderer Bard that get them there. And that's the lesson that I learned few months back and made drastic changes to my deck - Bow before Draconic King!!! | *WAR* Update. It's still a Dragon deck but has everything that early game requires so I can still compete with better tuned decks of others.
That's why for changes I'd propose:
- Kilnmouth Dragon -> Night's Whisper - instead of giving someone information what you have for 7 mana you get 2 cards for 2 that noone sees besides you
- Skarrgan Hellkite -> Selvala, Heart of the Wilds or Lotus Cobra - 5 mana for 4/4 flyer that can be 5/5 with overpriced activated ability is bad... you'll be better off with one of these dorks for 2-3 CMC.
- Crucible of Fire -> Nature's Claim - lowers the avg. CMC, let's you be more reactive and holding on for interaction on opponents turn is easy to do.
- Spit Flame -> Sarkhan's Triumph - overpriced damage restricted to creatures might be good in Standard but not EDH. Try out tutor instead and thank me later :D
- The Immortal Sun -> Gruul Signet / Rakdos Signet - I know it's an epic card and all but... it's cost is huge, you might actually cast 6 CMC Dragon instead of this and to actually get there you can run early ramp so 1-2 turns earlier flying behemoth will be way more dangerous.
- Hellkite Overlord / Darigaaz Reincarnated -> Worldly Tutor - with tutor in deck you need actually 1 of these two if you still want to have a huge Dragon. Also this is great way to get utility dragons like Glorybringer or Dragonlord Kolaghan when you need them most.
- Temple of the False God -> Rocky Tar Pit / Mountain Valley / Evolving Wilds - this land is bad... if you have 1 land and this, then you still only have 1 land since it won't activate early. Ancient Tomb is great because it can work turn 1 for some rocks but this... requires board full of lands and one Armageddon makes it useless again.
If you want to know more about getting better at EDH I'd recommend checking out CMDR Central and EDHRec podcasts on youtube - https://articles.edhrec.com/commander-central-ep75-settling-for-less/. Also EDHRec page has great articles posted daily, one of them is about Evolving Wilds: https://articles.edhrec.com/in-the-margins-evolving-wilds-terramorphic-expanse/
May 12, 2019 1:56 a.m. Edited.
Also I've completely forgot about Sylvan Library - it works wonders every turn and 4 life for a card when you really need it is worth it (just don't overuse this effect and you'll be fine).
May 11, 2019 3:39 p.m.
Looks good, however I'd still lower the number of dragons and add some interaction and draw:
- Night's Whisper - 2 cards for 2 mana and 2 life? It's great!
- Worldly Tutor - instead of having 'whatever' dragon you get 'exactly' what you need, same thing with Sylvan Tutor and Sarkhan's Triumph .
- Nature's Claim - very cheap interaction and giving 4 life against draconic force means absolutely nothing.
- Abrupt Decay - without white and lack of exile effects you must still up the number of removal you get here and there's no better option than a little more specific Assassin's Trophy .
- Llanowar Elves - classic dork, that can be used in place of 1 of your worse performing land.
- Lotus Cobra - since you have more of 'land matters' theme I'd consider this card and if you can afford some more fetchlands it works wonders (even 2 slow fetches will do).
- Gruul Signet and Rakdos Signet - 2 cmc rocks that add and one of the supporting colors might lower the avg. CMC and smooth out early game.
- Selvala, Heart of the Wilds - a 3 cmc dork, that can provide card draw AND can tap for immense amounts of mana for only !
- Sarkhan the Mad - can be translated here as 'kill one player'
- Fire-Lit Thicket - might be worth giving a shot thanks to it's flexibility
May 11, 2019 3:36 p.m.
Actually I think that planeswalkers are bad option since most of them are suboptimal choices and there's going to be a lot of PW hate with new set coming out.
I personally have lower curve and run Intruder Alert! to combo out for infinite mana and then recast Arcades to win with Laboratory Maniac . Or infinite mana into Walking Ballista by either casting it for infinite or adding infinite counters if its already in play.
May 9, 2019 9:34 a.m.
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