heroic triggers
Asked by w4rped 10 years ago
So heroic says that when a spell targets the creature it will trigger. A creature is considered a spell even if it is a creature spell. I am not sure if it is still considered a spell as it "enters the battlefield" and that would be the only reason it would not trigger the heroic I think. Or does the creature have to be in play before you choose the target? If thast the case it definitely wouldn't trigger it.
The reason I ask is because there's many creatures that target another creature as it enters the battlefield. I have a feeling it doesn't trigger it but I figured I'd ask.
Epochalyptik says... Accepted answer #2
A creature can have an ability that triggers when the creature enters the battlefield, and the ability can target something, but the creature itself never targets anything as either a spell or a permanent. Abilities can't trigger heroic, so you can't ever trigger any heroic abilities on one creature by using another creature.
November 3, 2014 9:42 p.m.
Ya, that's what I figured. But its always been a question since it does say "target" and that triggers heroic on basically every card. I think the best answer is that it is actually a creature ability and not a spell when it activates. I guess if the creature had an ability that resolved before it entered the battlefield ( i know of no creature like that) it might trigger heroic. But then again even bloodrush doesn't trigger heroic and that is about as close to a spell as you can get. I guess I am just getting stuck on the heroic wording since it says spell and since every card in the game is a spell when it is cast, it feels like more than just an instant sorcery or enchantment would trigger it. thanks for the responses.
November 3, 2014 11:02 p.m.
Also, certain creature cards in standard right now seem like that is exactly what their job is. Like the green one that enters and gives a +1/+1 counter to target creature. Looks like a card that was made to trigger heroic, just like the Retraction Helix and other cards that target and then give an ability to a creature instead of just targeting the creature that is the real target.Speaking of which... Do you know of any other cards like Retraction Helix ? I know there are more but I can't find/think of them. The cards I am talking about are the ones that target a creature and then give it a tap ability. I know about the green one with strive that gives +1/+1 and T: fight target creature, but I think there are more than that.
November 3, 2014 11:12 p.m.
billpasdmf says... #5
@w4rped I think what may be tripping you up is an understanding of what designations cards have in what zones and when they are on the stack.
Cards are simply cards when they are in your library, hand, graveyard, or exile.
Spells exist on the stack.
Permanents (creatures, artifacts, enchantments, planeswalkers) exist on the battlefield.
Heroic abilities are triggered when spells are cast and then target the Heroic creature. Again, cards are spells when they are on the stack. When a creature enters the battlefield and has some form of "enters the battlefield" ability, that isn't related to it being a spell, as it is no longer a spell at that point, anyway. Moreover, as has been previously stated, abilities never trigger Heroic, under any circumstance.
November 4, 2014 12:09 a.m.
Yes, I understand that. That is why I had asked. I only said that it would be different if the ability did not say when the creature enters the battlefield, but I also don't know if that would work since Bloodrush is considered a creature ability and not a spell. It was more of a thought that I was expressing than anything else. Either way, only enchantments instants and sorceries will trigger heroic. I get that.
raithe000 says... #1
The only spells that target are instants, sorceries, and aura enchantments. Creature spells do not target. Creatures with abilities that target another creature when they enter the battlefield do not trigger heroic. This is because the trigger occurs once the creature has already entered the battlefield, so by that time it is no longer a spell and is a permanent.
November 3, 2014 7:55 p.m.