Equipping double strike with first strike
Asked by WhySoLimey 12 years ago
If I equip Ethereal Armor to Fencing Ace does it do a double first strike?
Double strike = first strike + regular strike, so the additional first strike is redundant. You can't 'upgrade' the regular strike, so to say.
November 21, 2012 7:05 a.m.
FYI:
702.4b/702.7b If at least one attacking or blocking creature has first strike OR double strike as the combat damage step begins, the only creatures that assign combat damage in that step are those with first strike or double strike. After that step, instead of proceeding to the end of combat step, the phase gets a second combat damage step. The only creatures that assign combat damage in that step are the remaining attackers and blockers that had neither first strike nor double strike as the first combat damage step began, as well as the remaining attackers and blockers that currently have double strike. After that step, the phase proceeds to the end of combat step.
November 21, 2012 7:08 a.m.
Vesperia47 says... #4
Well this question is actually a layers question. Any ability applied to something will follow the time stamp order for that item. The latest time stamp will be what actually comes through. So Since you first cast the creature and the cast Ethereal Armor the enchantment will have the later time stamp. Short version: Fencing Ace will have first strike and not double strike.
November 21, 2012 7:12 a.m.
DocLawless says... Accepted answer #5
Wizards addresses this here: http://community.wizards.com/magicsages/wiki/Keyword:Double_Strike
tl;dr"(Interactions) with first strike: First strike on a creature with double strike is completely redundant; it doesn't do anything more than double strike does on its own."
November 21, 2012 8:32 a.m.
Vesperia47, you're wrong. Ethereal Armor can not remove double strike by granting First Strike. Fencing Ace will have both abilities, but the first strike ability is redundant.
November 21, 2012 9:18 a.m.
Ethereal Armor will not overwrite Fencing Ace 's double strike ability. To do that it would have to read "Enchanted creature is a 1/1 (creature type) with first strike and 'This creature gets +1/+1 for each enchantment you control.'"
702.4e Multiple instances of double strike on the same creature are redundant.
702.7d Multiple instances of first strike on the same creature are redundant.
Sure it doesn't mention first strike directly in this ruling, but as mentioned above from 702.4b when the combat damage step begins if any creatures have first strike or double strike only they will deal combat damage in that step, then the phase proceeds to a second "normal" combat damage step rather than directly to the end of combat step.
The initial wording for double strike is actually (This creature deals both first-strike and regular combat damage.), as shown on Dragon Tyrant .
Neither first strike or double strike will stack. A creature with any number of instances of first strike/double strike will deal combat damage once during the first strike combat step. A creature with any number of instances of double strike will then deal combat damage once again during the normal combat damage step.
November 21, 2012 12:03 p.m.
Actually the text for double strike on Dragon Tyrant is exactly the same as on Fencing Ace . Just saying :P
November 21, 2012 1:15 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #10
@Vesperia47: You're right that layers are the way to determine what the object's characteristics are, but you're not interpreting them correctly. "Layer 0" (not an official term) is the object's natural characteristics, which is where Fencing Ace gets double strike. Layer 6 is the ability adding/removing layer, and that's where the first strike from Ethereal Armor is applied. The Armor's effect doesn't remove abilities, it just adds them, so the final characteristics of the Ace include having both first and double strike.
WhySoLimey says... #1
I would guess not, but my friend disagrees :P
November 21, 2012 7 a.m.