Broodhatch Nantuko and Combat Damage
Asked by Atsuma 9 years ago
So as I'm sure many remember, combat damage used to be something that utilized the stack and had to resolve after being dealt, during which time you could do things in response.
Now i know that morph is a special player action that doesn't use the stack, so i was wondering what the absolute last moment in time you could unmorph a Broodhatch Nantuko and still use its effect in regard to combat damage is.
Can you do it during the combat damage step at all? Before damage is assigned? After it is assigned but before it completes the damage resolution process?
and if it can unmorph whilst damage is being resolved (which i don't think it can) if i had a Trail of Mystery in play and unmorph it in response to them dealing 2 damage to kill it, would the trail trigger go off and pump it to be a 3/3 even though there isn't really a stack?
hyperlocke says... Accepted answer #2
To use its effect, the last time you can unmorph it is before the combat damage step. During this step, no player receives priority, and you can unmorph a creature only if you have priority.
If you could unmorph in the combat damage step (which you can't!), Trail of Mystery would go on the stack right before the next time a player would receive priority (as happens with Broodhatch Nantuko's ability). State based actiones are checked, Broodhatch Nantuko dies. Trail of Mystery ability resolves, doing nothing.
702.36d Any time you have priority, you may turn a face-down permanent you control face up. [...]
510.2. Second, all combat damage thats been assigned is dealt simultaneously. This turn-based action doesnt use the stack. No player has the chance to cast spells or activate abilities between the time combat damage is assigned and the time its dealt. This is a change from previous rules.
January 29, 2015 11:22 a.m.
I understand that's normall what happens, but i was more curious about the interaction of the timing with morph, priority, and the stack.
i know from 702.36d that you can turn a face-down permanent face-up any time you have priority, so i guess the better question is when do players have priority during the combat damage step. all the graphics for turn order with that level of detail i found from my cursory searching were outdated in that regard.
also just so i can read it over, which rule is the one about when you check state based actions again?
January 29, 2015 11:31 a.m.
The first time in the combat damage step anybody gets priority is at 510.4
This is AFTER damage assignment order is chosen and all damage is assigned AND dealt. Nobody gets priority any other time after the end of the declare blockers step.
That means once you pass the declare blockers step into the combat damage step, you can't unmorph anything until after all the damage assignment order, and damage being dealt.
704.3. Whenever a player would get priority (see rule 116, "Timing and Priority"), the game checks for any of the listed conditions for state-based actions, then performs all applicable state-based actions simultaneously as a single event.
So as you would enter into 510.4 and get priority, state-based actions are checked first, and would see a 2/2 creature with 2 damage marked on and cause it to die.
704.5g If a creature has toughness greater than 0, and the total damage marked on it is greater than or equal to its toughness, that creature has been dealt lethal damage and is destroyed.
That happens before you get priority in 510.4 and before you can unmorph to get the ability you're looking for.
Devonin says... #1
510.2. Second, all combat damage that's been assigned is dealt simultaneously. This turn-based action doesn't use the stack. No player has the chance to cast spells or activate abilities between the time combat damage is assigned and the time it's dealt.
If you leave the declare blockers step and move into the combat damage step, the damage is being assigned and then dealt with no time to do anything.
The final thing which happens in the combat damage step is that the active player gets priority, but any time a player WOULD get priority, state-based actions are checked and would put your 2/2 with 2 damage marked into the graveyard before you could turn it face up.
The last moment you have to turn it up is after blockers are declared but before you move into the combat damage step.
January 29, 2015 11:21 a.m.