How does a Final Punishment work with a staying power in play?
Asked by poisondd 11 years ago
This is how I would think it works, With Staying Power in play when I cast FInal Punishment it deals all the damage that has been dealt to target player in the entire game up until the point that I cast Final Punishment. Is this a generally accepted way to play this combo? Or do I just have it completely wrong.
You'd be better off combo'ing Staying Power with False Cure as they'd lose life instead of gain it any time they'd gain life for the rest of the game Staying Power stuck around.
March 16, 2014 12:13 p.m.
Wouldn't it be that anytime that player takes damage from after Final Punishment is cast that they would lose that much like due to the 'this turn' in final punishment no longer ending?
March 16, 2014 12:17 p.m.
Final Punishment isn't a "this turn" effect, despite those words appearing in the text. Staying Power refers to effects with durations that expire not expiring, while Final Punishment is just asking "How much life have you lost this turn? X? Okay, lose X life"
March 16, 2014 12:21 p.m.
Devonin you're right that damage is not an until end of turn effect but your life does not go back to 20 at the begin of your turn either, so being dealt damage is an accumulative effect. So when you remove this turn from final punishment it should deal the amount of damage you have take in the game to that point. The false cure is a good combo but my staying power is in a cleric deck where i gain life as well. thank you for the input.
March 16, 2014 12:34 p.m.
Devonin,
Ok so your saying that it asks, how much life have you lost this turn? so wouldn't it change the question to how much life have you lost? (I do understand what your saying just not understanding why this turn is on the card if it has no value)
March 16, 2014 12:46 p.m.
GoblinsInc says... #7
No. Though the format is similar to some continuous effects, the effect of final punishment is a One-shot effect. It has no duration, and merely checks to see how much life has been lost that turn. One-shot effects do something once and that is all, there is no duration. As there is no duration, there is nothing to stop from ending.
Furthermore, Un cards are not created to work inside the rules. This is about as close as I feel we can get for this card, but when posting an Un card you shouldn't expect the result to always make sense.
March 16, 2014 1:05 p.m.
@ivynyte it has plenty of value...it takes the life you lost this turn and makes you lose that much life again. Just because it doesn't combo the way you want it to with one UN card, doesn't mean it is somehow a bad or brokenly templated card.
@poisondd You are sadly incorrect about how life loss "accumulates" with regards to Final Punishment . Staying Power only stops durational effects that would end 'this turn' or 'at end of turn' from ending. Damage is not one of those things, nor is life loss. So Staying Power simply doesn't interact with those game elements the way you want it to. Suggesting that "damage you've taken" accumulates as an -effect- is not true in the way you seem to want it to.
March 16, 2014 1:12 p.m.
tl;dr version: Staying Power says that effects which end "this turn" don't end. Even though the words "this turn" appear in Final Punishment 's rules text, nothing in the function of that card creates any effect with a duration for Staying Power to impact in any way.
March 16, 2014 1:13 p.m.
Devonin,
Firstly thank you for explaining this so completely, I do now see what your saying and the difference in the wording on the card. "only stops durational effects that would end 'this turn' or 'at end of turn' from ending. Damage is not one of those things, nor is life loss." Once I read this line it clicked. I wasn't trying to argue that it should work, just not seeing how it wasn't. I honestly feel like understanding the why's will help me to be a better player with my group. Thank you again for all the time you put into answering and clarifying to help me understand.
March 16, 2014 1:20 p.m.
No problem! Glad I could help!
It's always really dicey making "is" and "is not" statements with Un- cards though. They really are up to the individual interpretations of the group playing them.
March 16, 2014 1:33 p.m.
yeah, I'm pretty sure we could get away with it, but that kind of takes the fun out of it. We get a lot of flack for even attempting to play with the Un cards in the first place. However, they tend to make things more interesting.
March 16, 2014 1:40 p.m.
If you're playing in any format besides "Sitting around playing for the fun of it" none of the Un-cards are legal to play anyway.
Best use of un cards with normal play: R&D's Secret Lair with Floral Spuzzem
March 16, 2014 1:52 p.m.
Hunh, no ampersand in the slug name, makes sense I guess.
Devonin says... #1
Staying Power Final Punishment
You have it wrong.
Damage taken is not in any way an "Until end of turn" or "At end of turn" effect. Nor are any sources of damage or life loss (that I know of) "until end of turn" or "at end of turn" effects.
There's no interaction between these two cards on their own.
March 16, 2014 12:11 p.m.