Which triggered ability resolves first, both Lab Man and Psychosis Crawler on the field

Asked by Bitships 2 years ago

I have a Laboratory Maniac on the field, 30 something cards in hand, about 10 left in library, however I am only on 1 life.

My opponent has a Psychosis Crawler on the field.

I cast a Whispering Madness

So I go to draw way more than the cards I have remaining in my diary, which would cause Laboratory Maniac to trigger, winning me the game. However at the same time Psychosis Crawler triggers, dealing more than enough damage to kill me.

What would be the outcome? Is there a stack interaction I'm just not seeing? Is it a draw?

My argument was that it would be a draw, as the cards are all drawn simultaneously, putting me on -30 something life, but simultaneously triggering lab man's win con. My opponent argued that the cards were drawn one-by-one, which would mean that I would hit 0 life before the lab man was triggered.

It hurt my brain trying to write that, I hope I made sense!

Lab Man doesn’t trigger, he replaces the action of drawing from an empty library with you winning the game. Crawler will trigger during the resolution of Madness, however they will never see the stack because the game will be over.

June 25, 2021 8:16 p.m.

Polaris says... #2

Yeah, triggered abilities don't start with "if." A triggered ability will always start by referring to a time (at the beginning of, whenever, when, etc.). Replacement effects usually start with "if" and instead of triggering for an effect, they modify the event they're referring to. You win the game while Whispering Madness is resolving; there's no need to wait for a trigger.

June 25, 2021 10:42 p.m.

Named_Tawyny says... Accepted answer #3

For the sake of clarity, Psychosis Crawler WILL trigger 10 times - your opponent is correct that cards are drawn one at a time when there's an instruction to draw multiple times.

However, those triggers will never RESOLVE.

When the next-after-last card in your library would have been drawn, since there's nothing there to draw, Laboratory Maniac will win you the game. The triggers that were created by the Crawler will cease to exist, as the game is over and your opponent has been eliminated.

June 25, 2021 11:08 p.m.

Polaris says... #4

It's actually a good thing lab man isn't a trigger, because if it was you'd lose the game for some complicated reasons it's kind of a relief not to have to explain here.

June 25, 2021 11:51 p.m.

Bitships says... #5

Ah okay?

So Psychosis Crawler WOULD trigger, however LabMans replacements ability happens first, so LabMan wins?

June 26, 2021 4:36 a.m.

Polaris says... #6

More or less yes. When an ability triggers, it waits until the current effect finishes and then goes on the stack,so you wouldn't see any Psychosis Crawler triggers until after Whispering Madness is done resolving and everyone had drawn all of their cards from it. Lab Maniac being a replacement effect means it doesn't have to wait and you just win the moment you try to draw from an empty deck. The game never reaches the point where all the Psychosis Crawler triggers get put on the stack, much less when they resolve and start draining your life.

June 26, 2021 9:54 a.m.

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