Kytheon loses +1/+1 counters when he flips... and a related question.

Asked by Korombos 7 years ago

SInce Kytheon, Hero of Akros  Flip exiles and then returns from exile transformed, any +1/ +1 counters on him at that time go poof. When he enters the battlefield from exile as Gideon, Battle-Forged  Flip, he is considered a new object. Then, if he manages to get +1/+1 counters (as a creature due to his loyalty ability) those stay on the card, even when he is no longer a creature. They do not, however, interact with the loyalty counters in any way, especially if planeswalker Gideon were to take damage (unless his take no damage clause is in effect.) Yes?

Related question: if something overrides his damage-protection, does his indestructability keep him from getting put in the graveyard, or does he go to the graveyard as a planeswalker with zero loyalty? I was trying to puzzle out his Oracle rulings, but getting confused...

Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #1

Yes, you have the correct understanding of how things work in your first paragraph.

Being indestructible only defends against lethal marked damage (against a creature's toughness) and "destroy" effects. A planeswalker dying for having 0 loyalty isn't a "destroy" effect, so indestructibility doesn't help. If there's something stopping damage from being prevented while Gideon, Battle-Forged  Flip is a creature (Leyline of Punishment, etc.) then damage will cause him to lose loyalty counters and he will die if he gets to 0.

April 11, 2016 1:17 p.m.

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