Ice Cauldron Exiling Commander from hand.
Asked by I_H8_U_M8 9 years ago
Say you are playing Commander Format. You have your commander in hand and you choose to exile it with Ice Cauldron. If you cast it, then later it is moved to the command zone, from being destroyed ect, being that it is still the last card that was exiled with Ice Cauldron can you still spend the mana from the second activated ability to cast your commander? If you could continually add more charge counters, could you add the mana for every future cast?
For the point of this argument, Lets say Vorel of the Hull Clade is your commander.
Also, since this is Ice Cauldron, there may be some error in what I have said. Also, semi-relevant Gatherer notes:
10/4/2004 It is possible to have more than one card exiled by the Cauldron. You can tap the Cauldron to remove the charge counter and whatever mana is on it but leave the card there. Later, you can tap it and put in mana and a charge counter to add another card.
10/4/2004 If multiple cards are exiled by the Cauldron, the mana can only be used for the card that was exiled by the Cauldron when the most recent charge counter was put there.
10/4/2004 The mana put in the Cauldron can only be used to cast the given spell, but you can add additional mana to a spell. This means you can pay part of the cost on one turn and the rest of it on the next turn.
March 2, 2015 4:49 a.m.
@Boza Can I get any ruling for this? I cant seem to find anything about it on gatherer. If you cast your commander after it was exiled with Ice Cauldron, without using the paid mana to cast it, it gets removed goes back to command zone, can you add the mana while its in the command zone to pay for the cost of casting it? Although it does say "Spend this mana only to cast the last card exiled with Ice Cauldron" It does not say that the card has to remain in the exile to cast it with the mana. And that is where I need clarification.
March 2, 2015 5:02 a.m.
Cards that reference a particular zone/effect that has that card top that particular zone cannot track it if it moves to another zone. "You may cast that card for as long as it remains exiled." is the current Gatherer text for the card. If it is anywhere else, you cannot cast it, the only exception being:
10/4/2004 If the Cauldron leaves the battlefield, you can still cast any cards it exiled as though they were in your hand. You just no longer have access to the mana you charged the Cauldron with.
The best way to think about it is that ice cauldron counter is variable - it's value varies in terms of what mana it gives and it is set when a card is exiled with it. So if you activate the first ability and pay 2UBR to exile Nekusar, the Mindrazer, the counter will basically say "add 2UBR to your pool and you may only use to cast Nekusar".
Again, I advise you not to inflict brain pain to anyone by using Ice Cauldron.
March 2, 2015 5:21 a.m.
Thanks for your help! Btw Im trying to make a deck that only inflicts brain pain. It will literally be the only win con lol.
March 2, 2015 5:28 a.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #6
One more point to help clarify how things like this work:
If one ability on an object exiles a card, and a second ability on the same object references "the exiled card" or "cards exiled with (this object)", then the abilities are linked abilities, and the second one only refers to cards currently in the exile zone due to being put there by the first ability. It doesn't mean cards that have been moved out of the exile zone, nor cards in exile for different reasons.
Boza says... Accepted answer #1
No, since Ice Cauldron does not see the card in the Exile zone and cannot track it outside of it.
You cannot use the first ability (referencing gatherer text) if IC already has a counter.
If there is a card exiled by IC and still in the exile zone, and you have 11 counters on IC, you can use 1 to cast the card out of exile. Afterwards, the other 10 counters are useless, since the mana cannot be used for anything else and the second ability cannot be activated at all, since there is no card exiled by the first one.
I think this was all, tell me if I missed anything.
Friends should not let friends suffer through Ice Cauldron, this card is silver-border territory in terms of the rules catastrophe it is.
March 2, 2015 4:45 a.m.