Modern Horizons 2 Spoilers

Spoilers, Rumors, and Speculation forum

Posted on May 9, 2021, 1:39 p.m. by DemonDragonJ

Some cards from Modern Horizons 2 have been revealed, and, as far as I know, they were revealed by a legitimate source, so I feel comfortable with providing a link to them, here.

I am not happy that WotC is bringing the original Counterspell to modern, since it was always associated with the vintage and legacy formats, and there is even a rumor that Stifle is being reprinted in this set, so that makes me even more displeased about the set.

However, I do like both diamond lion and brainstone, because those cards are nice references to older cards in the game; in particular, the lion shows that WotC is experimenting with ways to circumvent the reserved list, without actually violating it. The fact that brainstone's ability costs 2 mana to activate means that I likely shall not use it; I understand that moving a colored effect to a colorless card means that it needs to be more expensive, but making it literally three times as expensive is simply too much for the card to become widespread, in my mind. If the stone cost only 1 mana to activate (in addition to the 1 mana to cast it), I could have accepted it, but it simply is too expensive, as it is, in my opinion.

Also, I think that is is awesome that WotC is printing an enchantment land, after having declared that it was unlikely that they would ever do so; does this mean that there is now some hope for additional artifact lands, in the future?

Let me now open the discussion to everyone; what are your hopes and speculations for Modern Horizons 2?

Mtg_Mega_Nerds says... #2

Diamond Lion is going in my Muldrotha deck immediately :)

May 9, 2021 1:42 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #3

Mtg_Mega_Nerds, do not forget that both the lion and brainstone can be reanimated with Sun Titan , so those will definitely be awesome combos.

I was really hoping that the return of the old borders would be only for Time Spiral Remastered, so I am very displeased that they are returning for this set, and I also really wish that WotC had commissioned new artwork for the fetchlands; why does WotC continue to use the same artwork for certain cards?

May 9, 2021 1:46 p.m.

Icbrgr says... #4

I am excited that Counterspell is coming to modern but I think I am gonna stick with Remand / Spell Snare in my Jeskai tempo deck.... but I'm happy for the control players.

May 9, 2021 1:51 p.m.

Mtg_Mega_Nerds says... #5

I am glad that my casual decks with counterspell in it will now be modern legal!

May 9, 2021 1:54 p.m.

legendofa says... #6

I have three from Tempest and two from Mercadian Masques . They will see use.

May 10, 2021 11:30 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #7

I just realized that, with the way that Urza's Saga is worded, its third ability cannot find Lotus Bloom , Mox Tantalite , or any other artifact that has no mana cost or a colored mana cost; why did WotC do that? Would the land really have been that overpowered if it said "mana value of 0 or 1?"

Also, does the existence of that land mean that there may be more enchantment lands, or possibly even more artifacts lands? This set is legal for modern, but not standard, and the Storm Scale is only for standard, not other formats.

May 17, 2021 8:52 p.m.

legendofa says... #8

My guess is that Urza's Saga was worded that way to prevent it from accidentally breaking something in the future, not because it's broken now. Reshape can find an artifact with a null mana cost, and artifact interactions and cheating around mana costs tend to be monitored very closely these days. (Say "I love Ravager and Hogaak " in a crowded room and see what happens.) I think they're afraid having two of this kind of effect would restrict what null-cost artifacts they might print a few years down the road.

For the second question, I'm going to say it's a test case, and should not be considered a definite precedent. Five of the six artifact lands are still banned in modern, again because they're essentially null-cost artifacts. Enchantments don't have the same stigma, but the potential for abuse is still there.

Alos, putting additional permanent types onto lands creates some rules headaches and unintuitive play. Does it count as casting a spell, since it's an enchantment? Can Dryad Arbor tap for mana the turn it comes out, or does it have summoning sickness? Does it count as the land drop for the turn? How does it work if given flash? (For the record, no, it has summoning sickness, yes, and you still can't play a land on an opponent's turn or play more than one land per turn.) Adding more multi-permanent-type lands would start to normalize these rules for experienced players, but it's another barrier for what's already a complex and complicated game to learn.

May 17, 2021 10:18 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #9

legendofa, that makes sense.

Mark Rosewater posted a teaser for this set, so I shall provide a link, so that we may speculate about it.

May 18, 2021 8:15 p.m.

legendofa says... #10

I see Skeleton Shaman, I'm in. I don't even really care what it does.

Now all I need are Samurai, Plants, and more Skeletons.

May 18, 2021 8:23 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #11

My guess that the "legendary character best known for having his name on a powerful card (that’s been banned) finally gets a legendary creature" is Tourach; Ashnod is not eligible because Mark Rosewater said "his," and Ashnod is female, although Ashnod could possibly still have a card in this set, nevertheless.

May 18, 2021 10:07 p.m.

"A character that first appeared in a Magic novel finally becomes a legendary creature": Kyodai maybe?

"a Frog twenty-six years in the making": HYPE!!!"

"a planeswalker from the past that has previously only had a legendary creature card": Leaving aside silver-bordered cards, this could be Urza.

"Legendary Creature – Squirrel Warrior": Even more HYPE!!!!!

May 19, 2021 2:49 p.m.

legendofa says... #13

I'll put in a longshot guess. One of the six-letter mechanics will be Ripple, as seen on the Surging cards and Thrumming Stone .

May 19, 2021 3:01 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #14

The MTG wiki believes that the legendary creature -> planeswalker character is Dakkon Blackblade , probably based off the art of him. They've also pinned down Jump-Start as one of the censored mechanics.

• a character that first appeared in a Magic novel finally becomes a legendary creature

Tocasia, Urza and Mishra's teacher?

May 19, 2021 4:02 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #15

Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar qualifies too I think

May 19, 2021 4:16 p.m.

legendofa says... #16

Two four-letter mechanics: Raid and Riot come to mind. Any others?

May 19, 2021 4:21 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #17

legendofa, what about dash?

May 19, 2021 8:46 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #18

epic too

May 20, 2021 11:55 a.m.

Coward_Token says... #19

(I doubt they're actually going to make another epic card.)

I wonder what mechanical identity Dakkon will have as a supposed PW? "Lands matter" feels weird in Esper and Equipment is stepping into Nahiri's territory.

May 20, 2021 5:05 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #20

Weekly MTG Show

May 20, 2021 6:25 p.m.

jethstriker says... #21

While Unmarked Grave is definitely a welcome addition to reanimation archetype in Modern, I feel this is a really watered down version of Entomb (conditional searching on top of higher CMC and slower Sorcery speed). I think they missed the opportunity to just introduce Entomb itself in Modern. With all the efficient Graveyard removal legal in the format, do they still think Entomb will cause problems?

May 20, 2021 7:34 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #22

The reprint of Cabal Coffers is very nice, since that cards is very expensive, although I really wish that that card had been kept only in vintage, legacy, and EDH, and not introduced to modern.

May 20, 2021 8:39 p.m.

legendofa says... #23

No mindlessly broken cards yet, that I can see. Hopefully no new candidates for the Banlist of Fame. Unfortunately, there's also nothing that really jumps out at me as something I would go out of my way for. Unmarked Grave is nice, I'll probably mess around with that.

Let's go Skeleton Shaman! (If it's Zombie tribal, I'm going to smash something.)

May 20, 2021 9:23 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #24

Profane tutor is very nice, but I feel that black tutors should always incur a cost beyond mana, such as payment of life or sacrificing of a creature, because that is a central philosophy of black, trading one resource for another.

May 20, 2021 10:37 p.m.

Flooremoji says... #25

Here are my thoughts on the set so far:

Cabal Coffers reprint: Eh. Not like it's going to do anything in modern. Gotta please the edh players I guess, even in modern's premier set?

Counterspell reprint: No opinions on this one.

Yursi: More edh stuff. If it had haste it might be good enough, but as is it's not worth it.

Flametounge Yearling: Excelent design, might even be playable but I'm not placing any bets, esp since it'll shoot itself with no other legal targets. I imagine that'll get some people who weren't around when ftk was legal.

Thrasta, Tempests Roar: I mean... I'm not terribly excited about this card. Seems a bit strong, but it might be fine. Savage Summoning and Vivien, Champion of the Wilds are cards that exist but I doubt Thrasta alone would be enough to justify them.

Unmarked Grave: It's balanced, not much else to say there.

Profane Tutor: Possibly playable, but with ssg ban I'm not sure which decks even need this effect.

Grief: I like Unmask . What I don't like is turn one shock Godless Shrine evoke Grief, Ephemerate .

Rishadin Dockhand: I am a fan of this card. Seems like an easy include into merfolk decks, I don't know where else it will find a home though.

Timeless Dragon: It seems a bit slow for modern, bomb in limited I'd imagine. It's not unplayable though.

Dakkon, Shadow Slayer: I feel like I am underestimating this card whenever I look at it, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's powerful.

Diamond Lion is a great callback, it's not busted but it just might see play.

Brainstone is meh, just the way I like it. Don't underestimate it in artifact based decks though.

Urza's Saga: I wish this card didn't get printed, but here we are. At least playable in modern by my calculations (thank goodness it can't find Lotus Bloom ), but in formats with artifacts like Sol Ring it's pretty damn powerful, and it's also pretty free in many cases.

May 20, 2021 11:51 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #26

I would not mind reprints of Phyrexian Tyranny , Iron Maiden , and Ivory Tower in this set, mainly because I need them for a deck that I am building.

May 22, 2021 4:23 p.m.

Named_Tawyny says... #27

Iron Maiden seems like a Black Vise reprint?

May 22, 2021 11:47 p.m.

Named_Tawyny says... #28

Oh wow, looks like they nerfed Black Vise in Oracle...

May 22, 2021 11:48 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #29

Named_Tawyny, first, the main advantage that Iron Maiden has over Black Vise is that it affects all opponents, not merely one; second, how was Black Vise "nerfed," in your mind?

May 23, 2021 9:21 a.m.

Named_Tawyny says... #30

DemonDragonJ, it was nerfed because the Oracle text makes it only affect one opponent now.

Both Maiden and Vise refer to 'opponent' on the original card text (fairly normal for the time), but the Oracle texts now keep Maiden hitting multiple opponents, while they did a functional edit for Vise instructing you to choose one.

I'd call that a pretty significant nerfing.

May 23, 2021 11:47 a.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #31

Meteor Crater , Homeward Path , and Reflecting Pool all very much needs reprints, so I would like to see them, in this set.

Named_Tawyny, yes, that is definitely a significant decrease in power.

May 23, 2021 2:49 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #32

Squirrel tribal in general: It's very silly that they're black in non-silver border but OK

Chatterfang: Not really a fan of landwalking, I hope they had a reason beyond flavor to include it. Anyway, it's Squirrel Visitation , except it doesn't specify creature tokens!

May 24, 2021 12:25 p.m.

Mother of god, the bastards did it! They really did it!

May 24, 2021 12:52 p.m.

Man, I never expected actual squirrel tribal support in MH2. This is fantastic.

Coward_Token - If you were playing Standard back during Odyssey block, you wouldn't think Squirrels are that silly haha.

May 24, 2021 1:03 p.m.

Named_Tawyny says... #35

Coward_Token, the other BIG difference is that Divine Visitation is an 'instead'. With Chatterfang, you get the tokens IN ADDITION TO your original tokens.

May 24, 2021 1:10 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #36

I get Squirrels in general, it's ones which I think takes it a little too far

May 24, 2021 1:10 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #37

I guess I should have said Parallel Squirrels instead

May 24, 2021 1:12 p.m.

Can we please appreciate that Chatterfang can effing kill an Emrakul if sacrifice enough squirrels?

On a side-note, the card has a ridiculous pre-order post. What do you think where it will end up? Sth. between 10 and 5 bucks?

May 24, 2021 2 p.m.

I can't wait to build around it!

May 24, 2021 2:47 p.m.

legendofa says... #40

There's now a pretty good selection of Squirrels, Otters, and a couple of Mouse creatures. Add on a couple of Badgers, and a Redwall theme deck starts to form. It needs more mice, though.

May 24, 2021 4:45 p.m.

Lanzo493 says... #41

I was hoping for some GB Elves support. All of these squirrel cards destroyed that hope, though.

May 24, 2021 4:53 p.m.

DemonDragonJ says... #42

Ravenous squirrel is awesome, and I cannot believe that it is only an uncommon; I hope that I can make room in my decks for it.

Fractured sanity is far too powerful for a mere three mana; either it should have had a higher cost or milled fewer cards.

I really like the white/green sword; I had personally been hoping for it to have populate, but the effect that it does have is also quite nice; I would like to put it into my Chulane deck, since that deck relies upon creatures with abilities that trigger when they enter the battlefield, but I do not believe that I can remove any cards from it to make room for it.

May 24, 2021 6:32 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #43

Void Mirror is really harsh at MV 2; guessing a big reason for its inclusion is Tron hate but it obviously also stops free spells in the vein of Lavinia, Azorius Renegade

May 25, 2021 12:30 a.m.

seshiro_of_the_orochi - I think Chatterfang will likely keep a hefty price tag for a little while because of the memes in commander. Plus with the addition of Squirrel Sovereign and Squirrel Sanctuary, there is an actual squirrel modern deck now. Not sure if it will be strong, but again, for the memes, people will build it. I do think ultimately it will probably sit between $5-$10 though (that's where CardKingdom currently has it priced). All I know is I totally will be picking one up when the price drops a little. My squirrel deck has been waiting for this commander for years.

Coward_Token - Squirrels are kind of a blank canvas. Until Ikoria, there were only 2 black bordered squirrel creatures and 9 (I think) related squirrel token produces. So as long as the cards were base green, they really could go with whatever secondary color they wanted. I think WotC went with because of Unstable where squirrels were /. Also, I think there is an element of flavor with since squirrels are considered vermin akin to rats in many parts of the world.

I am very intrigued by Serra's Emissary for my Hofri Ghostforge deck. Being able to give myself and creatures protection from instants and creatures at the same time ( Panharmonicon or Anointed Procession ) in a game of commander seems worth the 7 mana or a single reanimation spell.

Spoilers for this set have certainly started off with a bang. My only complaint is that the old bordered cards can only be obtained via collector's boosters.

May 25, 2021 10:19 a.m.

sergiodelrio says... #45

Random rant:

I swear if they keep spoiling >4 cmc cards I'm gonna lose it completely. CMC 5 or more cards without cheating or alt cost / cost reduction abilities have absolutely no place in a set dedicated to the 'turn 4' format unless they win the game on the spot. It's Strixhaven all over again.



May 25, 2021 10:35 a.m.

Correction to my previous post. The old border MH1 reprints can only be found in collector boosters. I think the other old borders can be found in draft boosters. It's all rather nebulous though so I could still be wrong.

May 25, 2021 11:15 a.m.

Coward_Token says... #47

Lucid Dreams: A nice late game self-mill payoff; I think Treasure Cruise is a fair comparsion. At a max it can draw 8 for 5, which is obviously good but getting checking the box for Tribal or even Planeswalker isn't far from guaranteed in EDH at least. Still, 6 isn't bad either, compare Tidings . (I wonder if making it Tribal — Lhurgoyf was ever considered.)

Late to Dinner: Functional Breath of Life reprint that comes with a snack, not super dramatic

Young Necromancer: flickering shenaningans with this can probably be interesting, but I still feel it's not quite as cool as the OG Pyro

Garth One-Eye: lol OK, at least they didn't keep the ugly original version. Go stick Pemmin's Aura on him, make too many lotuses, then draw your library. Repeatable Regrowth is probably abuse able too.

Grist, the Hungering Tide: what in the ever-loving fuck is that?! It randomly being an off-screen Insect is really weird but I understand that it matters for e.g. Vesperlark

May 25, 2021 12:48 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #48

Aeve, Progenitor Ooze: So each Aeve enters alone one after another right? Meaning the copies get extra counters in a Fibonacci sequence (first one sees the OG Aeve and gets one, second one sees OG & first one and gets two...). Anyway, not that excited as far as EDH Ooze tribal goes

Kitchen Imp: eheheheh (possible Asmor sign?)

May 25, 2021 3:12 p.m.

Coward_Token says... #49

Zabaz: Did they put those abilities on it to make it a boros commander? Because it really seems underwhelming in EDH. (Wow! Hardened Scales for all of 13 cards!)

Chef's Kiss: Okay calling it now, RB Asmor incoming! Anyway, red Imp's Mischief isn't bad for protecting your commander

(Oh, and important thing about Grist I missed)

May 25, 2021 3:58 p.m.

Yeah Grist could be pretty interesting, especially since it can be your commander.

May 25, 2021 4:55 p.m.

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