Death & Taxes vs. Elves?

Legacy forum

Posted on June 12, 2015, 10:15 a.m. by smackjack

A friend just bought a legacy elf deck and im curious how my Death & Taxes deck will do in the matchup. Never played against elves. Is there anything D&T plays that are particularly good against elves? What sideboard tech are prefered in the matchup?

Thanks

Boza says... #2

Elves is one of the worst matchups for D&T, if not the worst. Probably turn 1/2 combos like Belcher are worse, but elves is just horrendous regardless (it is something like 30-70 if not less).

Basically, they have a lot of I win buttons that you cannot disrupt like Progenitus and Behemoth and in the case you stop that, you get crushed by smaller cards like ezuri.

The most critical card to have is by far Containment Priest to stop Natural Order turn 3 wins and to a lesser extent Phyrexian Revoker though you cannot name all the mana elves.

There are very few matchups for D&T like these. Consider SBing Ratchet Bomb or that 3 mana -1/-1 to non-whites instant. They will help a lot also Pithing Needle will help with Gaea's Cradle.

June 12, 2015 10:27 a.m.

TehCoopeh says... #3

Ethersworn Canonist helps a great deal, too. Just gotta hope you can get it out fast enough.

June 12, 2015 10:28 a.m.

smackjack says... #4

Thanks :). That doesnt sound good. We are a really small playgroup, so i will play against elves alot :(. Spirit of the Labyrinth should be good, against glimpse.. And i have it in main. Maybe one Gut Shot in the sideboard?

Is it worth splashing black for Zealous Persecution and Engineered Plague? I have one Dark Confidant im not using that could go mainboard for some added speed.. Im not too keen on adding a colour tho, so only if it would make the deck considerably better :)

June 12, 2015 10:44 a.m.

smackjack says... #5

Zealous and plague for side if that wasnt clear :)

June 12, 2015 10:45 a.m.

FreddyFlash311 says... #6

Boza doesn't cradle count as a mana ability for the needle? Didn't think that works but I could be wrong.

Needle on wyrewood symbiote can be effective.

June 12, 2015 10:53 a.m.

EndStepTop says... #7

It's not worth the splash, to keep using Port/Wasteland you strain your mana a lot. Honestly it's a game of "can your hatebears be the right ones at the right time?" You could have Spirit/Cannonist but the Elves player just windmill slams NO for Craterhoof, or you have Priest and they just go off with cradle/glimpse.

June 12, 2015 10:55 a.m.

TheHroth says... #8

I would rather use Zealous Persecution personally. It is good against more than just elves, such as Delver and any deck with Young Pyromancer.

Splashing would mean cutting hate lands though and I'm not fond of that idea. Wasteland is too valuable.

June 12, 2015 10:56 a.m. Edited.

smackjack says... #9

I run 9 plains. If i instead run 2 plains 5 fetches and 2 duals i should be fine if its only for a couple of sideboard cards? Running 2 plains is not that bad, i do have vial and most of the deck cost 2 anyways.

Zealous persecution is great in the mirror aswell, altho i expose myself to search hate and wasteland when playing in the mirror

June 12, 2015 11:05 a.m. Edited.

mathimus55 says... #10

Zealous Persecution, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and Containment Priest and your biggest players in the matchup. If you can get a priest down early and protect it you at least can set yourself up in a good spot for when they try to win. After that Brimaz, King of Oreskos or Mirran Crusader with a jitte on them are your quickest ways to win. Another Card I've found to be a fantastic clock against elves is Sword of War and Peace. Their Glimpse of Nature keeps their hands fairly full and you can realistically 1 shot them with Mirran Crusader because of it.

June 12, 2015 11:07 a.m.

EndStepTop says... #11

If you're hellbent on splashing, look up Dark Maverick it would be stronger than W/B DnT.

June 12, 2015 11:26 a.m.

JuicyPVP says... #12

"also Pithing Needle will help with Gaea's Cradle." - Boza

Pithing needle doesn't stop Cradle... Does it???

June 12, 2015 11:58 a.m.

smackjack says... #13

No, Pneedle doesnt stop cradle, its a mana ability..

Is Holy Light something to sideboard? Or is 3 mana too slow?

June 12, 2015 12:29 p.m.

kyuuri117 says... #14

Mirran Crusader is the only real threat in the matchup. Anything else can be stopped with Wirewood Symbiote + Elf or Quirion Ranger + Dryad Arbor, and the fliers generally aren't a fast enough clock.

Post sideboard, elves is going to bring in progenitus, and abrupt decay's to stop Cannonist and Priest. Thoughtseize's are also great since elves isn't trying to hit a critical mass post sideboard, we just want to land progenitus as fast as possible, so stripping out a priest or cannonist is very nice on turn two or three before a NO.

And no, pithing needle doesn't stop Cradle.

June 12, 2015 12:33 p.m.

mathimus55 says... #15

Yea, Flickerwisp and Serra Avenger need help, your equipment need to either kill them fast or do lots of removal. SoFI doesn't hit enough targets like a jitte can so definitely fetch that up first with SFM too

June 12, 2015 1:52 p.m.

Boza says... #16

Sorry for confusing everyone with that needle line. My bad.

June 12, 2015 4:07 p.m.

Nothing to apologize about. IMO stuff like that is nice because I appreciate refreshing my understanding of various interactions with cards, you know?

June 12, 2015 4:43 p.m.

If they're on a slower hand, you can often take over games with your Jitte. Vial->Jitte->Equip Jitte is about the best line that doesn't involve priests and revoker, but those will still be your best bets.

June 12, 2015 7:03 p.m.

smackjack says... #19

I added 2 Chalice of the Void to my sideboard.

Now, what i would side in against elves would be:
2x Chalice of the Void
1x Sunlance
1x Gut Shot
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Spirit of the Labyrinth (for a total of 3)
1x Enlightened Tutor
then maybe 1x Council's Judgment for Progenitus and 1x Cataclysm to reset the game.

I would side out 4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, 2x Mangara of Corondor, 1x Flickerwisp and 1x Brimaz, King of Oreskos

July 1, 2015 7:41 a.m.

This discussion has been closed