Does The Gitrog Monster build itself?
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on May 29, 2016, 9:10 p.m. by RegisteredDecksOffender
I think I can speak for most of us Commander nerds when I say that when we saw The Gitrog Monster spoiled back in April all of our minds started racing, and our deck brewing engines started revving. I mean, this card is unmistakably powerful and filled with flavor as a Commander.
However, now that the initial card lust has worn off I have started to notice a crippling theme.. Most, if not all decks with Gitrog at the helm seem to do the same thing, use roughly the same cards, and handle the same way.
I will even admit, I have a list that I've been tinkering with.. but as I look over other user's lists I see that about 70% or so of each deck lists looks pretty much the same.
I know it's too bold to say there is only one way to build The Monster, but is building a list with him (it, she?) really that simple and linear?
Does The Gitrog Monster as a Commander suffer the same fate as say, Nekusar, the Mindrazer?As I understand, good ol' Uncle Nekusar lists start with adding wheel effects, some pain from drawing effects, lands, and maybe some tutoring and countering and have been known to grow tiring to play, having most of your games play out the same way.
Is this too bold of me to ask? Is there anyone else who feels this way, or perhaps feels the opposite about my inquiry?
Postmortal_Pop says... #3
Honestly I hadn't even taken this into consideration because I'm not a big fan of hypno toad. Looking over a few lists, I see what you mean. I personally have a nekusar deck myself and I agree, every deck I see is basically the same.
Like nekusar, I feel that it comes from having a very presice ability. Nekusar can't do combat well, his effect is good enough that most players aren't gonna play him just for the color, and why wouldn't you exploit that ability.
May 29, 2016 9:46 p.m.
It's little wonder then, that I find so few generals attractive. I knew Wizards was doing that. I thought I was the only one.
That said, there are a few legendary creatures printed recently that don't build themselves, like the Origins Flip 'walkers. Also, it is worth noting that there are some legendary creatures that build themselves before Wizards endorsed the format, like Kumano, Master Yamabushi.
May 29, 2016 9:48 p.m.
rockleemyhero says... #5
Phaetion absolutely true. It's all about the older legends man. Wizards poorly warped the format with their inclusions of broken commanders such as derevi, meren, prossh, oloro, etc. Sure there were some broken commanders before such as arcum and azami but these guys are ones that can go 3 vs 1 and not sweat too bad. And to bring it back to the main point, most of those newer generals are all pretty much the exact same deck lists as well.
May 29, 2016 11:34 p.m.
I was just thinking...when do you guys think that legendary creatures started to be more build around? Obviously back in 2011 but could it have been much sooner than that?
sigh There are only a few legendary creatures nowadays that aren't pushed for EDH. At least Chandra isn't pushed for the format.
May 29, 2016 11:41 p.m.
RegisteredDecksOffender says... #7
Yeah, I honestly feel as though WOTC has kind of dropped the ball on legendary creatures as of late. Not on the scale of power and play-ability, but it seems like the ones they release are more targeted towards EDH.. yet they fall short and are too linear in what you can do with them..
I almost miss looking at a legendary creature and think to myself "Hmm, what can I do with this?"
It almost seems like they kind of spell it out for you now days. :/
May 30, 2016 12:26 a.m.
UpperDeckerTaco says... #8
I have to disagree with you a little about The Gitrog Monster. And here's my reasons:
1) It's playing Green and Black. Most, if not all, green decks run some form of ramp and this deck fuels on it like the rest of green. And green AND black is the graveyard shenanigans guru. This allows you to either go value G/B, reanimator, or you can even go Big. Hell you could even go combo.
2) Gitrog itself is enough for the deck to thrive on either strategy. The fact that it has ramp and card draw build into it, and it's a very big body, it can play itself with value alone. Yeah, Crucible of Worlds, Life from the Loam and cards like Drownyard Temple should be played in it. But it has a lot more to offer. If you go straight recursion based with reanimator effects, you'll be using more tutors in sync with your ramp. If you go just value, you'll be using creatures and other cards alone that are just good on their own and Gitrog is an added bonus. If you go big, you will ramp, and ramp hard. If you go combo with Gitrog, which is possible because of the colors it's in, you play to the combo and use Gitrog to help Grind through your deck.
I see where you are coming from, but it probably just stems from people wanting to do one thing with Gitrog because they see it as best value. A prime example of this aspect is when Narset, Enlightened Master was first released into the EDH world, people wanted free extra turns and combat phases...but you could go the tokens route or take it the way I did and just jam superfriends and cast them all for free off of her. But players want to go towards the norm of what everyone else is doing.
May 30, 2016 1:06 a.m.
@TheBoraxKid I think wizard's is responding to the populus demanding certain commander themes nowadays, though toad wasn't really a child of that (besides the few who wanted a frog legend?)
But General Tarzi is an example of that, The culmination of all these people demanding a ally general, who is not bad, per say, but just not interesting enough for me to take the 5 color ally route. I'd take a different one to be honest.
And again. The werewolf legend that will totally be a thing in the eldritch moon set is also an example of wizard's trying to please everyone, I guess. R/G wolf EDH will be a thing after the next set i imagine.
May 30, 2016 2:03 a.m.
Dredge4life says... #10
I don't think the ww is coming, but I agree with Gitrog. As for generals being built for commander, I think it started in 2012, and I don't think it's as bad as the consensus seems to be.
June 1, 2016 5:38 p.m.
MonoGreenKing says... #11
I just think the decks are Titania, Protector of Argoth decks with black added into it.
June 2, 2016 9:22 a.m.
JohnnyBaggins says... #12
I'm pretty much on board with everyone here. The Gitrog Monster is a fairly straight-forward build.
June 2, 2016 12:23 p.m.
Deckologist says... #13
He is very straight forward. He says play lands, dredge a little bit, durdle durdle, maybe reanimate something, win with a giant jarad. All 4 Gitrog decks at my LGS play the same way but that's only because he is so tunnel-visioned on such things which is also my problem with a lot of commanders. With the exception of maybe 2 Golgari generals they all have pretty much the same strategy. The same is true for most other color combinations with jund being number one on the tunnel vision train.
So yes, the deck does build itself because building it any other way would be pointless.
June 2, 2016 11:07 p.m.
Ok, so what SOI legends don't build themselves? Perhaps others lurking in this thread could get some ideas.
June 2, 2016 11:10 p.m.
Deckologist says... #15
I have to agree with the others in the fact that they all pretty much build themselves. As much as it pains me to say this, the only commander in y eyes that doesn't have a definitive course of action would be Avacyn but her deck is pretty much like any other Boros deck so I guess that evens things out. One thing we do have to remember is that legendary creatures are printed primarily for potential standard use first, then modern, then legacy, then commander.
June 2, 2016 11:20 p.m.
JohnnyBaggins says... #16
Phaetion I, for one, would not have an proper idea how to build Archangel Avacyn Flip. Might be because I simply don't play Boros, ever. Might also be because Avacyn doesn't really seem like a fantastic commander to me. She looks awesome in the 99 but as the Commander? No real idea how to approach that.
rockleemyhero says... #2
I agree with you. And frankly, many of the commanders printed these days suffer that same fate, ever since wizards started backing up the format imo. The older legends generally lead to more creativity and less streamlinedness as a whole, Wizards has been trying "too hard" with recent legendary creatures. I'm sure someone will disagree with me but that's just what I've seen and my opinion over the past few years. See meren as well
May 29, 2016 9:38 p.m.