Posted on Jan. 18, 2021, 12:18 a.m. by TheDarkPlague
I’m looking to build a new deck I’m used to playing more combo based deck so I’d rather go for something more aggressive.
Few people recommended Voltron to me but I feel I’d be at a disadvantage in a 4+ player game. Removal and counter spell are heavy and it feels like I would spend most of my time recasting my ever increasing cmc commander.
Am I missing something in voltron? Is there anything else that would be considered aggro?
Is artifact possible in aggro?
the biggest issue with voltron is that you generally show your hand pretty quickly and so you don't get as many opportunities to blindside an opponent, which is the easiest way to take a player out.
If you did want to build a voltron commander for a casual meta, I really like Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief. She's a bit costly to play, but the fact that she's got evasion, removal on a stck and a way to self buff makes her pretty good. Plus you get black for tutoring whatever you want. I played a version of her a few years ago and I think there was only 20 something black mana symbols in the deck, the rest was artifacts (if you want to play artifacts).
When it comes to aggro, I think that the most effective way to play is to go square (as opposed to going either wide or tall). Something like Edgar Markov is really good, as you typically are spitting out a bunch of tokens but they quickly find themselves as 4/4s or 5/5s. In this, you might not go as wide as a saproling deck might, but your vamps will typically out damage an army of small tokens while still providing an intimidating presence against larger creatures.
It is important to distinguish though - are you playing primarily 4 player games or are you playing 5/6/7+ player games? becuase a 4 player deck will operate MUCH differently than a 5 player deck. Same goes with a 3 player deck. 3 player commander is an entirely differnt beast than 4 player. But don't try to build for all these scenarios, you need to know what you primarily play and then tailor the cards for that.
January 18, 2021 12:45 a.m.
In situation's like these, I can't help but suggest either Goreclaw, Terror of Qal Sisma (which basically is mono storm) or Moraug, Fury of Akoum (mono Landfall with mad ways to branch out). For both commanders, there are decks on my profile. Maybe take a look?
January 18, 2021 6:47 a.m.
Hmm combo based agro that is not voltron dependent?
Korvold, Fae-Cursed King
(burn on etb & burn on sac easy to loop)
Kykar, Wind's Fury
(Spellslinger burn aggro, easy to combo)
Marisi, Breaker of the Coil
(Token agro, with acccess to flicker and populate combo loops)
As for artifact aggro
Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer
Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer
Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain
There is also alot of equipment based agro decks i didnt list any becouse they are mostly voltron dependent
I have a friend thats currently running Kediss, Emberclaw Familiar & Ardenn, Intrepid Archaeologist
Its definitely pod worthy voltron
January 18, 2021 7:50 a.m.
January 18, 2021 7:56 a.m.
RambIe: That seems kind of bad - Kediss's owner would take a bunch of damage too.
January 18, 2021 9:09 a.m.
I had a lil Rishkar, Peema Renegade deck that ramped fast, and would combo out around turns 4/5 if given good enough gas or time. Basically, drop dorks, drop threats, and tap your little buddies for absurd amounts of mana into an X-spell that overwhelmed opponents. It was best for 1v1's, but did ok in multiplayer matchups, only needing an additional turn or two to guarantee the W. Maybe that'd interest you?
January 18, 2021 10:13 a.m.
Ramble I never said I wanted to avoid voltron. I just had concerns about the strategy in a multiplayer game.
January 18, 2021 11:16 a.m.
Jeskai works a lot better than boros. I have the godo/helm combo and feast/famine sword with Aggravated Assault combo in case I get stuck. Blue counter magic and draw is a life saver.
Having partners in voltron is invaluable. Akiri is the go to and when she gets too expensive to recast or I want flying, I switch to ishai. They can also both be out and kill two people at once, but I prefer to be more conservative.
January 18, 2021 12:24 p.m.
enpc your correct he did take damage as well, but he hit first so he got a lead on life totals
TheDarkPlague the controller does not take damage from Kediss, Emberclaw Familiar but its owner does when the control is passed around the table becouse of Assault Suit
over all that play was not game ending, but it was insane enough to be worthy of mentioning
January 18, 2021 1:31 p.m.
a voltron commander should have hexproof anyway. so the best voltron commander would be Uril, the Miststalker. i can't imagine trying to run voltron without a hexproof commander.
January 18, 2021 1:48 p.m.
January 18, 2021 2:10 p.m. Edited.
RiotRunner789: i'm not sure what you're trying to say with that sentence fragment. if you're trying to say that you can get away with a non hexproof commander because of that stuff, then i hard disagree. i don't wanna be forced to hold up mana every turn for counter spells when i could use that mana to drop another aura on a hexproof commander. i'm also not gonna rely on drawing specific (and overcosted) auras or equipment just to protect my commander when i can get hexproof baked in for free.
January 18, 2021 2:15 p.m.
Xianling69: Sure, its great, but hexproof isn't going to save you from everything, and there are ways around it. Limiting options to "what works best" completely overlooks factors like meta and playstyle.
TheDarkPlague: What are some commanders you are thinking about building?
January 18, 2021 4:45 p.m.
I mean, if we are just talking about Uril, the Miststalker, he has his own baked in problems.
Having hexproof to start is great but auras in general are terrible. One Wrath of God and you're down a ton of cards and now you have to cast a 7 cost creature without haste. You might as well make the argument that you shouldn't have a voltron commander without built in indestructible.
I think, you are better off with whatever voltron commander fits your playgroup/playstyle. You don't need hexproof to start, but yes it would be helpful. There are plenty of commanders such as Feather, the Redeemed, Skullbriar, the Walking Grave and Rograkh, Son of Rohgahh that are plenty powerful without the built-in hexproof due to either there cheap cost, powerful abilities, built-in card advantage, keyword soup, et cetera.
January 18, 2021 5:05 p.m.
I would say if you are looking for just unkillable, play mono green voltron w/ Thrun, the Last Troll. Hexproof, Can't Be Countered, and Regenerate to counter some board wipes makes him pretty powerful in my opinion.
January 18, 2021 5:25 p.m.
Also, to answer your question, Voltron, and aggro in general, tends to be a bit weaker on average, but there are definitely powerful options, and you tend to be a threat in the game whether you win or not.
January 18, 2021 5:28 p.m.
I say this in every post about aggressive decks (and budget decks, but for other reasons) in EDH, but Xenagos, God of Revels is great. It allows you to dodge the normal problem that aggro has of over extending into board wipes by allowing you to play a single other creature and turn it into a fast clock.
My personal favorite plays in my Xenagos deck include turn 3 Atarka, World Render for 24 flying trample. And 8 damage turn 5 into 32 damage turn 6 off of Heroes' Bane. I was threatening 112 damage turn 7, but the bane was wisely removed.
January 18, 2021 9:59 p.m.
1empyrean: i never said there werent ways around hexproof. thats kinda off topic of the point i was making. i never said hexproof was infallible, but it sure does make protecting your commander significantly easier than any of the suggestions provided thus far.
RiotRunner789: if you're that worried about board wipes then sure you can run equipment over auras, but that is way slower. if we can assume board wipes for creatures, we could also assume board wipes for artifacts since mana rocks are so common in commander. plus if everyone is getting wiped, that gives you time to re-build your board state. a lack of haste isn't that big of a deal. plus there are plenty of enchantress effects to draw cards while you're droppin aura's.
January 18, 2021 11:34 p.m.
I've seen Grand Warlord Radha be a very impressive aggro cmdr
January 19, 2021 midnight
Goblin tribal is aggro and combo But not artifact
January 19, 2021 12:05 a.m. Edited.
You know I did once go up against a mono blue deck that ran Sai, Master Thopterist as its cmdr. It was aggro it was combo and it was artifact. It was also very good. It was based off of the modern kci deck.
January 19, 2021 12:09 a.m.
1empyrean I have no idea yet. So far I haven’t found anything interesting.
January 19, 2021 7:08 a.m.
o so if voltron is on the table Greven, Predator Captain is the deadliest.
it can begin to remove players on turn 2
but it consistently removes players on turn 3
despite his lack of hex proof and indestructible he is the most competitive voltron commander you can get
down side is to build him properly can be expensive.
January 19, 2021 5:44 p.m.
p.s. before the debate about commander mechanics begins again
card draw wins games period
using life loss in black to pump your commander is just a bonus
January 19, 2021 5:54 p.m.
I joke, of course. He's lots of fun.
Im currently playing Jeska & Kondo EDH. Its fun, though my mana could use a little work.
January 19, 2021 6:40 p.m. Edited.
After spending the day on edhrec I did find something interesting.
I’m just not sure which one I like more than the other.
Akroma on one hand seems interesting for a keyword soup deck but I’m not sure with what I should use as a partner and running such a high cmc commander without green to ramp up and double up my mana seems risky. On the other hand Kathril, Aspect Warper would be interesting at the helm of the deck. Distributing plenty of keywords around and then placing akroma on the field is pretty good in my opinion but the guy at the store told me that Kathril was a very weak deck and I wouldn’t do much in a game.
As for Kamahl well in not sure what paring would work for him or even what to do with him. I thought either a bunch of 1-2cmc (human, elves maybe goblin) being pumped all at once with +3/+3 or a bunch of tokens being pumped was a funny idea.
January 19, 2021 6:44 p.m.
Kathril, Aspect Warper is another fun one. Its in great colors for recovering from disruption, too.
January 19, 2021 7:01 p.m.
i like the flavor of Akroma, Vision of Ixidor & Tana, the Bloodsower
in the command zone with a creature-less deck
naya gives excellent access to anthem, extra combat, ramp, draw, gy recovery, populate, and destruction mechanics
January 20, 2021 9:09 a.m.
Ramble actually after looking at the spoilers from Kaldheim I found two very promising commanders
January 21, 2021 8:25 a.m.
Fynn, the Fangbearer is going right into my Chevill, Bane of Monsters deathtouch deck because I like Black/green too much to go mono-green, but he's a solid choice without black. Green has lots of deathtouch available.
January 21, 2021 8:51 a.m.
1empyrean i did think about chevill but I really wanna see how he plays first. I’m gonna try yeva in the deck and flash fynn in after blocks are declared to kill people. Most people are gonna forget what he does most of the time and might not block a bunch of small deathtouch dudes.
January 21, 2021 9:09 a.m.
Sounds good. My Chevill's biggest weakness was that they often didn't block my things, So I wasn't too worried about that part of things. (It wasn't a big weakness with how I built my deck, though)
January 21, 2021 9:27 a.m.
I had a Glissa The Traitor Voltron deck. If you're not facing lots of exiling, Glissa does a good job of getting back equipment. You have to be real low-key with her at first though and then strike when the time is right. Usually when you could lay down and equip a few Swords.
January 21, 2021 10:14 a.m.
at first glance Fynn, the Fangbearer appears to seriously broken
not so much the death touch being turned into infect
but the fact that they printed this mechanic in green which has massive access to trample
"Any amount of damage dealt by a source with deathtouch is lethal damage."
"When an attacking creature with deathtouch and trample assigns combat damage, it only needs to assign 1 damage to each creature blocking it in order for the rest of the damage to be able to be assigned to the defending player or planeswalker."
January 21, 2021 2:04 p.m.
Ramble there was already deathtouch in green in standard.
January 21, 2021 2:07 p.m.
Xianling69 but it did not convert into 2 poison counters per creature that hits your opponent
5 creatures hitting you knocks you out of the game , add deathtouch with trample well its almost as good as just being unblockable
January 21, 2021 5:42 p.m.
Yea it's like someone was asking for aggro to be a thing in edh and this set knocked it out of the park
That legend will be one of the best aggro decks I think.
January 21, 2021 5:55 p.m. Edited.
take cards like Questing Beast & Bow of Nylea
with cards like Brawn & Primal Rage
while Fynn, the Fangbearer is on the board how difficult would it be to prevent the poison
no matter what is attacking you
January 21, 2021 6:04 p.m.
January 21, 2021 6:12 p.m.
Ramble triumph of the hordes is not in standard...same with brawn or primal rage. So im not sure where you’re going with this. Non standard decks designed around poison counters already had plenty of tools to begin with anyway, and infect decks in 60 card formats want creatures with infect, not a bunch of deathtouchers that then rely on you drawing another specific creature to support them
January 21, 2021 7:41 p.m.
Ramble how is he getting 3 poison counters if he’s blocking your 2/2 with a 12/12?
January 22, 2021 12:26 a.m.
1 damage is dealt to the 12/12 (lethal deathtouch), 1 damage (infect) tramples through to player, and Fynn adds 2 more.
January 22, 2021 12:29 a.m. Edited.
Xianling69 this is an edh topic standard is in a different forum
In edh this creature we are relying on is sitting in the command zone sooo its kinda consistent
January 22, 2021 7:46 a.m.
idk i could be wrong
but in an edh game having 5 disposable wienies coming at me as lethal seems like an issue
but then i consider that i have to block them with 6 creatures in order to survive
then i realize that all 6 of my creatures will die
and i wonder what will i block with next turn ?
i can't help but feel like this is a potential problem
but then add the low cmc required to assemble it
the availability of these mechanics even in a singleton format
and i cant help but think this is a problem i want to build and make worse
i mean could you imagine elfball built around Fynn, the Fangbearer ?
January 22, 2021 9:51 a.m.
Ramble if you're trying to play infect in commander, you should at least have black in your color identity. fynn can be in the 99, but i'd never try to build around poison counters in mono green. you'd get more deathtouchers as well if you add black.