Wolves who bench Eldrazi: It's Better Than Yours
Standard
SCORE: 378 | 285 COMMENTS | 56587 VIEWS | IN 286 FOLDERS
I just added sideboard suggestions if you want to run this deck and then splash a color on the sideboard.
April 8, 2016 8:59 p.m.
Rasanck,
Absolutely love your deck; +1 for sure!
I playtested against my Gruul Wolves (SOI Full Aggro), because I have zero shame about using your tech if it seems better! :D
Obviously I'm not as familiar with your deck, so apologize if I mulliganed stupid or whatever. But here are some thoughts, in no particular order:
- Game 1: Your deck won. 2x Timberpack Wolf and 2x Silverfur Partisan on the table at once is pretty insane. Scourge Wolf underperformed. Confront the Unknown was fun but did not impact the game.
- Game 2: Your deck won. Your deck played exactly as you would have hoped. Expedite + Confront the Unknown + 2x Might of the Masses on Zada/Silverfur = Swing for something like 93 damage with trample on turn 7. Ouch. Scourge Wolf underperformed again.
- Game 3: My deck won. Yours got a little Creature-screwed and mine played exactly as I would have hoped. Arlinn wrecked house.
Bottom line is it was a very close mirror, which in the end came down to luck of the initial hand. I'm increasingly convinced I want to raise the Ave CMC of my deck just a little. And if you haven't already, you might want to test Lambholt Pacifist Flip. I would have rather had her in hand than Scourge Wolf every single time.
Draw well!
April 8, 2016 9:45 p.m. Edited.
Hey, just in case you aren't already aware of it: You might want to check out this thread: All things Wolven
April 8, 2016 10:01 p.m.
Colorless_Demon says... #7
Very sweet deck
I've been play testing it against my Power Red deck.
Power Red won 4 of the 7 rounds i played (no sideboard). It's a great matchup. When those wolves go off there's no stoping them!
Hermit and Silverfur are especially great against my deck.
Cryptolith Rite was a dead card in all the games i played.
Good luck and draw well.
April 9, 2016 6:17 a.m.
AlCelestino says... #9
Hi, i'm a casual player and I can't understand why expedite doesn't count the Silverfur trigger for the draws, but Might of the masses does.
Can you explain it to me ? And what about other spells like confront the unknown or rush of adrenaline ? can they target the generated tokens ?
I guess it's something like "they are here so they count as creatures you control but can't be the target of the spell" but, why ? (and so, they give +1+1 to all creatures that were here BEFORE we play might of the masses, but they don't get the +1+1 themselves?)
Sorry for bad english btw :pThanks !
April 9, 2016 11:29 a.m.
Let's say you have Zada, Silverfur, and a wolf for example. You have expedite in hand. You target Zada with expedite. Zada then targets Silverfur and the wolf token with expedite. Zada's triggers are done. Now Silverfur has two triggers, one for Silverfur being targeted with a copy of Expedite, and another for the 2/2 wolf being targeted with a copy of expedite. from this Silverfur puts the trigger on top of the stack, it resolves, and two wolves have been created. These new wolves have not been targeted by Expedite so they don't have haste. Then Expedite resolves and you draw three cards, one for Zada, One for Silverfur Partisans, and the other for the 2/2 wolf that was on the field before everything started. Those three original creatures also have haste because they were targeted by the spell, but the other two were created as a result of the spell, so they do not.
Now let's take a step back. Let's say you didn't cast Expedite and you had Zada, Silverfur Partisans, And a 2/2 wolf on the field. Instead you decide to cast Might of the masses for one green mana. You target Zada. Zada's ability triggers on top of the stack. Zada's ability resolves and now Silferfur Partisan and the 2/2 wolf that was on the field to begin with are targeted with Might of the masses. Silverfur Partisan triggers twice and creates two 2/2 wolves that are not targeted with might of the masses. Might of the masses resolves after the new wolves enter the field. Might of the masses says "Target creature gets +1/+1 for each creature you control. At the time it resolves, you control 5 creatures now. Zada, Silverfur Partisan, and the original 2/2 wolf now get +5/+5 since you control 5 creatures total. The two 2/2 wolves that entered the field were not targeted by Might of the Masses so they don't receive the bonus, but they do help the other creatures gain more power and toughness.
TL;DR the creatures might be able to be a benefit to the spell depending on what it is, but since they were created as a RESULT of the spell being cast, it's not like the spell magically (ha) effects them. They didn't exist when Zada was triggered, so they don't receive Zada's love. Now, if you Created more wolves as a result of the spell, then you can get an additional spell to target the newly spawned wolves. Zada's ability does not retroactively target things that enter the field as a result of abilities triggering off of Zada's ability.
April 9, 2016 12:04 p.m.
AlCelestino says... #11
I understand now :) Thank you !I just ordered a SOI booster box, I hope I'll get Arlinn and some westvale abbey since they are the most expensive cards in that deck :) But its definitely my future deck ! It seems so strong and fun to play, while it's still budget :)
Isnt Lambholt Pacifist Flip better than Scourge Wolf btw ? since you easily have creatures with more than 4 power, and she doesn't need two same mana to be cast
April 9, 2016 12:24 p.m.
So I came up with three different Christmas Trees, but none match yours so I'm curious what I'm missing.
Tree #1
All trample. Assuming ideal draws for the first 5 turns, you have 12 cards to work with (on the play). Those cards are 3 Forest, Mountain, 3 Might of the Masses, Expedite, Zada, Silverfur, Timberpack, Messenger.
- T1 - Mountain, Messenger
- T2 - Forest, Timberpack
- T3 - Forest, Silverfur
- T4 - Forest, Zada
- T5 - Might, Might, Might, Expedite (draw 25), Mountain, Rush
This allows you to expedite the 3 original wolves + 3 + 6 + 12 tokens Which is where I assume you got the 25 attackers with Zada. The five spells allow you to create 3 + 6 + 12 + 24 + 48 = 93 tokens, which means 97 total creatures.
However Zada + the original 3 wolves are now actually dealing 293 trample damage each from the buffs alone (3x97+2+trample)
Additionally you have 3 wolf tokens at +196 trample, 6 wolf tokens dealing +99 trample, and 12 wolf tokens dealing +2 trample. And 72 additional wolf tokens that can't attack.
That gives you 1x294 + 3x295 + 3x198 + 6x101 + 12x4 = 2427 Trample Damage
Tree #2
More damage, less trample. Your twelve cards are now 2 Forest, 2 Mountain, 2 Might of the Masses, Rush of Adrenaline, Expedite, Zada, Silverfur, Timberpack, Messenger.
- T1 - Mountain, Messenger
- T2 - Forest, Timberpack
- T3 - Mountain, Silverfur
- T4 - Forest, Zada
- T5 - Might, Might, Rush, Expedite (draw 25), Forest, Might
Again we have 25 attackers. The only thing that changes is that now only 13 attackers have trample, and all attackers have at least one Might.
That gives you 1x294 + 3x295 + 3x198 + 6x101 = 2379 Trample Damage
And 12x99 = 1188 Non-trample damage
Tree #3
Basically Tree #1 but ending with T5 with Forest, Might. Sure there's no trample. But who cares? I'm attacking with 25 creatures.
Total damage is:
1x389 + 3x390 + 3x293 + 6x196 + 12x99 = 4802 Damage
April 10, 2016 12:42 a.m.
Have you thought about Rabid Bite instead of Moonlight Hunt?
April 10, 2016 4:23 a.m.
Yeah but I like the instant speed removal, so if they drop an avacyn on the field I can remove creatures before Avancyn's Enter the battlefield effect resolves, for example.
April 10, 2016 10:24 a.m.
hobbes8calvin says... #15
so i took inspiration from this build and (Soi) wolves over innestrad, mine is called werewolves at the door, still a build in progress and i would love any suggestions although i dont know if it will better than this masterpiece that its based off of, trying to keep it a relatively budget but i do have a westvale abbey that i pulled in a pack, no arlin sadly but oh well.
April 10, 2016 8:04 p.m.
So I took this deck to a free standard event at my local gaming store today. Went 0-3 before dropping. I faced esper control, black white tokens, and mono-red aggro.
Of the three, mono-red aggro was the most annoying. It felt like they had the best cards in my deck, and didn't rely on any combo. I dropped the first game keeping a hand with only a couple of Silverfurs, by turn 3 he already had village messenger, abbot, and dragon fodder tokens, which was a pretty ideal curve for him. After the Silverfur, he roasted it, then fiery tempered the token. Game two I was more aggressive, and managed to keep ahead of him in creatures. Again he tried to Roast the Silverfur, but I responded with Might and netted two tokens to make him a 6/6. Then he roasted again, and I responded with a second Might to get two more tokens and make him a 12/12. Game three I couldn't stick a creature through a barrage of exquisite firecraft, fiery impulse, and roasts. Sin prodder is also amazing in this deck.
Esper Control was just annoying. Between Silkwrap, Grasp of Darkness, Ruinous Path, Languish, Duress, Kalitas, Jace, and Ojutai (the dragon and his command) that was just a disaster. Every card I played was either exiled, killed, or countered. I had Zada in hand, but I couldn't stick either of the two Silverfurs long enough to play a Zada and then combo off. He did nine damage to himself with painful truths in game one, and that's all the damage he took. After sideboard it was even worse, because declaration in stone is OP.
Black White tokens was probably my most legit chance at winning. I had a pretty good board state game 1, but he had a Kalitas that was keeping me shy from attacking, leaving me searching for a Moonlight Hunt, or Zada to combo with. I drew lands. The he secured the wastes for 5 at the end of my turn and next turn played and emblemed a Gideon. I had the silverfur, but without a Zada all I could do was burn expedites to try and draw something useful while he sat behind his 5 2/2 tokens, Kalitas, and a pair of shambling vents. Never got there. Game two I had two forests, two timberwolves, a silverfur, an expedite, and a village messenger. Missed my third land drop, ended up losing both Timberwolves to a sideboard Declaration in Stone. Finally I dropped a silverfur and managed to expedite into a couple mights. On the rebound he cast ruinous path on the Silverfur, and then his second Declaration in Stone landed on the tokens.
Overall it just doesn't seem like the meta at my LGS allows me to combo off with this deck. If you can get Silverfur and Zada down, then nothing will really be able to stop you, but it tanks pretty hard to any deck that can keep that from happening. It's not aggressive enough to win without the combo on the backs of the creatures and spells it runs.
Of course, it's ENTIRELY possible I played it wrong.
April 10, 2016 9:11 p.m.
I don't think you're wrong jj4th, its pretty easy to remove all the creatures early and once turn 5 rolls around the deck runs out of gas, holding hands of pump without creatures on the board, especially when playing against a lot of early removal.
April 11, 2016 9:58 a.m.
HellHound121296 says... #19
coastiemike just the list of those cards in that Bant Company deck make me want to cry lol
April 11, 2016 12:25 p.m.
campbellg14 says... #20
So this deck is really fun! I love the idea of the wolves, and people have been waiting to see a good wolves deck come out, which this deck MORE than satisfies.
Now, jj4th, I feel that you just got really unlucky! Your local meta may not allow for this deck to take off, as well as you happened to match up against some of the only decks that could handle this deck! Lol. That's just unfortunate. Also, as with any deck EVER, its sometimes comes down to card draw. You may just get unlucky with your top decks.
This deck is really a combo deck, so you need to pull it, pull it fast, and pull it efficiently. This brings me to why I'm making you read all this crap.
I've playtested this deck quite a bit, loved it, and think it really works when it works. The ONLY problem I have aside from card draw is REMOVAL. If they get rid of one or two Silverfurs and/or Zadas, its GG. So have you thought about trying to add anything to help keep things on the board?
I know it is white, but cards like Make a Stand or Nahiri's Machinations are what I mean. Cards to keep things on the board so you can properly combo. I created an inspired version of this that splashes white to add these cards, as well as Odric, Lunarch Marshal and Sigarda, Heron's Grace. It helps keep things on the board by Sigarda giving Odric hexproof, and Odric giving everything hexproof. My deck has much work to do, but I like how I can try and keep things from being removed.
Anyway, I was wondering how you think this deck could potentially add some answers to removal. It is excellent so far, just trying to point out the only problem I've faced thus far.
Great work!
April 11, 2016 3:03 p.m.
If you look at the updates, there's a blue sideboard that's an answer to removal. You don't like being targeted? well here's this spell that gives my creatures +0/+3 hexproof. You play a spell on top of that? well, i'm going to flicker the creature.
Here's a few cards that say SCREW YOU CONTROL
April 11, 2016 3:21 p.m. Edited.
garruk_horde says... #22
I'd drop the 4x Glint and put in 4x Slip Through Space. Imagine playing that and then drawing an expedite!
April 11, 2016 9:52 p.m.
Rasanck and others,
Sorry if y'all already knew this but Confront the Unknown
+
Zada, Hedron Grinder
can be a little tricky, so I wanted to lay it out ...
When Zada's ability triggers, the copies are put onto the stack in whatever order you want, with the original spell (targeting Zada) on the bottom. So if there are two other Creatures, for example, you Investigate then one gets +1/+1, then you Investigate again and the other gets +2/+2, then you Investigate again and Zada gets +3/+3.
Take care!
April 12, 2016 2:57 a.m.
Rabid_Wombat says... #24
+1 This deck rocks, great combos.
Bark at the Moon!
April 12, 2016 3:55 a.m.
Mr.Dr.Professor says... #25
dude y the bad wolves? I get that it's wolf tribal, but do you really need to have that many? Also, isn't casting a ton of spells what you're not supposed to do with werewolves?
Rasanck says... #1
coastiemike Glint is the only reason I'd ever consider splashing another color so far lol. That could make it a lock down you can't mess with me deck. Either that or Ranger's Guile which just went out of standard. That and Essence Flux might make an alright Red Blue Green wolves deck.
Falcawn if you want a serious consistent chance at delirium take out two forests, two mountains, and add in 4xEvolving Wilds from Battle Of Zendikar
April 8, 2016 8:20 p.m.