Damia Morgendorffer

Commander / EDH enpc

SCORE: 61 | 87 COMMENTS | 20666 VIEWS | IN 30 FOLDERS


Prerelease FTW —Sept. 21, 2014

thanks to the KTK pre-release I was able to get a Flooded Strand and Bloodstained Mire for the deck to replace Jund Panorama and Esper Panorama. Also got Sultai Charm to test over Krosan Grip and replaced Dissolve with Psychic Strike.

EDIT: since the prerelease I have been abole to get a Wooded Foothills and a Polluted Delta for the deck (replacing Bant Panorama and Evolving Wilds). I think it might be time to swap Mr Llanowar Elves out for Deathrite Shaman.

Epochalyptik says... #1

I disagree with the inclusion of the Panorama lands. I understand there's probably some temptation to run them because it feels like you'll get ROI on Crucible, but you're not really doing yourself any favors with the ", , sac: get a tapped basic" effect.

Evolving Wilds is another iffy land, but it's passable because it doesn't really screw your tempo any more than you can afford.

You run a lot of expensive counterspells. Have you considered running any of the other spells instead? Same for your removal suite. I don't see Nature's Claim , which is one of EDH's best rock killers.

Having run creatures like Acidic Slime and Massacre Wurm in a very primitive version of Dominus - Dreamcrusher Edition, I can tell you that they're finicky. I personally don't like how much they cost and how little you get, but I suppose they have favorable interactions with Massacre Wurm .

Yisan, the Wanderer Bard seems like an unusual choice for this deck. It's pretty slow when you take into account the repeated cost and the summoning sickness.

September 17, 2014 2:01 a.m.

enpc says... #2

Cheers for the feedback.

The plan long term is to swap all of the panoramas and the Evolving Wilds as well as two other lands (thus why I was asking about Reliquary Tower ) out for Misty Rainforest , Verdant Catacombs , Polluted Delta , Bloodstained Mire , Scalding Tarn and Wooded Foothills . I very much agree about the limitedness of the paoramas and now that they are coming down in price I should be replacing them very soon. For now I think that 6 will do, I might get round to running all 9 eventually but I think the deck won't technically need it.

As for the 2 cost counter spells, the best that come to mind are Memory Lapse , Remand , Mana Leak and Mana Drain . (technically also Force of Will ). I already have FoW and Mana Drain on my "to buy" list and my big beef is that the other ones aren't technically hard counters (Mana Leak is on the cusp though). as much as I like the cheapness of them, they only really buy me one turn and they effectively make it a 1-for-2. I know where you're coming from though, I just don't think the deck plays as aggressively as your build. Are there any though that you would recommend?

I was thinking of taking out Krosan Grip for Sultai Charm but do you think Nature's Claim would be the better call? with Acidic Slime , I run it because of the amount of creature based decks in my meta. the deathtouch can be quite a deterrent.

Yisan, the Wanderer Bard is a bit more of a flovour card. You're right in that he is slower, but the benefit is that his ability is instant speed so after the initial downpayment, if I have 3 mana open just before my turn I can fetch a creature. And if people let him get high enough I can EOT Deadeye Navigator into main turn Palinchron . But at the end of the day, he's in because I just think its a great idea for a card (I know that's not the best reason to run something but he's just so cool).

September 17, 2014 4:44 a.m.

Epochalyptik says... #3

The main benefit of counters is that they counter a spell for as long as you need it countered, which is to say for the turn during which you combo. Although some of them aren't hard counters, they interfere with your opponent's tempo enough for you to gain more of an advantage, and they can also serve as effective hard counters during your combo because there won't be a followup turn.

All of the counterspells currently in my deck have been tested at the competitive level and justified their own inclusions, so I'd start there.

I personally don't run Krosan Grip and will not be running Sultai Charm because of their high costs. In a slower deck, those cards might be more useful because you aren't as pressed for efficiency and time. I do highly recommend Nature's Claim , though. It's a very cheap and very fast way to answer many threats.

September 17, 2014 1:35 p.m.

Lhurgyof says... #4

I would rather see Delay run over Remand . It's better if you're comboeing off, on the off-chance they'd be able to re-cast their disruption.

That's just my 2 cents.

September 17, 2014 4:06 p.m.

enpc says... #5

@Epochalyptik: My only concern would be that the counters are much less powerful out of combo but I guess disrupting a player's tempo is worth the "not hard" counter. I wouldn't want to swap out all of my hard counters but replacing one or two of them could be worthwhile. ultimately, I think I just need a FoW too. As for Nature's Claim , I personally still feel more sold on the utility of Sultai Charm but I think I will have to keep an eye on Nature's Claim . Out of curiosity, have you playtested Unravel the Aether ? I haven't tried it but I've heard good things from people who have. Especially against God Generals.

@Lhurgyof: I think I would tend to agree with you on that too. Although the cantrip on Remand is awesome, I like the idea of a player not having access to the card they just played. Especially if you're trying to counter something like Swords to Plowshares or Dispel where it's only 1 mana to recast. The other one that I have my eye on is Memory Lapse . Unlike Delay it means that they still have to recast the spell investing more mana into it. But both of them make the spell "inaccessible" to the player directly after the counter resolves.

September 17, 2014 7:53 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #6

It's mostly a matter of intuition, to be honest. If you determine that the cost for the hard counters is affordable enough in your meta, you can certainly keep those cards. I'm partial to the counters because I play competitively, and the reduced cost is extremely important for resource budgeting. I can live with a Remand ed spell coming back next turn because I stagger the opponent's tempo and draw a card. Every counterspell has merits and shortcomings.

As for Unravel the Aether , I haven't personally tested it. I like it as a removal spell, though, and I definitely see its usefulness.

September 17, 2014 8:28 p.m.

enpc says... #7

I'm not too fussed about the 3CMC its more the UU thats the problem. But I think a lot of it also boils back down to the issue of mana base. I knid of feel like the sooner I address that, the sooner these problems will be alleviated.

Cheers for the feedback btw, it helps to have people who've got experience with the cards as opposed to trying to validate whether something is good or not on paper wihout having to go through the whole rigmarole myself (although this isn't always a bad thing).

September 17, 2014 9:34 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #8

Yeah, the mana base is one of the main keys to the deck. Well, to any tricolor deck, really. Playing cards like Necropotence and Mana Drain so early in the game made me realize in a deeper sense that my deck just wouldn't function were it not for the optimized land base.

September 17, 2014 9:58 p.m.