|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Masters Edition (MED)||Common|
|Ice Age (ICE)||Uncommon|
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As an additional cost to play Fire Covenant, pay X life.
Fire Covenant deals X damage divided as you choose among any number of target creatures.
Fire Covenant Discussion
2 days ago
Royal-Tot Yo, great perspective appreciate the analysis ya have. I just recently got back from Vegas so I wasn't able to test it more but at the current moment the extra land package is quite necessary as I am in a more stax oriented meta. I do like the change for Fire Covenant over Toxic Deluge and I been playing around with Survival of the Fittest , since my lines tend to be more creature based I do think SotF will do more work especially with the Temur/Dockside line.
I have yet to see if the Raza line will do work, but my buddy plays the Raza line in his Prossh so I can see the value in it, especially since we have access to Life / Death as well, but that requires more testing as I play more and more. For the Regrowth over Reap , it depends as usually there is only one other black player, so at the moment I will use Regrowth for now. Tomorrow I'm going to be able to play a little more so I'll post my results after tomorrow night. (Also testing out Scheming Symmetry , it has it's value as long as you can draw first which is usually via Korvold plus it's another any tutor which is great)
I do not like Heartwood Storyteller , I don't like giving anyone else advantage but myself, for Defense Grid and City of Solitude I do like them but I prefer Dosan over both as there are other ways for me to grab them.
Thanks for the comments you two!
5 days ago
So been play testing Korvold here for a month or so. I started with the extra lands package to be not necessary. i.e. Exploration , azusa, crucible, ramunap. My main deck is The Gitrog Monster and Korvold shares 70% of the cards. I have found Emergence Zone to be an all star along with Survival of the Fittest to win at instant speed or at least threaten the win at any time there's a mana open. I've cut Toxic Deluge and replaced it with Fire Covenant as I run just as many dorks as you. Reanimation package of Reanimate Animate Dead also has been key usually targeting Dockside Extortionist but also trying out Razaketh to see if I like it. Also, may I interest you in Reap in place of Regrowth ?
6 days ago
As to Toxic Deluge vs Fire Covenant , I think given our dork package, Fire Covenant should be run first. Anguished Unmaking , Abrupt Decay , Despark , or Teferi's Protection would all be worth looking at over Toxic, depending on your meta. If you need another board wipe vs removal/protection, I'm still pretty high on Crux of Fate , Damnation , or Magmaquake —the latter if Planeswalkers are an issue for you.
In terms of power level/competitiveness, I'm still looking to optimize the deck, but have to make adjustments since the whole strategy/deck composition can't really put up a decent showing in cEDH pods (where most of your decklist needs to be comprised of tight or redundant 2 card win-cons, mana neutral or positive ramp, cantrips/card draw/card selection, and cheap interaction/stax effects . . . and blockers for Tymna, assuming you're not playing her in the first place).
As opposed to, y'know, 22 dragons (including the commander), one permission spell that interacts on the stack, and not being able to threaten wins reliably before turns 6-8, possibly turns 8-10.
So I was just finding that even though I had strong/fast starts, the deck lacked enough raw card draw to stay in longer games of attrition that a lot of optimzed to 75% pods end up becoming. Rishkar's Expertise should thus probably be a Windfall , but with the added big ramp from Faeburrow Elder , I've been able to cast The Ur-Dragon more reliably, and drawing ten w/ a free cast has been great.
And in terms of your decklist (our lists' cores are still rather quite close with just a few deviations!), I'd look to cut any two of these four—— Conqueror's Flail , Gruul Signet , Sarkhan the Mad , or Abrupt Decay --for Worldly Tutor and some kind of raw card draw effect/spell. But those are all just cards that I had found either too narrow/conditional and are meta-dependent.
Whatever the power level, if we're lacking anything at the moment it is probably graveyard hate . . . I had been running Rakdos Charm , but that of course can't take care of more than one recursion engine at the table. Yard engine/value decks (vs decks that include graveyard manipulation as part of a winning/linear line) don't pop up as frequently at higher-power or cEDH tables, except maybe Frog (which needs its commander to function more than its yard, arguably), where Deathrite Shaman or Noxious Revival can target an opponent's key yard piece can sometimes stop a win . . . maybe Rakdos Charm gets a bit better with both Noxious Revival and Backdraft Hellkite ? Leyline of the Void fits what I'm looking at perfectly but isn't quite main deck playable.
6 days ago
From a ramp perspective Three Visits might be better than Farseek simply because of that land coming into play untapped but for me it's very expensive and should cost at most 2x more than Nature's Lore (in case it ever gets a reprint). There's even Spoils of Victory but this might be too expensive at 3 CMC.
In my build I still didn't acquire Toxic Deluge due to high price tag so I thought about getting Fire Covenant in it's place and in covenant's place Anguished Unmaking - do you think that it might get similar
I understand your decision but there are much more variables that make a deck "75%" - I'd actually create most powerful version of a deck (or almost that, you know, ABUR duals are expensive xD) and depending on the playgroup's power level I'd rather adjust my playstyle (e.g. tutor for beater/ramp instead of a straight up win-con).
1 week ago
Hey man! I got some suggestions. Feel free to ignore any/all of them:
There's a reason Ponder and Preordain are banned in Modern, and it's because they're good. I highly suggest running both in any blue deck -- they may not look like much, but being able to dig to what you need and past what you don't for one mana is a deal I'll take any day. You're running a good number of fetch lands, so Brainstorm is one you may want to add in there as well.
I don't know what your meta is like, but in general people need to draw a bunch of cards to win the game. Narset, Parter of Veils brings back thoughts of when Leovold, Emissary of Trest was legal... I think almost any blue deck should run her, especially since if you run Windfall (I think you should), she can win you the game. Or your Wheel of Fortune .
I don't know how this deck plays, but I suspect you'll have at least one or two creatures out at a time. If you do, Azra Oddsmaker can be a good source of card-advantage; Edric, Spymaster of Trest is similar, though better if you have dorks (see (5)). Painful Truths is another favorite of mine, as are Treasure Cruise , Dark Confidant , Dig Through Time and Thirst for Knowledge . Faithless Looting can also be pretty good.
A lot of decks run a lot of artifact ramp. Dack Fayden is a great way to capitalize on that, and if you run Notion Thief (which also pairs with your Windfall ), targeting your opponent with Dack's +1 can produce a four card swing.
Dorks. You're in green, so you have access to the best ramp in the game, aside from Sol Ring (which I think you should run). I highly suggest including any/all of the following in addition to your Deathrite Shaman : Birds of Paradise , Elves of Deep Shadow , Orcish Lumberjack , Llanowar Elves , Fyndhorn Elves , Elvish Mystic , Bloom Tender , Arbor Elf ... Though they may not be 'dork'-ramp, I've also been impressed with Utopia Sprawl and Wild Growth , not least because these double the mana from Arbor Elf . If you end up running Edric, Spymaster of Trest , the dorks will draw you cards when you're not using them for mana.
If you're looking for the best way to generate infinite mana with your general, I think Isochron Scepter with Dramatic Reversal is the best way. You'd need to run either artifact ramp or dorks (I highly advise the latter), but it's a pretty busted combo and I think you should put some ramp in anyway. This lets you draw your deck with Thrasios, Triton Hero and then win through Torment of Hailfire or the like.
Reflecting Pool is an often-chromatic land you may wish to consider, and Exotic Orchard is frequently at least a tri-land. I may be missing something, but running Strip Mine and Wasteland to pair with your Crucible of Worlds and Ramunap Excavator seems... good.
You're running two artifacts (three, if you run the aforementioned Sol Ring ): You should give strong consideration to things like Collector Ouphe (if you don't like the Isochron Scepter loop) or even a janky Energy Flux . These'll make sure opponents don't do nasty things with their own Isochron Scepter while hardly touching you. Also, things like Ancient Grudge or By Force are powerful magic cards.
Spell Snare is a counterspell you may want to consider, as it counters a wide range of frequently played cards in EDH like Demonic Tutor , Cyclonic Rift (overloaded or not), Winter Orb , all the talismans/signets, Counterspell , Mana Drain , Arcane Denial , Sylvan Library , Chains of Mephistopheles , Abeyance , Baleful Strix , Nature's Lore ... Also, if you're in an Ad Nauseam -heavy meta (I sure as hell am), consider things like Dispel to keep those decks in check.
If your meta is blue-heavy (most are), consider some second-order countermagic. Things like Veil of Summer and Vexing Shusher can both make sure your spells resolve. Similarly, Carpet of Flowers is a good way to get free mana from blue opponents, and Pyroblast tends to be good as well.
Personally, I've found Mystic Remora to be better than Rhystic Study , if only because it is one mana. People are way less likely to pay four mana than one, and in less experienced metas people tend to let you pull off an Ancestral Recall or two in two-ish turn cycles. In more experienced metas, Mystic Remora slows the game down as your opponents wait for it to go away and you just make sure you hit your land-drops.
Multi-for-ones are pretty important in a format with three opponents. Fire Covenant has been a favorite piece of removal in my meta since it'll clear out opponents' creatures while leaving yours untouched. Hull Breach and Decimate are also good, although it is important to bare in mind that Decimate requires a bunch of different targets in order to be castable. Windgrace's Judgment and even Casualties of War are also good.
If you want to go deep into magic history, there's another way to make infinite mana in your colors in addition to (6): Worldgorger Dragon . Entomb , Buried Alive or Faithless Looting to the graveyard this mo-fo, then cast Animate Dead , Necromancy or Dance of the Dead targeting him, and BOOM you win. (In case you aren't familiar with the combo, Animate Dead returns Worldgorger Dragon to the battlefield, and then Worldgorger Dragon triggers to exile Animate Dead . Animate Dead leaving then makes you sacrifice Worldgorger Dragon , bringing back Animate Dead and then Worldgorger Dragon ... rinse and repeat. Tapping your lands for mana in between each exile trigger yields infinite mana. WARNINGS: 1. You need a second creature in a graveyard to end the loop, or the game is a draw; 2. If someone Nature's Claim s your Animate Dead while the Worldgorger Dragon is entering the battlefield, you lose everything and you're boned. So make sure either your opponents are out of mana/counterspells or you've got your own protective backup.)
I think that's all I got. Good luck!
2 weeks ago
Wow, thanks realsoupersand, appreciate all the work you put into this review and comment. I have lot's to work on here.
I spent about an hour making a reply earlier today, but when I clicked preview forced me to login and it was gone forever. So I decided to make some updates to the deck before responding again, here it is.
I understand and appreciate your comments about Kaalia of the Vast and cEDH, of course, your correct the play analytics certainly support the position. The meta is fairly narrow on cEDH, however, like most formats (eg: Modern), there are non-meta decks that can be competitive in the format, but perhaps not with a high degree of consistency. I feel that the ability to have T1-T4 win-cons can make it competitive in the cEDH format, and with your help if we can get avg turn win under 4 or improve T1/T2 win %, it certainly can play although being mardu, it doesn't have access to the core strengths of the Tier1 decks.
I reduced my lands count a few. I read an article and ran their statistics through a bunch of models I created based on the raw data. Their conclusion, and my analysis verified, there is a co-relation between playing or missing a T3 land drop and your winning % in commander. At my previous lands, I still miss the T3 land about 20% of the time. I'll see how the reduction in lands impacts those statistics. I removed Rugged Prairie , but the other 2 filter lands, provide additional conversion avenues for a Turn 1 win, so although not the best lands, the higher T1 win % benefits from their inclusion.
I also hate any land that ETB tapped like Hall of the Bandit Lord . The way I was thinking about it was, Dragon Tempest is CMC2 (but active that turn if I have mana to play something), if I play Hall of the Bandit Lord tapped on T2, it is only CMC1 because I still have my T1 land available (although it doesn't do anything that turn). Haste is important for utility, I didn't include it for a long time, then added it back to see if it brought my avg win turn down, will do some testing with it in and out.
Yawgmoth's Will mostly has been beneficial. Although its CMC3 (terrible), assuming I have a Fetch land in the graveyard, and don't have a land drop in hand, it can play the fetch, so in some cases it's a modular ramp. Also, it can cast a Karmic Guide (we'll get to her) to start the Infinite Combo, also, it can cast a Reanimate or Animate Dead to do the same, or be a Demonic Tutor /modular tutor/removal, etc. Also, with the inclusion of Worldgorger Dragon Infinte Mana, going to allow me to play my entire graveyard in a single turn. It helps with improving the T3 and T4 land drops % and provides as good a ramp as mardu is going to get.
Mox Diamond unfortunately I don't have one, I have several decks including this one that need it, but it's not budget friendly either, so going to be a future add whenever I can get my hands on some. I'll see what I can do with artifacts to get to a reasonable consistency on Mox Opal going to take a while to make all the updates and buy some cards. Arcane Signet still shows as Illegal in commander, I assume the Brawl decks will be released soon or else tapped out will update their system. It's the best CMC2 rock, it will be in there whenever legal.
Diabolic Intent has only screwed me once so far, outside of Grand Abolisher there isn't anyone (including Kaalia of the Vast ) that I won't sacrifice to pull my combo piece and go for the win. It usually finds the last piece. Mausoleum Secrets works nicely with Buried Alive and Entomb to pull the Reanimate card. They are not the best, they were includes for testing purposes, I just find I need more tutoring to be consistent so having CMC1 and CMC2 tutors with conditions is still useful, I wish there was better options for mardu. I'll keep evaluating them, if they are unplayable when drawn in too high a % of circumstances they do not add value to the deck.
To replace the Swiftfoot Boots I added Idyllic Tutor , I know you didn't suggest, but with Worldgorger Dragon in, any way to pull Dragon Tempest for haste or Infinite damage or Animate Dead feels right? Steelshaper's Gift with just Lightning Greaves does feel weird. I'm wondering on the Swiftfoot Boots though, the Equip 0 is key certainly on Lightning Greaves , but usually just throw it on Kaalia of the Vast maybe a Grand Abolisher so Steelshaper's Gift + Lightning Greaves is similar CMC to Swiftfoot Boots and equip () but of course not playable on T1 (boo). I'll try with boots out and keep the tutors in, see how consistently I get to haste when I need it to drop a Razaketh, the Foulblooded , would never want to be waiting for haste when I have a win-con in hand.
As you mentioned Sensei's Divining Top works well with Dark Confidant , but mostly I use it to enable same turn Vampiric Tutor / Imperial Seal or to ensure I get the lands I need or try and find an ADD to resolve if Kaalia of the Vast is available and don't really need the mana. Also, if I have nothing else, it's a good random draw chance to stop a win-con or pull a tutor (and shuffle it away! happens so often).
I'm thinking on Tymna the Weaver seems not bad, I don't play to her strengths but still viable as mardu can't draw properly.
About 40% of my wins are my primary win-con of Buried Alive + Reanimate , Karmic Guide is the enabler. Even when I draw her to hand, CMC5 is still playable, or cheat-able with Kaalia of the Vast . She did combo with Reveillark but that wasn't working, Reveillark was too high CMC. She re-pops a Razaketh, the Foulblooded then he sac's her, outside of the primary win-con, its never a dead draw usually. I put Dance of the Dead in, but now, I'm thinking Necromancy is better, because it also works with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker as well. Might swap the Dance of the Dead to Necromancy if I have one, I'll check tomorrow.
Dismember I like, play it in Modern even, Fire Covenant makes sense, but feel I would rather just Tutor Toxic Deluge which can remove indestructible and not have the duplication. Usually, I just try and win instead of disrupting, just let the Counterspell players stop the others, that opens a windows sometimes for me to try going for combo. I hate how Red Elemental Blast and Pyroblast are potential dead draws, but realistically always of value. Similar to a more generic Silence (wish it had Split Second), probably need them, need to review for more cuts. Path to Exile is a CMC1 exile, so it's good for decks that rely on commander (understanding they often don't care if they are removed because that is too late), I also use it as a modular ramp card, CMC1 to pull a land into play. I haven't found it hurts me most of the time, it's usually stopping a go for the win (like a Laboratory Maniac or something), usually wouldn't play it to enable a win.
Thoughtseize and the like, one of my favorite cards BTW, I found just hurts me and 1 player. Gives a wide opening to the other 2 players to go for the win, and now I'm short on card advantage, draw poorly, and disabled a player potentially that could have stopped the win. If it's pre-emptive (like Silence ) before going for the win, do I really want to increase my Win-Con by CMC1 or wait that extra turn to have the mana, or just go for it now, and maybe win? Tough to tell. Again too, wherever I can would rather go for my win than stop others win.
I'll have to go over creatures responses tomorrow as I'm out of time tonight, my earlier message addressed everything plus a bunch of cards I'm considering putting in and your opinion on those. For another night!
Thanks again for the fantastic input, I'm really working on making the changes. I ordered a bunch more cards on Card Kingdom today, so in 7 days free shipping, should see some more changes coming down the pipe. Also going to continue reviewing your recommendations and deciding on cuts tomorrow and over the upcoming weekend.
1 month ago
Hey N3M3S1S! Welcome to EDH. I hope you find it fun... I like this format the most. Hopefully you'll find these suggestions helpful:
Card-draw is one of the most important elements of any EDH deck -- in a format with three opponents, you typically want any source of card advantage you can get. Not being in blue means you don't have access to Windfall and friends, but Mardu has its fair share of mass-draw effects. I highly suggest Painful Truths ... You'll frequently be casting it as a three-mana draw-three, and the life-loss is more than worth it. Other draw-spells to consider: Night's Whisper , Minions' Murmurs , Faithless Looting , Syphon Mind , Read the Bones , Commune with Lava , Sign in Blood ... I'm sure there're more, but they aren't coming to mind. Permanent-based card-advantage is even better, since it's... well... permanent. Consider some of the following: Twilight Prophet , Phyrexian Arena , Arguel's Blood Fast Flip, Greed ... I love that you already have Necropotence .
Multi-for-One removal is another way to build card-advantage -- cards like Go for the Throat , Anguished Unmaking , Mortify and Path to Exile are good in two-player formats, but in multiplayer I've often found them not to be good enough. Some cards to consider instead: Fire Covenant , Grasp of Fate , Wear / Tear ... Though it's a one-for-one, I think you should include Swords to Plowshares . It only removes one thing, but it's like... REALLY efficient. Path to Exile ramping your opponent is actively dangerous.
Consider Cover of Darkness as another way to capitalize on your tribal theme. Other tribal-powering cards to consider include: Cavern of Souls , Patriarch's Bidding , Vampire Nocturnus , Bloodlord of Vaasgoth , Malakir Bloodwitch and Champion of Dusk . I suggest removing Gifted Aetherborn Paladin of Atonement , Pitiless Pontiff and/or Vampire Cutthroat for some of these.
Your artifact-ramp package has room for improvement. I like your signets... two-mana rocks are much better than three-mana rocks. Consider some or all of the following: Talisman of Conviction , Talisman of Hierarchy , Talisman of Indulgence , Mind Stone , Fellwar Stone , Arcane Signet , Prismatic Lens or even just Coldsteel Heart .
I think Lightning Greaves is probably better than Swiftfoot Boots , if you want to be able to equip frequently. If you need to get around the shroud, you can move the boots to something else, do what you need, and then return the boots to the first creature.
If you take my advice from (5), you can cut some lands. In general, if you have ramp and your curve is low, you can run 31 or 32 lands. With your current curve, I suggest 35 lands plus ramp. If you want to keep your basic land count high, you can run things like Blood Moon , Ruination , etc. Otherwise, here're some non-basics to consider: City of Brass , Mana Confluence , Prismatic Vista , Godless Shrine , Blood Crypt and Sacred Foundry .
Right. Good luck have fun!
Fire Covenant occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.02%