|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Commander 2016 (C16)||Rare|
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Undaunted (This spell costs less to cast for each opponent.)
Return all nonland permanents to their owners' hands.
Coastal Breach Discussion
4 months ago
Hatred really good with yuriko to one shot someone with commander damage. really good against life gain decks
Coastal Breach good board wipe assuming you're in a 4 player game. it's cmc is 7 but only cost you 4 mana to play also resets your ninja's and etb creatures
Equilibrium is used to bounce your ninjas with the unblockable dudes since ninja's are kinda trash by themselves if they can't get through or you can bounce your opponents dudes too if you wanna play the tempo game
Mardu Shadowspear currently placeholder but in a pinch is a good creature to throw out with haste to quickly activate ninjitsu. decent floor but low ceiling on this card. you can probably find better but the haste effect is decent in my playgroup
Traveler's Amulet mainly used in the same capacity as fetch lands. helps thin the deck from lands so you're less likely to whiff with yuriko triggers
Silumgar Sorcerer with yuriko out you can flash this guy in to counter a creature spell by saccing yuriko and he's a flyer aswell so you can ninjitsu yuriko back in with him. rinse and repeat. cute combo but only really decent in a meta heavy with creatures. easily cuttable card.
4 months ago
Thanks for the reply DoanDoan.
You are playing a few cards I usually don't see in a Yuriko list. Would you be willing to comment on their use and effectiveness?
5 months ago
Hi Jayd0nlink thx for the suggestions. I think I am going to try to get lands under 1 dollar. I think I am going to add Seat of the Synod . Cascading Cataracts is a nice choice I am going to add. Since this deck is trying to get other peoples cards, I need the opponent to have cards I want. I want to take out Oloro, Ageless Ascetic , also Colossus of Akros . I know Blightsteel Colossus is an amazing add, but its not really a necessary card. Wurmcoil Engine is also usually a automatic add in most EDH decks but, ehhh, I think its going in my Daretti deck. Coastal Breach technically is not necessary. I would rather use target removal, or bounce.
Cards going in------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cards going out----------------------------------------------------------------------- - Blightsteel Colossus - Oloro, Ageless Ascetic - Colossus of Akros - Wurmcoil Engine - Coastal Breach - Inkwell Leviathan - Scoured Barrens - Persuasion
THX for all the suggestions. IF you could tell me how its looking, that would be great. Again, just in case, this deck utilizes other peoples cards, and hands,bouncing stuff they already casted. Letting them draw cards for our use. Helm of the Host can do wonky stuff with our commander, letting us control other peoples hands, more than one.
6 months ago
In EDH, when a player with a blue source and at least mana in other sources open on a field. It is a threat. It is a threat not because of a 7 mana spell, but a 2 mana spell, not a spell that deals damage, counters spell, destroys permanents, tutors, or cheats costs, but a bounce spell.
Cyclonic Rift , C-Rift, the big wave, whatever you call it, people know it as one of the strongest, most backbreaking spells in all of EDH, if not the best card in the format.
I am here to say that is isn't.
Part of my series on why other popular staples aren't good ( Phyrexian Arena , Rampant Growth ), or are simply not good in a specific way ( Rhystic Study ), I am not here to deny the power that a card like Cyclonic Rift has, but simply that it isn't a good enough card to warrant the hate or love that it receives.
Before I go over why it isn't good, I need to go over why at nearly every power level, it is good.
In casual EDH, the 50% or less, the Precons, the jank, lies it's the weakest state.
That is where all removal spells, sweepers, or countermagic is the weakest, especially bounce. If no one has threatening boards, why remove them. You'd rather spend 7 mana on a spell to improve yours most of the time, yet those games go long, the Cyclonic Rift acts as a Fog to save you, Sleep to get in for damage, or real removal if you use it on a player's end step if they have to discard just after.
Almost all cards that show heavy play at higher levels show some play at lower ones, and while the price-tag may limit it for most casual players, it does work.
At the 75% or the middle tiers of EDH, where I think EDH players mostly lie, it where it is the most powerful. IF it destroyed any number of target nonland permanents, it would be weaker, because of three reasons:
75% decks often use permanent-based engines to support their gameplan. Think Beast Whisperer along with a deck full of cheap elves, or Paradox Engine in a deck will a lot of Temple Bell effects and mana rocks.
These decks and their creators often expect opponents to remove threats, so have many threats to remove.
They try to protect against sweepers, the only punishing cards for going so wide, with anti-sweepers, think Heroic Intervention , or Boros Charm , and protect against some single-target removal with effects like Darksteel Plate .
Because of this, and because indestructible and hexproof don't protect against a mass bounce effect, along with Cyclonic Rift being the only mass bounce at instant speed that doesn't affect you at all, and doesn't target, it is truly the best anti-75% sweeper by many standards.
In the competitive setting, while not bad, it is mostly relegated to being a 2 mana Chain of Vapor or a Into the Roil that doesn't draw a card, that can let a combo deck get through stax locks once in a blue moon.
Don't get me wrong, being relegated to a slightly worse Chain of Vapor isn't an insult. Chain of Vapor is possible the best removal in cEDH, as decks like Kess consultation or P-Hulk variants Laboratory Maniac wins, and for 1 blue mana, or two in the case of Cyclonic Rift , you get to bounce their wincon as they draw off an empty deck, so they lose...
That is some powerful stuff.
So why isn't it the best EDH card, an efficient spell in nearly any metagame? 2 options for removal, one that crushes many lists and the other a sleek and useful trick?
Because it isn't hyper-efficient, nor is it unbeatable, nor is it irreplaceable.
To start, many cEDH decks that run it run consistent amounts of countermagic to protect it's possible great effect, and numerous cards could fit the spot. It isn't alone. Blink of an Eye , the second Into the Roil has been used over it in many combo lists that more mana-efficient options and many forget the slot all-together, in favor of a cantrip or other removal spell like Abrade or whatever. It isn't very dominant there, and so is easy to explain why it wouldn't be amazing there.
In casual lists, Cyclonic Rift costs about as much as half of many of the casual decks, or even more than some entire casual decks that I have seen. Bringing money-cards wins there, as would a Consecrated Sphinx that costs less money, and I'd wager would have more powerful an effect. Again, an easy argument, but I believe it works.
The really hard place to argue against Cyclonic Rift on the surface is the middle tiers. The 75% lists. Legitimately, I think it is because in the 75% players don't consistently a highly interactive 'metagame'. They just prefer to be interactive 'ingame'.
This comes down to theory, however, when a deck, for example, an elf list abusing the Llanowar Elves style effects along with untap effects to keep making mana, dumping it into something like Ezuri, Renegade Leader . All of that deck and many others get shut down by Null Rod . While that card may be less powerful than other cards against any random deck, as many players know exactly what decks they face, they can play to those decks.
This means general removal, like Anguished Unmaking may be worse if artifacts and walkers don't see much play, you'd rather Mortify . Or if instant speed doesn't help you much, as a lot of City of Solitude / Dosan the Falling Leaf effects exist in your meta, Vindicate , etc.
This is pretty basic knowledge, however, the point here is that there are many, many replacements for Cyclonic Rift in different metagames, and I want to share the ones, only in mono-blue, that in the 75% are why Cyclonic Rift is overrated.
This isn't to say it isn't the best, but that if many, many replacements cost way less $$$ and are occasionally better, that one card shouldn't be considered the best in every situation.
Aether Gale , sorcery, only hits six things, has to hit your things if you don't have enough targets of only your opponents, targets, etc. Yes, there are reasons this is clearly worse.
Why is it better? Politically, you don't have to hit cards from players you team with. Similarly, if you like the Howling Mine on someone's field, don't bounce it. Someone Banishing Light ed someone else's threat you can't deal with? Don't bounce it.
Also, 18 cents. Compared to ~20 dollars and I think it is a steal for budget lists.
Also, it is 2 mana cheaper, despite not being an occasional Disperse .
Evacuation , the downside is simple, it doesn't hit non-creatures, and bounces your own things.
The upsides are for decks that want their own things bounced. ETB effects like Mulldrifter (You can respond to the sacrifice on evoke if you want!), Archaeomancer (infinite sweepers by returning Evacuation , or just recur another card), Duplicant , Solemn Simulacrum , etc.
It is 5 mana too, still an instant, and is only 2-3 dollars right now.
Other options for this could be AEtherize , Whelming Wave , Inundate , Engulf the Shore , Profaner of the Dead , or Scourge of Fleets if you just want mass creature bounce, each with ups and downs, some that only hit opposing creatures, some that are instants, some with graveyard synergies, etc.
For mass nonland bounce that doesn't target? There are tons of options, plenty with lower mana costs than Cyclonic Rift .
Take Coastal Breach . It does a mass bounce for just 4 mana (with 3 opponents), leaving you enough to rebuild first, and being able to be cast much faster, making up slightly for the sorcery speed.
Or Crush of Tentacles , 6 mana? 5 mana and an 8/8, it needs to be in a deck with enough cheap drops to hit surge to be worth it, but an option.
Devastation Tide is a personal favorite, if you run Aminatou, Brainstorm , a lot of scry, Mystical Tutor , Long-Term Plans , Jace, the Mind Sculptor , or are lucky, it is a 2 mana bounce everything. Really strong, however, sorcery (unless you cast it with Miracle on an opponents turn.
Run really high mana cards? Displacement Wave can be better,
Like a big creature attached? Kederekt Leviathan . It even comboes with flicker effects, or can be repeated for 2 mana with an effect like Animate Dead or 3 mana at instant speed whenever with Necromancy in black/blue.
Only need to target one player for political reasons? River's Rebuke .
A lot of one color in the meta? Wash Out
Artifacts/Enchantments? Reduce to Dreams
Even outside of bounce effects, Ixidron can do work xD
Point is, there are options. Even outside of blue, sweepers that can get around the normal protection is seriously strong. Terminus , Hallowed Burial , along with most mass exile effects in white from Play of the Game to Final Judgement / Descend upon the Sinful to the new Urza's Ruinous Blast , etc. Mercilous Eviction in W/B, the -x/-x effects in black like Toxic Deluge or Black Sun's Zenith , etc. in any color, Perilous Vault exists.
These are half of why I think Cyclonic Rift is overrated. Not because it isn't great at what it does, but that it isn't that much better than the rest.
The other half is simple.
Every color (sorry colorless) has answers to Cyclonic Rift off the top of my head.
Black? Many lists abuse cards like Inquisition of Kozilek or other discard to remove powerful cards from opposing decks.
Green? Ugh... Yeah, I guess some colors don't have answers...
(Gutteral Response if they ever make hybrid legal in mono-colored xD)
That's all. Thoughts?
7 months ago
Maybe slot out Dreamstone Hedron because it is on the high end for mana rocks and you already have a couple of mana doublers and less expensive CMC rocks. I feel that unless you are just wanting people to completely despise you Winter Orb can be a card you remove. Meteor Golem could be a decent swap since it is a single target elimination of a permanent, which may not always be needed. I feel like Coastal Breach is a little unnecessary since you already have Nevinyrral's Disk and Cyclonic Rift and which you can Mystical Tutor for or if you'd want to add Merchant Scroll to the deck you can also drop Evacuation .
9 months ago
I just recently built this deck and and have been play testing it for a bit.
Unblockables and ninjas go hand in hand for getting pokes in however once the ninjas are on the table in becomes very hard for them to repeatedly connect turn after turn as they are quite weak. Cards like Wingcrafter, Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive, Thassa, God of the Sea, Wonder, Key to the City, Cover of Darkness, and Shizo, Death's Storehouse can all grant evasion to your ninjas after they've landed.
The other way to help your ninjas get through is by resetting them by bouncing them to hand and re ninjitsuing them in. You can return them via board wipes like Whelming Wave, Coastal Breach, Devastation Tide, and Wash Out or you can pick them up one at a time via Quickling, Cavern Harpy, Faerie Impostor, Equilibrium, etc. The latter is more mana intensive and cards that are required to have other creatures in play can be clunky so be warned.
Lastly a hidden tech I haven't seen anyone using: Dawn of the Dead. Thanks to it's old text we can avoid the downside of exiling our reanimated creature by making sure it isn't in play during the end step by picking it up with ninjitsu.
This Yuriko Primer helped me a ton while building my deck. There are tons of tips and tricks discussed in these forums such as using Emerge, exploit, and other niche cards.
11 months ago
I don't know what your budget is, but "sweepers" are always good, even in token decks. If you can, definitely play Cyclonic Rift, and maybe River's Rebuke, AEtherize, Coastal Breach, Engulf the Shore, Evacuation, Inundate, Kederekt Leviathan.
1 year ago
How does Transcendence kill someone? You can only enchant yourself with it, so I can't see how it will affect other players unless you Donate it (maybe I'm just not understanding a rule here). Actually, if you want to go for the meme, you could actually run Donate, which also combos with your Celestial Dawn to stop a non-white player from producing any colored mana (because any of the white mana they would produce with their new plains would instead be colorless, as white is outside of their commanders color identity).
If your play group plays lots of Voltron, Fumble could be good, although with your low creature count you would likely just be giving those equipment to different player.
Maybe I'm biased towards land destruction because a lot of the time when I use it, my friends have ramped out stupid amounts of mana, and then the rest of their deck is thin on lands and they have an extremely hard time dropping lands each turn from that point on. I also mainly run mass land destruction in my Nahiri, the Lithomancer deck once I've got some type of board set up, so I get how it works in a more aggressive shell, whereas you're using it in a control sell, so I might not understand how it would feel in that type of deck. Still, I'd recommend you give it a shot; a board wipe like Supreme Verdict and Armageddon at 8 mana essentially resets the game, and with your decks land count I imagine that you'll have an easier time recovering from this than your opponents (as in, you will likely be able to drop lands more consistently than they will).
I stil don't know if Darksteel Forge is worth it. Does the 9 mana investment usually pay off? Like 11/14 of your artifacts mana rocks, and by the time you can cast a 9 mana spell you probably aren't in dire need of mana rocks anymore. On the other hand, if your playgroup does run a lot of multi-artifact nukes, are you really dropping Darksteel Forge in time (before the artifact nuke) to save your mana rocks that have come out? But you would know how effective its been better than me so if you think its pulling its pretty heavy weight, then I'm all for it.
Sun Titan is a pretty good creature as well, can grab back any destroyed artifacts or fetchlands and such.
Hushwing Gryff is also as good as a counterspell sometimes, if your group runs a lot of enters the battlefield creatures.
Thats all I got for now!
Coastal Breach occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%