If I chose the creature type of shapeshifter for Arcane Adaptation's first ability then turned into a creature (thus turning it a shapeshifter) then copied it onto another creature using Shapesharer, what would be the result?
Asked by JoyTheEnbySliverLover 3 years ago
Just an interaction I'm not sure on and got curious about. I don't know where to begin with it as the ruling is confusing me. The assumption I've made from the rules is:
Arcane Adaptation requires it to enter the battlefield to choose a creature type so I am thinking I wouldn't be able to choose another creature type for the copy I made with Shapesharer as it doesn't enter the battlefield but, as far as I can tell, the choice I made for the original Arcane Adaptation isn't copyable either.
If I'm right, would that mean the copy has no effect? Correct me if my assumption is wrong and tell me what would actually happen in the scenario I pose in this question. Thanks for your time and help.
JoyTheEnbySliverLover says... #2
Boza - I meant if I made Arcane Adaptation into a creature like say Starfield of Nyx and selected shapeshifter for Arcane Adaptation's first ability. If I then copied Arcane Adaptation onto another shapeshifter using Shapesharer, what would happen to the copy?
July 15, 2020 7:22 a.m.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #3
You're right that the creature turned into a copy of Arcane Adaptation by Shapesharer won't really do anything. The creature type you chose as the original Adaptation entered the battlefield isn't one of its copiable values. Since the other creature became a copy of Adaptation instead of entering the battlefield as a copy, you don't get to make a choice for the first ability, so the second ability doesn't have any effect.
July 15, 2020 10 a.m.
Tylord2894 says... #4
ThatGuy_OhWhatsHisName TL;DR, the creature that you make into a copy of Arcane Adaptation will be a 3/3 blue enchantment creature, Shapeshifter with 3 CMC (provided you are using Starfield of Nyx). The answer is very different if you use something like Dance of the Mance. The copy of the animated Adaptation does not have the ability to grant an additional creature type like the original.
When you turn something into a copy of something else, you are replacing the copiable values of the original thing with those of the second thing. In this case, your, say, Bear Cub will become an Adaption. These values are (mostly) what's printed on the card, cost, abilities, P/T, etc. At this point, the Cub is an exact copy of Adaptation, ie just an enchantment. The next thing that we are concerned with is changes to types. Normally, these changes are considered in timestamp (chronological) order. That is not the case here as there is a dependency. So, let's consider what effects are trying to affect your copy of Adaption (in timestamp order).
- Arcane Adaptation is trying to give all creatures the Shapeshifter creature type.
- Starfield of Nyx is trying to turn all non-Aura enchantments into creatures.
I've quoted the rule for determining what makes a dependency below. In this case, we are only concerned with the second condition.
Here, Adaptation has a dependency on Starfield, so we will apply Starfield's effect first. This will make the original and copy of Adaptation into a 3/3 enchantment creature. Then, the Adaptation effect is applied, giving both Adaptations the Shapeshift creature type.
The key difference between using Dance of the Mance and Starfield of Nyx is that Dance only affects the enchantments that it brings back. Using Dance here would mean that the copy of Adaptation wouldn't become a creature.
I know that's a lot of information, and I skipped over talking about "layers" directly, but I hope this helps!!
613.8. Within a layer or sublayer, determining which order effects are applied in is sometimes done using a dependency system. If a dependency exists, it will override the timestamp system.
613.8a An effect is said to “depend on” another if (a) it’s applied in the same layer (and, if applicable, sublayer) as the other effect; (b) applying the other would change the text or the existence of the first effect, what it applies to, or what it does to any of the things it applies to; and (c) neither effect is from a characteristic-defining ability or both effects are from characteristic-defining abilities. Otherwise, the effect is considered to be independent of the other effect.
Boza says... #1
The question is a bit confusing. But from what I understand:
You animate Arcane Adaptation with lets say Dance of the Manse. It enters the battlefield and you name "shapeshifter" with it. Since it is also a creature, you activate Shapesharer to make the Adaptation become a Squire an opponent controls, erasing all its text. At the beginning of your next untap step, the creature will revert to its previous state (a 4/4 shapeshifter creature).
July 15, 2020 6:38 a.m.