First Saga counter before SBAs?

Asked by KablamoBoom 4 years ago

Will Sagas get their first Lore counter with, say, Opalescence, Godhead of Awe, and Night of Souls' Betrayal in play? "As a saga enters, 'Special Action' occurs" seems a bit ambiguous compared to state-based actions. I lean towards yes, because 714.3a states "as it enters". But could someone wiser clarify?

Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #1

Yes. If you put a counter on something "as it enters the battlefield" then the counter is on it by the time it's actually on the battlefield. There's no period of time (not even a very short one) where it's on the battlefield but hasn't gotten the counter yet.

In your example the Saga will enter with a counter, the first chapter ability will trigger, the Saga will be put into the graveyard for having 0 toughness, and then the trigger will finally be put onto the stack.

March 3, 2020 2:37 p.m.

Rhadamanthus, everything you said was correct, however on the part that it dies depends on timestamps, since both Opalescence and Godhead of Awe set P/T in layer 7b.

If Godhead entered most recently, then yes the saga would die, however if Opalescence entered most recently, it would have p/t equal to whatever its cmc is.

Because Opalescence applies it’s type changing effect in layer 4, the enchantments it makes into creatures are susceptible to the P/T setting effects in 7b.

Just my two cents!

March 3, 2020 11:08 p.m.

Rhadamanthus says... #3

Raging_Squiggle If the timestamps are such that the saga doesn't immediately die from SBAs then there's no reason to ask the original question. However, that's still a very good point to bring up because it's not clear from KablamoBoom's question whether they're aware of that possibility.

March 3, 2020 11:52 p.m.

KablamoBoom says... #4

I'm aware of the layering and timestamp issues.

I made up the whole scenario anyways because the actual problem has to do with a certain legendary saga and Copy Enchantment. Retrospectively I could have specified Clever Impersonator and Leyline of Singularity but brain no thinky.

March 5, 2020 4:32 a.m.

Rhadamanthus says... #5

You could also have just asked a question about the actual situation you were trying to figure out...

March 5, 2020 9:06 a.m.

KablamoBoom says... #6

I could not. The card is not linkable, tragically.

March 5, 2020 9:10 a.m.

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