Erratic cyclops
Asked by burliestzero 5 years ago
If I have Erratic Cyclops and cast Dive Down making it an 1/11. Then cast Invert / Invent with no responses making it 11/2 and then swing and before damage cast Hypothesizzle would it become a 16/2 or 11/7? I have been told both and confused with explanations.
In short, you will always apply changes to power and toughness (+X/+X and -X/-X effects) before you switch power and toughness.
December 6, 2018 8:31 a.m.
16/2 is the correct P/T value. Now, I think the confusion stems from the text on InVert - switching power and toughness does not mean the creature's toughness is now determiened by the number that used to define power. It simply means to take the two numbers and exchange their place.
So, the Cyclops will first become a 1/11 after Dive Down fully resolves, then a 2/11 when its trigger from casting InVert resolves, then invert will resolve, switching those two around to make it 11/2. Finally, you cast Hypothesizzle, triggering cyclops and giving 5 more power to make it a 16/2.
Sidenote: Since and cyclops has trample, any damage done by Hypothesizzle to potential blockers is increasing the damage of Cyclops, since there is less toughness left to block it.
December 6, 2018 8:47 a.m.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #4
11/7 is the correct value. For whatever reason the first two responses forgot to include that detail but that's what they were trying to explain.
P/T switching effects are always applied last when determining a creature's power and toughness. In your example, Erratic Cyclops is getting a total of +7/+0 from its own triggers (Dive Down, Invert, Hypothesizzle) and +0/+3 from Dive Down's effect, bringing it up to 7/11 before you apply Invert's effect and switch it to 11/7.
December 6, 2018 10:49 a.m.
burliestzero - in the future, please be sure to hit the "Mark as Answer" button appearing next to each responsive post when your question is resolved. This helps keep the Rules Q&A section clutter-free and helps future users quickly identify the correct answer.
As this has been answered for a couple days, I have gone ahead and marked an answer as accepted. If you could try to remember to do this in the future, that would be appreciated.
Gidgetimer says... #1
I assume you meant some other card besides Hypothesizzle, but whatever card you meant isn't going to change the basis of the answer, simply the numbers.
An object's characteristics start with what is printed on the card and then continuous effects are applied in a series of layers in order. Layer 7 deals with power/toughness changes and has a series of sublayers that are applied in order. Erratic Cyclops' ability and other spells/abilities that modify P/T without setting it to a specific value are applied in layer 7c. Effects that switch P/T like Invert / Invent are applied later in 7e. The full comprehensive rules reference for layers is rule 613.
December 5, 2018 7:56 p.m.