Card Interaction Between Sundial of the Infinite + Whip of Erebos
Asked by xseiber 8 years ago
Inspired by the Geist of Saint Traft + Sundial of the Infinite combo. This is also a bit more than just card interaction; the combo is Sundial of the Infinite + Whip of Erebos , if I was to use Whip of Erebos to bring back a brosef, let us say Glistener Elf, and then I use Sundial of the Infinite to end my turn without heading into my own end phase/step, what about my opponent's?
Let me make it clearer, say that the combo works and my Glistener Elf is now still alive and well during my opponent's turn because of Sundial of the Infinite, but during (at the beginning) his end phase/step, would Glistener Elf be exiled as per Whip of Erebos's effect (found before the very last sentence)?
I did not know that it sets up a DTA. Figured it was just for Rebound. Derp derp derp. Thanks. +1
October 29, 2015 12:19 a.m.
TheRedMage says... #3
Rebound does set up a DTA but many other cards do, for example all those "slowtrips" from back in the day (Urza's Bauble, for example).
You can usually tell because the word "at" is present ("Exile it at the beginning of the next end step") - "at" is a special word in magic, and is one of three words that pretty much always mean a triggered ability (possibly of the delayed persuasion, like in this case, but not only) is involved. The other two are "when" and "whenever", obviously.
October 29, 2015 12:38 a.m.
Raging_Squiggle says... #5
Regarding the Geist of Saint Traft + Sundial of the Infinite combo. I may be wrong, but I don't think it works.. Because the ability reads "at end of combat". It doesn't stop just cause you exile the DTA. Same reasoning with Ball Lightning. The DTA may be exiled on your turn, but it'll just happen again on the following turn's end step. So what's stopping Geist's DTA from triggering again on the Next turn's end of combat?
October 29, 2015 3:03 a.m.
TheRedMage says... #6
Yeah, when it doesn't specify "next" a triggered ability (including a DTA) that triggers at the beginning of a particular step or phase will go on the stack every time that step or phase rolls in. The difference is between "Exile X at the beginning of the next end step" vs "Exile X at the beginning of the end step". That means Geist of Saint Traft will indeed atmpt to exile his token again next end of combat step, and next one, and the one after, until he succeeds.
TheRedMage says... Accepted answer #1
So...
Whip of Erebos sets up a delayed trigger that will go on the stack at the beginning of the next end step. Not this turn's end step, but whichever end step is the next one.
Let's say in your Main Phase you activate Whip of Erebos and bring back Glistener Elf. Then, still in your Main Phase, you activate Sundial of the Infinite and end the turn. The end step at the end of your opponent's turn will be the "the next end step" and the delayed trigger will go on the stack, exiling Glistener Elf.
However, fear not, for there is a way to make this work. What you can do is go to your own end step, let the Whip of Erebos delayed trigger go on the stack, and, with the trigger on the stack, activate Sundial of the Infinite to end the turn, which results on the trigger ability being exiled and never resolving. Whip of Erebos only puts the trigger on the stack once - at the beginning of the next end step - and doesn't care whether it resolves or not. If you do things this way, Whip of Erebos will never trigger again and leave your Glistener Elf mostly alone.
I say "mostly alone" because it will still be subject to yhe replacement effect from Whip of Erebos that says that if the Glistener Elf is leaving the battlefield, it's going to get exiled. But the whip won't try to actively exile your dude again.
October 29, 2015 12:15 a.m. Edited.