Can Clone effects copy permanent bonuses?

Asked by UniqueUserID 7 years ago

I've been looking at the Clone rules on and was wondering if it really is as simple as just always copying the printed values.

If not what happens with permanent effects such as Cocoon, Riding the Dilu Horse and Brass-Talon Chimera effect? So I guess my questions are:

1) Will clone effects also take these new abilities into consideration? So if I clone Brass-Talon Chimera that has been "buffed" by a Tin-Wing Chimera what will the final cloned creature look like?

2) How about token effects that make clones? Such Twinflame? Is there any way to "cheat" a cloned token that also gets a permanent bonus?

3) How does giving these permanent abilities work with creatures who can copy constantly such as Artisan of Forms? If Artisan of Forms is being buffed by Riding the Dilu Horse and then later she copies a different creature, does she lose the Riding the Dilu Horse bonus? Does this even use layers?

GearNoir says... Accepted answer #1

The short answer is "No"; Clone only makes a copy of the original creature or token. None of the extra abilities or effects you attached or enchanted the original creature with will be copied, whether the effect is permanent for the original or not.

To your second question, the copy can still receive buffs from things like anthems or enchantments that you specifically cast on it, as long as it is a valid target.

To your third question, Artisan of Forms will retain any buffs you give it when it copies, as long as it doesn't change zones in any way.

Relevant Gatherer info:

• If the chosen creature is copying something else (for example, if the chosen creature is another Clone), then your Clone enters the battlefield as whatever the chosen creature copied.
• If the chosen creature is a token, Clone copies the original characteristics of that token as stated by the effect that put it onto the battlefield. Clone is not a token.
• Clone copies exactly what was printed on the original creature and nothing more (unless that creature is copying something else or is a token; see below). It doesnt copy whether that creature is tapped or untapped, whether it has any counters on it or Auras attached to it, or any non-copy effects that have changed its power, toughness, types, color, or so on.

November 12, 2016 12:41 p.m.

Rhadamanthus says... #2

For the last part of your last question: yes, layers are very important here. Copy effects are applied in Layer 1, ability granting/removing effects in Layer 6, and P/T changing effects in Layer 7. This is why Artisan of Forms will keep any ability and P/T buffs you've already given to it if it changes into a copy of a different creature.

November 12, 2016 1:01 p.m.