Are game actions which have gone through a replacement effect still 'caused' by the same source?
Asked by Yesterday 4 years ago
Pretty sure I've asked similar questions to this in the past, and that the answer is still yes. But I still get fuzzy on this.
New card, Unpredictable Cyclone, can't tag it yet.
"If a cycling ability of another nonland card would cause you to draw a card, instead exile cards from the top of your library until you exile a card that shares a card type with the cycled card. You may cast that card without paying its mana cost. Then put the exiled cards that weren't cast this way on the bottom of your library in a random order."
If you cycle a nonland card while you have this new enchantment and a Thought Reflection out (and apply Reflection's replacement ability first), would the resulting two card draws each be caused by a cycling ability, and so result in two free spells?
Tylord2894 says... #3
I should have added this as an addendum, but there is a chance that is not correct. I can't find an effect that is worded remotely close to that of Unpredictable Cyclone. It might cause more rules to be made (like much of this set), so keep an eye on the release notes. That said, I am 95% sure what I stated earlier will still ring true.
April 9, 2020 3:16 p.m.
Barring rulings to come out when Unpredictable Cyclone is officially released, Tylord2894 is correct.
Unpredictable Cyclone and Thought Reflection both involve replacement effects. Reflection modifies any card-drawing event, and Cyclone modifies card draws caused by cycling abilities of nonland cards. If you cycle a nonland card, then the card-drawing event will be affected by both replacement effects, and as the affected player you would get to choose which order to apply them in.
If you apply Thought Reflection first, the single card draw becomes two. Then Unpredictable Cyclone modifies both card draws (because they are still caused by a nonland card cycle; the source hasn't changed), resulting in the two free spells as anticipated.
If you apply the Cyclone's effect first, though, the card draw is replaced by a non-card-drawing event, and Thought Reflection will not have anything to modify, so you would only get one free spell.
Tylord2894 says... Accepted answer #1
Yes, if Though Reflection's replacement affect is applied first, you would get two free spells. The "source" of an ability if the object that created it. Since Thought Reflection isn't creating a new ability, rather just altering what will happen, the source of the cycling effect is still a card with cycling.
113.7. The source of an ability is the object that generated it. The source of an activated ability on the stack is the object whose ability was activated. The source of a triggered ability (other than a delayed triggered ability) on the stack, or one that has triggered and is waiting to be put on the stack, is the object whose ability triggered. To determine the source of a delayed triggered ability, see rules 603.7d–f.
April 9, 2020 2:18 p.m.