How Will Norse-Inspired Gods Be Unique?
Posted on April 18, 2017, 9:29 p.m. by DemonDragonJ
With Amonkhet soon to be released, I believe that it is safe to presume that there shall eventually be a block inspired by Norse mythology, and that such a block is likely to have gods of its own. The major question that I have is how those gods shall be distinguished from the gods of Theros and Amonkhet.
Given that all the deities who have appeared thus far have been indestructible, I believe that Nordic-themed gods will be, as well. Also, since every mono-colored god has had an activated ability, I believe that Norse-inspired gods shall also have such abilities. Finally, since the gods of Theros are creatures, and the gods of Amonkhet can attack and block, only when certain conditions are fulfilled, I believe that it is safe to presume that the gods of a Nordic-themed plane will conditional abilities as well. To be more specific, I believe that they shall be indestructible only under certain conditions, because, unlike the deities of Greek mythology, who were truly immortal and could not be killed (although they could be wounded), the gods of Norse mythology could, indeed, be killed (although it was highly unlikely that any mortal could do so, as they were still beings of immense power).
What does everyone else say about this? What are your predictions for how Norse-inspired deities shall be different from the deities of Theros and Amonkhet?
I would steer you towards the Sagas if you want to know more about part of my heritage.
C/P linky. Tapped Out doesn't like to let me hyperlink anything...
April 18, 2017 10:42 p.m.
I should inform you that the Norse Gods won't be indestructible. They're actually mortal.
April 18, 2017 11:09 p.m.
they could still gain indestructible on the card to show that they are powerful and hard to destroy. maybe something like the myojin cycle from kamigawa like Myojin of Night's Reach, being able to have indestructible but using divinity counters or something equivalent
April 18, 2017 11:27 p.m.
We made a short thingy about that in the card creation challenge... I guess the activation of the card would be linked to equipped artifact...
For example, an Odin-based god that requires an Artifact Equipment equipped to be able to attack.
I also think that they might not give these gods Indestructible. See "Ragnarok".
April 18, 2017 11:49 p.m.
I like the idea of needing an equipment. Many of the norse gods had their legendary weapon (thor and mjolnir, odin and gungnir and so on). And as the dwarves in norse mythology are meant to be master artificers, that would fit as well.
And though they were mortals or not, it feels weird to have god creatures that can be killed by a simple doomblade.
April 19, 2017 6:02 a.m.
Yeah, I think y'all are on the right track. Conditional indestructibility seems like it's the way to give a feeling of Norse-ness while still unifying with the god creature type. However, I'm with the previous poster that it would be a poor flavor call to be able to Doom Blade a god.
Maybe a "sacrifice this creature when" condition? To show how the Norse pantheon was generally noble and selfless? (I'll admit, my Norse mythology needs some brushing-up.) Like the W one could be "sacrifice Odin when you control no other creatures", or something.
I feel like any condition for turning indestructibility "on" has got to be pretty powerful. An undercosted creature that can't get indestructible is just asking for Fatal Push. Maybe it'll be a Yahenni-like "indestructible until EOT" clause.
April 19, 2017 8:34 a.m.
You could let the Norse gods have Hexproof. That way they wouldn't die to cards like Doom Blade or Murder, but would die to board wipes like Damnation and Wrath of God which fits the whole "Ragnarok" idea.
Also, I wouldn't like to see the Norse gods have any attack or blocking restrictions. I would prefer to see them have crap Power/Toughness until you equipped them with their signature weapon.
So, for example, Thor and Mjolnir could look something like:
Thor, God of Thunder
Legendary Creature - God
Whenever Thor, God of Thunder enters the battlefield, search your library for an Equipment card named Mjolnir, reveal it, and put it in your hand.
Equip costs you pay to cost less for Equipments targeting this card.
Legendary Artifact - Equipment
When Mjolnir enters the battlefield, deal 2 damage to target creature.
Equip only to a God creature.
Equipped creature gets +3/+3, flying, and trample.
So, this gives you a 4/5 Flying, Trample, Hexproof by turn 5. While Thor would be impervious to removal spells but can die to battle. Mjolnir gives him a huge boost, but can be destroyed with card effects, and would subsequently weaken him. I think that fits Norse mythology pretty well.
April 19, 2017 9:08 a.m.
I like the idea. Feels fitting. I'm unsure about the 'search for [name]'thing though. It would be too powerful without restriction i guess, but this looks weird. Maybe something like 'search for a legendary equiptment'? This would work very similar, but has the upside of the gods synergizing in that thor could find odins gungnir and vice versa. And on top, it would have some backwards synergy with things like Godsend.
April 19, 2017 9:31 a.m.
Yeah, I wasn't sure exactly how that would play out. But, I felt that restricting the tutor ability to a single artifact would reduce its effectiveness in the long run. You couldn't grab any legendary equipment, you could only grab the one that goes with your god because they are connected.
See, I'm not sure how I would feel about them being able to tutor up ANY Legendary Artifact. I'm afraid that could get out of hand if not balanced properly. However, it would make them an incredible versatile archetype with dozens of ways to play and combo. It might also give Equipments an actual presence in a Standard format.
April 19, 2017 9:42 a.m.
Any legendary artifact would be too powerful for sure. But legendary equipment is a not so big group of cards. It would include jitte though, so this seems problematic.
Giving the norse weapons a subtype sounds to much like 'arcane' from kamigawa. But 'search for name' has the potential to be horribly confusing for new players because of the amount of made up scandinavian names in text boxes.
This could be solved by supercharging the gods when equipped with something legendary, but not only with their very own weapon.
April 19, 2017 10:10 a.m.
Hey, yeah. I really like the idea of giving them a subtype, like "Legendary Artifact - Divine Equipment." That would limit the tutor abilities to only those Equipments from the set. It would also make sense why non-god creatures couldn't equip them.
You might also have each god's unique equipment have Equip if its targeting their specific owner (i.e: Mjolnir cost to equip to a god, but to Thor specifically).
April 19, 2017 10:23 a.m.
I wouldn't say they can be destroyed...yes I know about ragnarok, but hear me out.
The only time some of the Norse gods are killed is during the endtimes, and then only when they face other extremely powerful divine and (semi)immortal beings: the world eating serpent and Fenris, to name but a few (okay, Baldur is killed by a plant, but in defence: it was wielded by a god). No other threat can actually kill them (Baldur actually resurrects be it after Ragnarok).
So I would like to see a condition that a Norse god is indestructible unless an opponent has a god in play, or something. (and, an exile always helps :) )
April 19, 2017 2:54 p.m.
I like the idea of underpowered gods with equipment to make them better. Maybe give them a pay-and-tap activated ability rather than a tutor upon entry, given the problems it could introduce. I'd like them all to be multicolored, as Theros had both multicolored and monocolored, and Amonkhet is probably only monocolored. Also, unrelated, the sweeper of the set should totally be similar to, but, sticking to Wizards' idea of not copying from outside sources, not exactly called Ragnark
April 19, 2017 8:36 p.m.
@GobboE: Loki was actually born of giants... so considering him a God (mistletoe-wielding god), despite all the literature, is a risky move. Not trying to be nagging, it's just that I find this mythology charmingly interesting hahahah
@ERoss8: maybe that and pay cost could be to put the artifact from your hand into the battlefield... making it almost as if the God creature is casting/summoning it's weapon by himself. I think it's flavorful.
Also, the wipe could be multicolored, and called "Korangar, god's demise" hahah
April 19, 2017 8:54 p.m.
@ Busse : No probs, happy to discus the subject with someone :). To return to the subject: Loki dit not kill Baldur, but he delivered the tool to kill him though (mistletoe). Hodur (yes, Hodor) the god killed Baldur. That said, I would like to argue that Loki is divine - just not in the christian sense: he has godlike powers, (near) immortality, and performs godlike feats.
April 20, 2017 5:58 a.m.
I don't think there should necessarily be a set of equipment to make each god "good" - that makes them awful for limited play.
I like the hexproof idea to make sure they don't get Fatal Pushed, yet can also die to big creatures or wraths.
April 20, 2017 10:13 a.m.
McSwagglepants, maybe make the equipment common, but only have a good effect if equipped to a God?Ex. Equipped creature gets +1/+1. If equipped creature is a God, it gets +3/+4 and flying and First strike instead Equip Something like this would make them not great, but playable at common, and synergize well with the Gods
April 20, 2017 2:09 p.m.
Okay, I am going to add another thing: the Norse Gods are not that different from the Egyptian ones if one looks past the animal's heads. Indeed, thre powers are comparable and they both can die (Osiris, Set in the Egyptian pantheon to name but a few). So I do not like the hexproof idea very much, I like the conditional indestructibility much more. Odin could be indestructible when there's a certain amount of creatures (being a god of war), Thor when an opponent is dealt damage, Loki when a sorcery is played, or something like that.
April 21, 2017 3:12 a.m.
What if they created token equipment that would come attached to them and they could only attack/block while their equipment is still on equipped to them.
May 25, 2017 10:18 a.m.
So I've been digging through the Norse pantheon, and trying to set up color-wheel-to-nordic-god translations. I'd like to see them mono colored, but with off-color activation, or the ability to take action when an off-color creature is untapped or something. This would allow for more multi-color gods, but wouldn't lock them into niche roles.
therefore, just going by their personalities and actions, here's a rough idea on color-wheel-to-nordic-god translations.
Odin - While he shares knowledge with humanity, and is a god of death, Odin is first and foremost a seeker of knowledge. Blue makes the most sense, but I could see white or black activated abilities.
Thor - A fighter, who confronts those who do act dishonoribly. willing to act in deception in desperation (see loki and thor's wedding party to recover mjolnir). Red, with touches of black for deception in self interest, and white for sense of companionship.
Freyja - Claimer of the dead, not ruler of them. Valkyries, those who died worthy deaths are allowed to ascend. white, with strong red color for flavor.
Frigg - foreknowledge & wisdom. Odin's wife. knows the future, but tells no one. Blue, possibly green and white activation.
Loki - shapeshifter, god of mischief. gets self into as many problems as he gets anyone else out of. black, but with touches of green or blue - he is curious, and shapeshifting typically is green.
Hel - Goddess of the afterlife, ruler of the realm of the dead. daughter of loki, but not beholden to him. depicted as hedonistic at times, but shows compassion to her fellow goddesses. black, touches of white for compassion?
Freyr - God of fertility and weather, said to bestow peace and pleasure on mortals. green, likely with white effects.
Skadi - Goddess of hunt, winter, skiing, and mountains. green makes most sense, with strong red
Njordr - god of sea, wind, fishing, wealth, and crop fertility. blue makes most sense at first, but white could also work without too much issue. make it one, splash the other.
Baldr - favored son, tricked to death by loki, resides in afterlife(under hel, not Freyja or Odin. norse afterlife is apparently very complicated), avenged by brothers, possibly a herald of ragnarok. Honestly not sure on this one. depending on what story this is based on, he could go black (for vengance), white (for martyrdom), red (for chaos, end times).
May 27, 2017 8:14 p.m.
Giant wall of text aside, I would like to see them do a pair of deities for each color, and each pair has a different partner color - example, pair Odin (blue, black activation) with Freyja (blue, white activation) as a god / goddess pair.
alternatively, set them up as (white, blue activation) and (blue, white activation). just a thought.
May 27, 2017 8:18 p.m.
You know, back in the day we considered Ice Age to be the Norse-inspired set, though it was less in-your-face obvious than the nowadays THIS IS GREEK MYTHOLOGY (with a MtG twist!)-Theros and same for Egypt Amonkhet. And I guess Kamigawa for Japanese/Oriental myths. I kind of preferred the more subtle approach but these recent ones aren't terrible. I'm not looking forward to a Norse set, I wish they would not go there.
Alas, the present trend and popularity (I assume they are popular) of Theros and Amonkhet makes it likely. I agree they might not be indestructible this time as (aside from Balder) they were quite killable. I don't think they are going to do direct conversions, more like mergers of several deities so not going too much in depth but I think multicolour would be most appropriate.
May 31, 2017 5:59 p.m.
The idea of a god which is only good with it's spefic equipment doesn't sound great because the weapon would have to be a Mythic, which would make people like me who like to buy the odd booster unhappy. Imagine getting a Mythic which can't do anything without another mythic. I think they should use charge counters. EI:
Whenever this creature attacks, put a charge counter on it. Then, if there are five or more charge counters on it, remove all charge counters from it. It gets trample, lifelink and deathtouch until end of turn.
This would pair well with beat-down decks, but not be overpowered. This would be great if they them made cards do distribut charge counters aroud. Would bring interesting strategies to Magic.