how much impact do people think foil will have in pauper

Pauper forum

Posted on Nov. 30, 2018, 6:47 a.m. by sten94

the format is full of cheap effective counter magic is Foil going to see big showing now that it is common, and if so what decks. My first thought was that possibly in the Delver of Secrets  Flip variants in the format, But Foil isn't force of will and the card disadvantage is a much bigger deal here. is it possible that control deck can make up for the card disadvantage in the long run. just wondering what the general thoughts are in the community.

Boza says... #2

There are two decks that really benefit from foil:

UB Delve(r) where discarding cards to counterspells is the name of the game.
Reanimator - where discarding cards to counterspells is beneficial.

UR Delver does not want 4 foils, one of the above decks might.

November 30, 2018 7:12 a.m.

sten94 says... #3

I never thought about UB delver. that's quite good. do you think it will be particularly format changing and shift the meat much or will it just be a decent addition to some slightly less played decks

November 30, 2018 7:33 a.m.

SynergyBuild says... #4

Nah, 3 cards to counter 1 isn't gamebreaking.

Useful, yes, but the meta won't be affected much.

November 30, 2018 8:30 a.m.

sten94 says... #5

are control decks better now. Like I said they seem to be the best decks at mitigating the card disadvantage. I think i'm correct in assuming control isn't the best in pauper right now.

November 30, 2018 8:59 a.m.

SynergyBuild says... #6

Well, not blue-based control at least. You can't really take a black-based control list and just through in 4x Foil

November 30, 2018 9:04 a.m.

sten94 says... #7

are most control decks in pauper base black

November 30, 2018 9:06 a.m.

SynergyBuild says... #8

Blue-Black or Mono-Black, with some in Jeskai, Rakdos, Grixis, and Izzet

Really, blue has some reasonably good card draw, specifically Augur of Bolas, Mulldrifter, Preordain, Ponder, and interaction in the form of Counterspell and the occasional Deprive. Otherwise, they don't have a great set of wincons, sweepers, or removal, so they need another color to get those.

In comparison, black has Gurmag Angler, a great wincon, and the best removal in the forms of Evincar's Justice, Echoing Decay, Shrivel, Pestilence, Cuombajj Witches, Disfigure, Chainer's Edict, Oubliette, Doom Blade, they have lifegain, discard like Duress, Distress, Chittering Rats, card draw like Phyrexian Rager, Thorn of the Black Rose, Sign in Blood, and mono-colored payoffs like Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Tendrils of Corruption. There are even more great control cards from hate like Nihil Spellbomb, efficient spells like Cartouche of Ambition that just do a lot, land destruction like Choking Sands, more discard that is splashable like Addle, and the other following cards:

Diabolic Edict, Wrench Mind, Raven's Crime, Innocent Blood (for creatureless lists), Dead Weight, Crypt Incursion, Complete Disregard, Nausea, Reaping the Graves, Undying Evil, Read the Bones, Divest, Rancid Earth, Icequake, Dusk Legion Zealot, Okiba-Gang Shinobi, Tragic Slip, Crypt Rats, Stinkweed Imp

That isn't to say a good mix of both isn't the best option, it probably is. You lose the mono-black payoffs, but get Probe, Forbidden Alchemy, Soul Manipulation. Really though, black is more useful than blue.

November 30, 2018 9:35 a.m.

Dracoson says... #9

Realistically, I don't think Foil is going to be making any kind of significant impact on the format. You're going to have to be aware of it, especially at first as there are people that are going to try it, but ultimately it comes down to one thing. Foil isn't a control card. It's a combo card, and Pauper isn't a combo heavy format. Decks like Izzet Blitz and Inside Out are the extant decks that are going to be able to take the most advantage of it. Both of those decks need reactive cards to protect the combo when they are very tight on mana. Both already run Gush which is one of the better partner cards to Foil. UB Delver was mentioned, and maybe it replaces Spell Pierce as a one-of counter, but that deck wants value out of cards beyond discarding. It's a tempo deck that leans towards control. It generally can't afford to 3-for-1 itself. It needs all its resources to get ahead and stay ahead.

Bottom Line: As the OP said, Foil is not Force of Will, but beyond that, Pauper is not a format that has a need for that kind of safety valve. It's going to see too much play for awhile, but once the novelty wears off, it's going to end up where it should be, as a 1 or 2 of in a small group of decks.

December 4, 2018 11:21 a.m.

PooperDix says... #10

Considering everything already said here I agree for the most part. I don't think any of the decks mentioned could really benefit off of foil, maybe inside out, maybe UB Delve/r if gurmags in there. Foil dropped with a raven's crime, a ulamog's crusher, dragon breath, seems ok. While mono black is a good and can beat alot of other decks, Mono Blue is a strong deck as well, there have been plenty of nights of mono blue taking first prize at my LGS. There are alot of decks that can handle mono black also, such as mono Blue.

December 9, 2018 11:51 a.m.

PooperDix says... #11

Foil might spawn off some new ideas which is what I am hoping for, perhaps in a familiars deck along with resurrection throw in a couple copies of devious cover up. As I am typing all this I can't help but think of Groundskeeper/ Pulse of Murasa. Seems like Simic might have the best use of discarding without needing any other colors. It might be too much but a Bant build might take off with the above mentioned, 3 color is very advantageous and usually falls short a turn or two of being able to keep up, however green is good with ramp, white is cheap, and blue is no stranger to using life as a resource and getting started at turn 3, just thinking about all this Jank is making me think might as well make a tron Bant deck

December 9, 2018 12:07 p.m.

sten94 says... #12

the problem with putting cards like Groundskeeper and Pulse of Murasa in just to enable foil means that you are taking up slots in your 75 just enable on card in the deck if Groundskeeper and Pulse of Murasa have other synergies in the deck the it could work. the issue is that off the top of my head I can't think of any cards that synergies well with basic land been put into the yard at common. Pulse of Murasa is a bit diffrent as that is generally just a good card in certain deck like tron that you mentioned.

The only other card I can think of is Crop Rotation and that is only really half decent in a tron deck where you don't really care about getting the land back from it too much because you have hopefully made tron with it. also the tron mana base seems pretty strict on its mana base and don't know if it can afford to run a density of islands to make Foil worth it

December 9, 2018 11:58 p.m.

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