Why No Pack Rat?
Modern forum
Posted on Oct. 2, 2015, 7:50 p.m. by Serendipitous_Hummingbird
By all metrics it is an amazing card. Hold up mana for a counterspell, turn late game lands into creatures, and more importantly a win con that must be dealt with. Sure it dies to bolt, but so does Young Pyromancer. Is Pack Rat just a bomb without a home? Or am I missing something?
electromancer says... #3
I suppose you're looking for reasons outside of Maelstrom Pulse, which is definitely a fair question. It always felt a little too slow to me, so you'd probably need a pretty awesome control plan or something, in which case other cards are better.
October 2, 2015 7:58 p.m.
Ohthenoises says... #4
It's just that it's too slow.
You would have to play a 1/1 on turn 5 to be able to save yourself from Path or other removal, he fails the bolt test unless you have devoted 
into it, and Bile Blight/Maelstrom Pulse kill it dead. (The former wouldn't kill it if you had devoted the aforementioned mana.)
There are far better things you can do with in modern.
October 2, 2015 8:08 p.m.
Serendipitous_Hummingbird says... #5
I guess that's fair. Pity though, I like pack rat.
October 2, 2015 8:14 p.m.
electromancer says... #6
Training Grounds if you want to force it. Still there's better two card combos out there.
October 2, 2015 8:17 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
Here's the thing. Cards that require you to continually invest large amounts of resources are generally bad in efficient formats. Pack Rat demands enormous investment, and it's highly vulnerable. Sure, Young Pyromancer also dies to Lightning Bolt, but Young Pyromancer passively rewards you for playing your deck whereas Pack Rat requires you to stop playing your deck and start paying increments of 
. And the return on investment is simply too low.
October 2, 2015 8:17 p.m.
Don't forget that 
Control is a thing of late, and that one packs Detention Sphere, which most decks relying on can't answer (unless they also have 
). Even if they do, though, all of your tokens are toast.
October 2, 2015 8:18 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #9
Pack Rat is a huge bomb in the BGx mirror. However, people have found other options in extra Kommands and Outpost Siege and Chandra, which are better.
October 2, 2015 8:37 p.m.
Wizard_of_the_Broke says... #10
I think Pack Rat's potential is pretty much squashed by Zombie Infestation, which is harder to remove and more efficient. Few decks have extra cards to pitch all that often, and decks that can reliably produce extra cards (like anything running Life from the Loam) just prefer Infestation. Pack Rat is a decent option for BGx in some very grindy games, but that's about it.
October 2, 2015 8:57 p.m.
lemmingllama says... #12
Pack Rat does see some play in 8-rack lists, but that is because they don't want a hand. Other than that, it isn't really valuable enough to be a primary wincon. Pack Rat just takes too much initial investment to actually be powerful, especially in a fast format like Modern.
October 2, 2015 9:46 p.m.
Mmm... Extirpate and Surgical Extraction are both things that make rat decks not very scary.
October 2, 2015 10:37 p.m.
JakeHarlow says... #16
I play four as a win condition in an 8-rack-ish RB deck. It replaces Shrieking Affliction. Maybe that's a bad call because it does die to so much, and it does demand nearly all of your resources to win from, but I like it. I'm not very confident that it can be a format staple for Modern at this time, though. Perhaps not ever.
October 3, 2015 4:06 a.m.
SwaggyMcSwagglepants says... #17
I have a guy that plays Dimir Delver with Pack Rats, Thoughtseizes, Inquisitions, Bounce, Dismembers, etc. That's its home.
October 3, 2015 3:16 p.m.
Yeah, so Pack Rat is one of my win-cons and has been since I started playing Modern. (All of five months ago, that is.) It is indeed powerful in the right circumstances, but these are not all circumstances. See what you think: Dead Guy Ale v. 2.1
October 12, 2015 12:12 a.m.
Yeah, Pack Rat just doesn't fit in with the game-plan of most decks. I have a playset in my 8-rack deck, but that has already been mentioned. It is often the first card I side out though.
October 12, 2015 1:08 a.m.
Way late to this thread but I tried putting it in a Abzan token deck with Voice of Resurgence and Lingering Souls. Intangible Virtue makes it a little better.
November 11, 2015 10:51 a.m.
I run rats as a 3 of in my Dega midrange, and have been nothing but glad to see them every time I draw into one. im not gonna jam him out on turn two, this isn't standard, im going to do midrange things turn 1-3, like targeted discard, removal, Lily, and God willing, Bob. By the way, DC and pack rat are best friends, and a rat with 5 mana into an empty board ( RWB is really good at clearing boards) is a 0/6/12 clock that need an answer NOW. sure sweepers hit him, but mid to late game, I should have a decent idea whats in my opponents hand and play around it. keep in mind, pulse is a 1-of in 2 midrange decks, and what list packs bile blight? not trying to be snide, I just haven't seen it locally or in big tourney top 16's.
TL;DR Pack Rat is, IMHO, a resilient, underated threat that playes really well with Dark Confidant, which you should be running anyway.
PValBlanc says... #2
Probably the fact that with lili and thoughtseize running rampant, you wouldn't want to be discarding on your own too? Just a thought.
The other question is where would you put it? Which deck wants this?
October 2, 2015 7:57 p.m.