Why is Sword of the Meek banned?
Modern forum
Posted on Nov. 28, 2014, 10:21 a.m. by TheGamer
So, I was just looking at Sword of the Meek, and wondered "why is this card banned'? Obviously it has something to do with the return to the battlefield ability, because +1/+2 isn't that great.
Sorry if I sound like a noob when I ask this (because i'm certainly not :P), but I can't put my finger on it. Is it reanimator? Is +1/+2 good? Please help! Thanks everyone for the replies!!
It makes a combo with Thopter Foundry. For every mana you can generate you can blow up the sword, gain a life, make a 1/1 flyer, and that brings the Sword of the Meek back to do it again. Because the Sword of the Meek can be in the graveyard to start and other artifact tutors/digging it's not too hard to assemble the combo.
All that said, the Modern format proved it could survive Bitterblossom getting unbanned, so it might not stay on the banned list.
November 28, 2014 10:38 a.m.
Well, thanks for the response Sauron_, patrice, and Slycne! It slipped my mind that it combos with that card, thanks!
November 28, 2014 10:39 a.m.
I mean, that combo isn't that fast, and enchantments are fairly easy to remove. I don't think it's game breaking in the current modern meta.
November 28, 2014 11:19 a.m.
Ohthenoises says... #7
It would be a little worse when you add things like Disciple of the Vault.
I would actually REALLY love to play that combo because you could be very flexible since it is flexible being 
with a split of B/W, that means you could go Dimir, orzhov, or esper. So many possibilities!
November 28, 2014 11:34 a.m.
T1 Disciple
T2 Sword
T3 Thopter + 1 activation.
I mean that is really cool but you're now at the end of turn 3, you've spent 6 mana, gained 1 life, taken 1 life from the opponent and have two 1/1 creatures (one with flying). It's cool, but to me it doesn't seem groundbreaking.
November 28, 2014 11:42 a.m.
Ohthenoises says... #10
If you untap on turn 4 with it that's potentially 4 life and 4 dudes, not groundbreaking but still strong.
November 28, 2014 11:44 a.m.
In EDH most throw in Phyrexian Altar or Ashnod's Altar for infinite. Not modern, but mean.
November 28, 2014 12:13 p.m.
lemmingllama says... #12
You forgot to mention Time Sieve, not necessary for the combo but makes it impossible to stop once it starts.
November 28, 2014 12:23 p.m.
I feel like this could come off the list. It requires quite a bit of commitment and doesn't instantly end the game. In my mind, Twin just seems a lot more reliable.
November 28, 2014 1:20 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #14
Krark-Clan Ironworks also makes it go infinite, not just the altars. So it is a conceivable infinite combo on turn 3 with any 1 drop artifact and a Mox Opal. Now this is magical christmas land. Since I just specified 8 of the 9 cards you will have seen at this point. but it could be much more consistent for a turn 4 infinite since any artifact that isn't part of the combo will make it go infinite.
November 28, 2014 5:53 p.m.
Gidgetimer That's still much easier to interact with than twin which can effectively flash in a creature T3, untap, and win. If you're tapped out at that point and they have the cards in hand, it's game. I have trouble justifying keeping the sword banned.
November 28, 2014 8:29 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #16
I'm not advocating leaving it banned. I'm just mentioning that it has the possibility to go infinite in modern with Krark-Clan Ironworks, not just in legacy. It is a very easy to interact with combo and I don't think it ever should have been banned in the first place.
November 28, 2014 10:53 p.m.
Dalektable says... #17
Hm. After reading this my thoughts are just unban it so I can play it. Esper Tokens? Card draw, Lingering Souls, these two cards, yes.
November 30, 2014 11:48 a.m.
Gidgetimer says... #18
I was talking to one of my friends last night about this and have a new found outlook on why Sword of the Meek is banned. My friend's point was that it isn't the combo potential, or even the infinite combo at all. The instant speed is the crucial part of the synergy. A draw-go Esper Control build could do disgusting things with the assurance that they would never waste any mana because they EoT 1 token, 1 life for each open mana.
November 30, 2014 12:54 p.m.
Hmmm.... I hadn't considered that. I don't know how devastating that could be. If anything, the new fetches could add much needed consistency to shards as well...
November 30, 2014 1:20 p.m.
Modern is still young and the initial ban list wasn't really very good... and most of the cards that were chosen were cards that people have had bad experiences against in the past.
Well, Sword of the Meek and Dark Depths were part of combos that were in the best Extended deck... and since Extended was sorta the precursor to Modern, it meant that Sword of the Meek got the axe.
There's almost no way it needs to be banned, as Modern currently stands.Having said that... if Modern became what many would consider more "healthy" then Sword of the Meek instantly becomes very dangerous.
So it seems weird to have it banned... but I hope it's not an actual oversight, so much as a tell that WotC has plans to clean-up the format over time and actually believes it can get Modern to the point where Sword of the Meek is "too good."
Still, having said THAT, I'm all for the unban of Sword of the Meek with a hope that it would soon just make its way back to the ban list anyways. :P
June 29, 2015 8:20 p.m.
I see you brought a one year old thread back to life Malachorn :P
June 29, 2015 8:32 p.m.
lol - I did!
I think the question is much more relevant than ever now... because seriously, Sword of the Meek is quite a bit of garbage if we were talking current Modern.
And it's not like they haven't revisited the ban list quite a few times and shown quite the willingness to keep making adjustments.
So... why is Sword of the Meek banned, eh?
July 3, 2015 5:21 p.m.
You bring up a good point though Malachorn. I just feel the combo may be talen advantage of if it is unbanned.
But on that same night, that combo doesnt seem very competitive in the current meta anyway, so it may not be that overpowered and ban-worthy.
July 3, 2015 5:34 p.m.
Harashiohorn says... #24
With Golgari Grave-Troll unbanned I would be very surprised to see sword of the meek come back for a while. The simple fact of the matter is not only this card dangerous as an artifact combo engine, but also is very strong in Dredge/re-animator archetypes that WOTC has had bad experiences with in the past. Also, Dark Depths is banned in modern for VERY VERY good reasons.
July 3, 2015 6:14 p.m.
I think it's safe to say that Dark Depths isn't coming off the ban list anytime soon...
But I think you're completely wrong about Golgari Grave-Troll even being very good with Sword of the Meek. I assume you're imagining a deck full of dredging and Life from the Loam combined with Academy Ruins and the Sword of the Meek + Thopter Foundry combo... but that deck sounds completely terrible and far slower than most any other combo deck (of which there are many) in Modern.
July 3, 2015 10:54 p.m.
Dalektable says... #26
I want Sword of the Meek In my life. I would run that combo deck all day long, as I said already in this thread much, much earlier lol.
July 4, 2015 12:14 a.m.
Gidgetimer says... #27
I assumed that Sword of the Meek was mentioned in conjunction with dredge because Narcomoeba. Then again I also assumed modern dredge would run Dread Return, but it turns out that is banned as well. Wizards really doesn't want dredge to be a thing.
Even though control really needs a boost I'm not sure unbanning Sword of the Meek would be the right move. Ignoring the combos it provides an instant speed mana dump that can be ran in 5 out of 10 three color combinations. A draw-go control deck is not what modern needs.
July 4, 2015 5:14 a.m.
It would still be Modern. Any "draw-go control deck" in Modern would still have terrible counter-magic.
As it currently stands, Thoughtseize and sideboard cards are pretty much where it's at when it comes to stopping other decks' gameplans. Cards like Remand don't go in completely reactive decks... and even Cryptic Command is best in a fairly proactive deck.
Even if you think Sword of the Meek would be too good itself... I don't care for the notion that Modern doesn't need a draw-go control deck at all.
Is it really so bad if a spell gets Dissipated or Dissolved?
July 4, 2015 5:46 p.m. Edited.
Harashiohorn says... #29
Faries is the resident draw go Control deck in Modern I would say, a comparatively large number of spells in it have flash and/or are instant speed anyway. Mono U Tron is also a fairly draw and go control deck until it pulls off one of it's combos. The thing is I don't think Draw-go control decks are what wants Sword of the Meek instead I would think something that Turn 1 or 2 is getting a Narcomoeba with two swords attached, all for free. Or in other words a free 3/5 flyer as early as you can dredge it out.
July 4, 2015 10:48 p.m.
I don't think putting 8 cards in your deck that are basically going to be dead draws in the hopes of discarding a Golgari Grave-Troll and then dredging it in the hopes that it mills all your Narcomoebas and Sword of the Meeks makes for a very good deck is all...
I mean even the "fair decks" are playing Tarmogoyf on turn 2 or doing something like playing a Monastery Swiftspear on turn 1 and presenting at least as fast a clock with A LOT less effort. Your "free" 2/3 flyer isn't really free if you've warped your whole deck around trying to get this thing online, ya know?
If THAT is our worry then Sword of the Meek still just sounds way too fair to me compared to all the crazy stuff other people are doing in Modern...
Sauron_ says... #2
It has a ridiculously easy to get combo with Thopter Foundry. From there, anything is possible.
November 28, 2014 10:37 a.m.