Is Modern Dead?

Modern forum

Posted on Dec. 19, 2014, 7:03 p.m. by CanadianShinobi

Hello all. I think the Modern community needs to have a heart to heart Today I came across this, an article which claims that Modern as a format is dead.Let it be known that I consider the linked article to be incorrect. I think Modern is in a great position right now, much better than when Jund was dominant. But, I'd like to see what the T/O Community thinks. Is Modern Dead? Or is the linked article crazy?

ThisIsBullshit says... #2

I think that's there's too much complaining about what should be banned and unbanned, but it seems to be a lively and thriving format.

December 19, 2014 7:05 p.m.

Agreed. Did you happen to read the article that I linked ThisIsBullshit?

December 19, 2014 7:06 p.m.

GlistenerAgent says... #4

Umm... so no. That article is a piece of shit. Modern is a thriving format that I would argue is healthier than Legacy and much more accessible to newer players.

December 19, 2014 7:18 p.m.

vampirelazarus says... #5

Yeah, that article is one person that sounds like they got beat by too many delver decks.

However, I do think there are too many delver decks, but the format is still incredibly healthy.

December 19, 2014 7:22 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #6

The guys an idiot. He makes various incorrect statements about the history of modern and that supports his own points with tangential opinion.

He claims that pre DRS banning Jund wasn't even the best deck. Uhhh...... it pretty much was.

He says modern is dead due to price of cards. Uhhhhh...... maybe if you're poor yeah, but there'll always be a vast majority of people that can afford to stay.

He complains about bogles being a bad deck in this meta. Untrue - it's top 8ed various events recently.

He claims legacy is cheaper - I've seen the average price of decks in both formats - it's not even close. Most modern ON AVERAGE hovers around $500-$800. Legacy ON AVERAGE hovers from $700 to around $2000.


This is my least favourite kind of article. A mixture of poor fact checking along with poorly formulated and irrelevant opinions, trying to argue a point that blatantly isn't true.

December 19, 2014 7:22 p.m.

Cobthecobbler says... #7

I got two things out of that article:

Confirming my thoughts about modern being the most flatlined format

and that im not the only one outraged by Wizards very obviously choosing Money over players with MM2. Or maybe they're choosing collectors, which in my opinion, fuck the collectors, you guys get the reserved list. We actually want to play

December 19, 2014 7:23 p.m.

GlistenerAgent says... #8

Believe it or not, article writer, Delver and Pod are not the only decks that people can play in Modern. Also, your 6/6 lifelinked guy can almost certainly race a 2/3 and a 3/2.

December 19, 2014 7:24 p.m.

GlistenerAgent says... #9

@Cobthecobbler Genuine question about Legacy: Do you not feel that the format has flatlined as well? Delver occupies a very large chunk of the metagame (uncomfortably large in my own opinion), and every deck has shifted to combat it, mostly with Pyroblast or by having a good matchup. I'd say Legacy is at least as warped as Modern, if not a lot more.

December 19, 2014 7:26 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #10

He also says that DRS battled graveyard shenanigans - no it didn't. It was notoriously bad for that given that it has to tap to use its ability. Exiling one card per turn does not battle the graveyard.

There's just so much that's factually incorrect there I want to scream.

December 19, 2014 7:26 p.m.

One more comment: 'Snap - Bolt - Snap' is not a thing. 'Bolt - Snap - Bolt' is a thing.

December 19, 2014 7:31 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #12

Is there an editor on mtggoldfish? I mean, how did this get printed? Seriously. Spelling errors. Factual errors. Poorly contrived opinions.

December 19, 2014 7:33 p.m.

I didn't read it, it appears that it's poorly written with no fact checking so I'll not read it and not waste two minutes of my life lol

December 19, 2014 7:34 p.m.

GoofyFoot says... #14

There is far too much butthurt in that article, . I feel modern is in an awkward spot at the moment to sure, far too many people playing U/R delver Imo ( I don't have a problem with this honestly, I have an 80% win ratio against Delver with my 8rack deck, which I play every week on modern night), but there was nothing wrong with the February unbanning. it's clearly not effected the meta that much, Treasure Cruise has. Deathrite Shaman's banning was A GOOD THING, and anyone who things that is wrong clearly doesn't understand how good that card is. The reason certain cards are banned in modern is because Wizards didn't want modern to become Legacy light, which it thankfully hasn't.

someone (the author cough) really just lost 3-4 rounds of modern online, and decided to vent about it via the site he's allowed to post articles on.

December 19, 2014 7:38 p.m.

VampireArmy says... #15

Yeah i read into it a little bit but i had to stop. For one thing modern is very healthy. Yes there has been an influx of ascendancy and delver decks. It's a new toy. People enjoy playing with new toys. Even my homebrew does pretty decent in this meta and folks that is fucking saying something. His idea of "too slow" actually made me chuckle because I've seen every deck he mentioned lay the smack down on delver. It's not The meta that's the problem, it's people whining when they can't win

December 19, 2014 7:38 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #16

VampireArmy - Me thinks the author doth protest too much. Bad decks? More like bad pilot.

December 19, 2014 7:40 p.m.

Cobthecobbler says... #17

@GlistenerAgent: yup, but at least legacy gets new toys when commander sets come out, they eat that stuff up like candy

December 19, 2014 7:40 p.m.

VampireArmy says... #18

ChiefBell my thoughts exactly. There's nothing wrong with modern. It's slowly becoming the most popular format out there

December 19, 2014 7:42 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #19

Uhhh Cobthecobbler.

Modern is so fresh right now it hurts:

Innistrad gave us Liliana and others

Ravnica gave us abrupt decay, deathrite shaman, many others

Theros gave us courser of kruphix, anger of the gods, drown in sorrow

Khans gave us TC, Dig through time, monastery swiftspear

Every new set release has seriously affected the meta. Every single set has introduced a major, major card to the format.

December 19, 2014 7:43 p.m.

GoofyFoot says... #20

a HUGE part of the reason why delver is so big right now: it's really fucking cheap. Besides Snapcaster Mage and the lands (which I'm sorry, you really don't even need), the deck is literally dollar at best commons and uncommons. sure, you can add cards to the deck that make it more expensive, but most are unnecessary. you can play the deck minus snaps for about $50. For a deck that's doing very well right now, that's an offer a lot of spikes can't pass up. it's the same thing with burn really, everything that the deck NEEDS is commons and Commons, minus Goblin Guide (which again, you can take out. Monastery Swiftspear and Eidolon of the Great Revel are perfect creatures for the deck, and all it really needs).

The two most common decks in modern are basically the fastest and the cheapest, that is where we are at right now. is this a bad thing? maybe. But the meta is far from stagnant; I wouldn't go so far to say it's the healthiest it's ever been, but it's certainly not terrible right now.

December 19, 2014 7:52 p.m.

Cobthecobbler says... #21

I was just pointing out that legacy gets the commander cards, which is really cool because commander cards are hella fun.

I never said modern doesn't get good cards all the time, they get crazy good cards every block, but they just make the already dominating decks keep dominating, which is really annoying. Ascendancy combo deck is new though, and it's a really cool variation on storm.

December 19, 2014 7:53 p.m.

@ Cobthecobbler I disagree. Until Treasure Cruise UR Delver was not a top tier deck. TC gave Delver the fuel it needed to compete with Pod, Affinity and other top decks.

December 19, 2014 8:08 p.m.

ChiefBell says... #23

It depends on your definition of 'new'. Treasure cruise transformed it into what it is now. In that sense it is new. However delver did exist as a tier 2 deck before treasure cruise; in that sense it is not new.

December 19, 2014 8:11 p.m.

JexInfinite says... #24

I fail to see at all how modern is even remotely dead. Is it because WOTC said they didn't want any more modern pro tours? Because they changed their minds.

Modern is a very healthy format, at the moment, and there is still a lot of variety, even with UR Delver and Pod being really big players.

December 19, 2014 8:21 p.m.

VampireArmy says... #25

Just a note here. Has anyv one else noticed how decks are coming in "flavours"' now? They each accomplish relatively the same goal but use varying cards to do it

Examples :

Midrange (fair decks) naya, jund, abzan, golgari, and to a much lesser extent mardu.

Control has ur, uw, uwr, ub

Combo has 3 different versions of storm now, pyromaster, ascendancy, and negative life combo

Pod has kiki, angelfeeder, and melira

Twin has all in, uwr, and even gur

Like...wow i can't even name them all

December 19, 2014 8:30 p.m.

Arvail says... #26

The bias here is palpable...

Kind of a shame. It's a nice point to discuss, but when your base is this bad, the conversation tends to be skewed towards even moderate opinions leaning against the radical OP.

Just my two cents...

December 19, 2014 8:34 p.m.

What really bothered me is the eggs and jund investment complaint. the only thing of value in eggs was the fetches which will continue to be a staple forever and the only thing in jund that became useless was Bloodbraid Elf, the goyfs, lilianas, fetches and any other big ticket items i am forgetting have retained their value. in no way did people who invested in those decks lose a lot of value.

December 19, 2014 8:34 p.m.

GoofyFoot says... #28

@ Vampire Army tier decks are tier. you forgot Tron (R/G, U, and U/W) for a flavor as well.

when it gets down to it, what separates modern from other formats is this: It's more important to know how an opponents deck operates than how your own does. That's not to say you can play your deck terribly, but if you don't know how melira/kiki goes off, they are going to wreck your shit.

December 19, 2014 8:41 p.m.

Hickorysbane says... #29

I'm pretty sure the author got jumped by a ton of Delver decks and wasn't ready for it. From what I've seen modern's still very much alive (as just about everyone here has said), but to be fair I don't see a lot of modern. It does seem to be the general consensus though. Sooo...yay almost unanimous agreement :p

December 19, 2014 9:10 p.m.

JexInfinite says... #30

Maybe they were just testing on MTGO, because there sure aren't that many Delver decks in paper magic.

December 19, 2014 10:53 p.m.

Femme_Fatale says... #31

BITCH PLEASE!

December 19, 2014 10:57 p.m.

For those interested, this is sort of relevant:

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd9/thegatebloodelf/10475220_10205444390815135_8883666797566440533_n.jpg

December 19, 2014 11:01 p.m.

I think Femme_Fatale said everything that needed saying.

December 19, 2014 11:09 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #34

U can't take an author who chooses to use the word "winningest" seriously.

"the winningest deck"

December 19, 2014 11:29 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ seriously? Never. But I figured it would be an interesting conversation to be had. It seems we're all in agreement though. Modern in fine and the article I linked if fucking stupid.

December 19, 2014 11:35 p.m.

VampireArmy says... #36

Tumblr is spreading

December 19, 2014 11:35 p.m.

I can name something else thats spreading :P

Spreading Seas

December 19, 2014 11:38 p.m.

VampireArmy says... #38

Well played

December 19, 2014 11:42 p.m.

Ohthenoises says... #39

I can name something else thats spreading.

STDs! Wait.... Wut?

December 19, 2014 11:48 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #40

My deck has always came in a variety of flavors /x -Rock, Jund, or Junk, only matter of time before people start playing Rock with Cruise...

December 20, 2014 midnight

Jay says... #41

Didn't read what y'alls said here, but I just read that article and it sounds like that guy is honestly just upset that he can't be Delver. Quit whinin' and pony up some real points y'know.

December 20, 2014 12:31 a.m.

-Axion- says... #42

I never cared much for 'formats' or competitive play myself. But I've always thought that playing Vintage/ Legacy is the way to go: Play with all the best cards available to you. I've never played against a Black Lotus or any Moxs', but I would love to beat a deck with them in it and be able to brag about it. Competitivley though, I can understand why there are formats. Although, Standard is just a joke to me, it's simply a money grab by wizards and gets players to constantly buy all new cards every year, year in year out. Why anyone would choose Standard over Modern, I'll never know...

December 20, 2014 1:31 a.m.

jandrobard says... #43

@Cobthecobbler I feel that you have some very valid points (&%$# the collectors) and I would like to emphasize on what you just said. Also what the guy in the article (can I call him a pundit) briefly touched on: that new boss cards let dominating decks dominate more. I feel that this is a crucial difference between legacy and modern. Modern is a garden full of weeds that are constantly being cur by a gardener, legacy is a living breathing, sharting, overcomplicated being (capable of grabbing someone's wallet and running off). This metaphor is sort of crappy, but touches a point.

December 20, 2014 1:33 a.m.

jandrobard I'm not I understand your take upon Modern. Saying it's weed infested sounds like you agree with the article. But, the article isn't even well researched. Hell I'd say it's based within the author's own, limited experience.

December 20, 2014 1:43 a.m.

Scytec says... #45

I'm with ChiefBell here...where the hell are this sites editors? The entire article is full of horrid mistakes. I'm not an english major, or even work in the field, but the grammatical errors alone pin this individual as incompetent. I won't even touch the complete lack of valid research and facts. Here's a "fact": 83% of all statistics are made up on the spot...true story...heavy sarcasm

December 20, 2014 1:48 a.m.

sylvannos says... #46

Who the fuck is this random, Josh Kaufman, and why does he feel the need to complain about Modern?

From the article:

"Hello everyone! I need to bring up something that has really been eating at me since Grand Prix Virginia. I have been on and off the Pro Tour and playing Magic for approximately 20 years, and the game is at the lowest point that I've ever seen and that includes Mercadian Masques."

...I'm guessing more time was spent off the Pro Tour because I've never heard of him. Playing Magic for 20 years doesn't mean shit besides he spent 20 years being bad. Masques was a failure not because of the set itself, but because it came after a block with abusive combos that caused many players to leave the game. It wasn't anywhere near Kamigawa-levels of exodus that followed MIrrodin-Darksteel-Fifth Dawn.

That's just the first paragraph...in the next paragraph he starts some rant equivocating Urza's Tower to Cloudpost. Ugh. Random shitter is shitty and random.

If this article was written by someone with actual Modern Pro Tour experience (like Shawn McLaren, LSV, or Patrick Dickman), I'd be more open minded. As is, this article reeks of something a first-time user of TappedOut would post who has only been playing for three weeks and thinks Force of Will is the most OP thing ever.

December 20, 2014 4:08 a.m.

Femme_Fatale says... #47

I'm gonna say this on every single page this thread creates...

BITCH PLEASE

December 20, 2014 7:18 a.m.

Ohthenoises says... #48

You know what I find the funniest about this whole TC uproar?

The people who are the saltiest about TC and what not are the people from CFB, SCG, and TCG. Seems to me that they might not like TC from a business standpoint because they can't charge more money for commons and uncommons. Whether it's true or not is another matter but it's just one of those observations.

December 20, 2014 8:19 a.m.

quesobueno123 says... #49

At FNM last night zero delver decks.

December 20, 2014 8:30 a.m.

PaladinRyan says... #50

This article hurt my brain... the spelling errors, bull shit "facts," opinions with little to no support.... Heliod have mercy. I was concerned during the initial TC/Ascendancy rush that the format was in danger. However it has since become stable and varied again, perhaps more so than before in many ways... modern is not perfect but is FAR from dead

December 20, 2014 10:35 a.m.

This discussion has been closed