Hatebears? // Zoo? Huh? #newbie questions
Modern forum
Posted on Sept. 5, 2014, 12:29 p.m. by JRaynor
I just don't get it. I see these decks called "Hatebears" and they seem to contain no hate and no bears. What makes up a Hatebear deck and why is it named that? Are Hatebear players simply a group of Anti-Ursine magic players or what?
I have a similar question about Zoo decks but at least I have a guess about why
I read up on the origins of the Rock and Tron deck archetypes in other threads, but I feel like I'm missing a lot of the terms for other modern staples that are bandied about in the magic community.
Help a brother out. Thanks!
CommanderOfBolas says... #5
Hatebears is an archetype full of 2/2s for 2 that have some sort of "hate" ability (i.e. Leonin Arbiter
, Voice of Resurgence
, etc)
As far as zoo goes, It contains cats(Wild Nacatl ), apes(Kird Ape ) elephants(Loxodon Smiter ) and things like that, which is why it is called zoo. Basically, it is a naya agro deck
September 5, 2014 12:46 p.m.
MindAblaze says... #6
Other popular Hatebears include Gaddock Teeg and even Thalia, Guardian of Thraben (who isn't a bear by the usual definition but fits the theme very well).
It's essentially an aggro deck that controls by manipulating what the other person can do.
September 5, 2014 12:49 p.m.
IATEAREPUBLICAN says... #7
Other examples of hatebears are Imposing Sovereign and Aegis of the Gods I believe. Not quite sure. At least they are when it comes to standard.
September 5, 2014 1:17 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #8
If I know my stuff, and I like to act like I do, 2/1s for 2 mana are called "pikers" after the medieval/renaissance era pikemen.
September 5, 2014 1:26 p.m.
okay between the forum and the responses so far I'm getting what the Hate refers to. That's awesome. But What about the bears? I'm still not seeing a response but I THINK I'm starting to detect a trend. The Rock goes back to the original Rock card that typified the archetype, even though we no longer see that particular card in The Rock decks.
2/1 cards are called Pikers in reference Goblin Piker
So does that mean that the "Bears" of Hate Bear decks simply reference the old Grizzly Bears card?
September 5, 2014 1:59 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #14
When you play against Zoo, you got to the zoo. You see cats (Wild Nacatl , Loam Lion ), apes (Kird Ape ) and other beasts Ghor-Clan Rampager ).
Hatebears are creatures that provide some sort of (usuallt static) ability that hampers certain opponent's ability to play their strategy. Leonin Arbiter helps against the fetchlands, Voice of Resurgence and Thalia, Guardian of Thraben do work against control, etc. Lots of them are 2 mana 2 power creatures, and the name Hatebears is catchy.
September 5, 2014 2:51 p.m.
omnipotato says... #15
jraynor Yes, 2/2s for 2 mana are colloquially called bears in reference to Grizzly Bears .
September 5, 2014 3:05 p.m.
a 2/2 for 2 is sometimes called a bear because of Grizzly Bears
a 2/2 for 3 is sometimes called a Gray Ogre
a 2/1 for 2 is sometimes called a piker because of Goblin Piker
a 2/4 for 4 is sometimes called a Giant Spider
hexproof was called trollshroud before it was given an actual keyword because of Troll Ascetic (the mirrodin version)
many players use older cards with relatively well known stats as a baseline when talking about newer cards. for example, Leonin Arbiter is a hatebear because it's a Grizzly Bears (2/2 for 2) that hates on one aspect of an opponent's gameplan. Burst Lightning was described as a Shock with upside.
it kinda makes you feel cooler and sometimes shortens descriptions when you can speak the special language. but it makes it a little harder to catch on if you haven't been around as long and have to learn all of these older cards and phrases to understand the references.
for what it's worth, sorry for my abbreviated comment earlier. i just thought you were looking for a primer on the modern deck, not looking for a more in-depth history.
September 5, 2014 3:07 p.m.
shuflw no prob bro! It was a forked question and Your link really helped fill out my understanding of how the deck itself was played, and this last post is also sincerely appreciated! I've only been playing about 6 months and mostly it's all been on the kitchen table, so the lingo was eluding me. Like listening to a foreign movie where you miss the meaning of sentences because you don't understand a few key phrases or words that everyone else takes for granted, haha. I only just started trying to understand the competitive scene recently, since my friends and I are thinking about jumping into standard for the first time with Khans.
September 5, 2014 3:45 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #18
And before you create another thread:
Dark Confidant is Bob because Bob Maher won the invitational that led to the creation of that card. It also looks like him.
September 5, 2014 3:49 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #19
Same with Ranger of Eos and Snapcaster Mage .
Same as in, they were both based off and designed by the people who won some invitational.
September 5, 2014 4:05 p.m.
there are 11 invitational cards.
http://mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Magic_Invitational
September 5, 2014 4:15 p.m.
HA! you read my mind GlistenerAgent. I was just wondering about that earlier today.
obligatory smartass remark: Does Solemn Simulacrum look like the guy who won that invitational? :P
thanks for the info
September 5, 2014 4:23 p.m.
the original version does. use gatherer to look up the old art on Meddling Mage (planeshift), Solemn Simulacrum (mirrodin) and Dark Confidant (ravnica).
confidant goes by "bob" and people sometimes call the shadowmage "finkel." the rest of the invitational players' names didn't really catch on. all of the original arts are based on the winners though.
September 5, 2014 4:52 p.m.
Some clarification on Zoo:
Zoo refers to a non-tribal aggro deck that uses multiple colors. Early in Magic's history, decks like White Weenie, Fish, Goblins, Elves, etc. were established. Decks that didn't fit under a mono-color or tribal deck were referred to as "Zoo," since they used a variety of creatures, like Savannah Lions , Kird Ape , and Birds of Paradise . As GlistenerAgent mentioned, it's like you were visiting the zoo to see all of the animals.
The archetype goes all the way back to the first MtG World Championship. Bertrand Lestree made it all the way to the finals before losing to Zak Dolan's Stasis Control.
The name and style of the deck have been around ever since.
September 5, 2014 6:33 p.m.
IATEAREPUBLICAN says... #25
I think even Dack Fayden was designed after an actual guy, as well, which I think is kinda cool.
shuflw says... #2
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/established-modern/220191-gw-hatebears
this is the most complete primer and forum for hatebears.
September 5, 2014 12:34 p.m.