Anything good in Dimir?

Modern forum

Posted on Aug. 11, 2015, 1:11 p.m. by electromancer

I really like the idea of making a UB deck but every time I look whats available, I feel like every other color combo has something better (unless I wanted to make an overpriced, casual mill deck).

So far on my list of possibly playable, I have all the black cards from BGx rock, and maybe Ashiok.

Has anyone ever found anything specifically Dimir that's awesome in modern?

The Lantern of Insight deck is pretty good and I think it's usually UB. I'd be prepared to lose some friends if you build it though.

August 11, 2015 1:29 p.m.

BadumPsh says... #3

U/B Tezzeret is pretty fun, especially if you like technical decks with toolbox interactions.

August 11, 2015 1:34 p.m.

electromancer says... #4

I've seen the deck before "top control" or "pixie stix", I was actually wondering about cards that were only available in UB that aren't played in other decks because of color restriction. Probably nothing, but I figured it was worth asking in case I missed something. I believe it's been a while since faeries had any attention so I figured maybe there's a chance of something flying under the radar.

August 11, 2015 1:35 p.m.

electromancer says... #5

@BadumPsh, I forgot about Tezzerator. Thanks!

August 11, 2015 1:37 p.m.

Kryzis says... #6

You're not going to find any straight up Dimir decks other than Mill or Fae, which requires immense skill to handle in the current meta, without even being competitive.

I would recommend playing a deck that has Dimir in it, like Sultai or Grixis. Sultai affinity and infect are quite good, as well as Grixis twin and delver.

Those are the best decks in modern that run blue and black, and you'll be hard pressed to find any other competitive decks.

August 11, 2015 1:39 p.m.

Sultai Affinity? Is that a thing?

But yeah, as much as I love mill and Dimir colors, it's not very competitive right now. I would aim towards Grixis, it has plenty of T1 decks floating around right now.

August 11, 2015 1:45 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #8

Perplex Nyxathid seems fun.

August 11, 2015 1:45 p.m.

dan8080 says... #9

Grixis control is pretty fun. I've been running it or a deck like it since the protour back in February it's a headache sometimes since thoughtscour can bone you as much as help you but the deck is overall pretty fun to play.

Top control/ pyxie Styx isn't a bad deck either but I like decks that make my opponents miserable and even I felt soulless after playing it against some friends. It's pure evil so if that's your style definitely take a look at it.

August 11, 2015 2:08 p.m.

electromancer says... #10

@APPLE01DOJ, gimmicky, but yes that looks hilarious I never thought Perplex had a near legitimate use.

@Kryzis, where does green come into play in "sultai affinity"? (not sarcasm, I'm intrigued)

August 11, 2015 2:20 p.m.

MollyMab says... #11

There was a missing comma, I do believe.

August 11, 2015 2:41 p.m.

Kryzis says... #12

I've seen some affinity decks splash green for Tarmogoyf and sideboard. They're uncommon, and have a few less artifacts, but are still hyper aggro and competitive.

August 11, 2015 3:04 p.m.

electromancer says... #13

Ohhh woops nevermind.

August 11, 2015 3:05 p.m.

electromancer says... #14

No comma after all, thanks for clarifying. But it seems like people will put goyf in any deck. I'm thinking of RG Goyf Tron myself. Don't even need a color splash. But that's a different topic.

August 11, 2015 3:12 p.m.

Have you tried to build something around unblockables? There's a whole range of versatile UB cards you can use them with, and no color has as many unblockables as dimir. You could also add green for some buffs too if the tricky stuff in UB isn't enough.

Not sure if it will be competitive, but I think it can if built well.

August 12, 2015 2:54 p.m.

electromancer says... #16

@Triforce-Finder I'm not sure how to abuse unblockable in modern. There's a lot of removal so I feel unprotected auras would be bad. UG infect abuses it with green the way you described but I can't think of any viable way that black would have a home there. It's a shame cipher spells were so underwhelming. It was neat mechanic, incredibly fun in limited. (Shadow Slice, Call of the Nightwing, Stolen Identity). I remember it pretty, well Dimir got all crud rares and selesnya got super easy to include and abuse Voice of Resurgence. Maybe WOTC was traumatize by faeries?

August 12, 2015 3:39 p.m.

Well, I've tried out some avenues, but nothing that I experimented with has led to the next big archetype. But then, I'm not really a fan of going to tournaments, so of course I wouldn't know it if there was a potentially competitive concept. Most have never been tested against full-out competition or even been tuned to face it in the first place.

Some of the things I've experimented with are ramping with Hidden Strings to drop fatties or expensive instants early on or follow the ciphers with storm cards (but most storm cards in UB suck balls except maybe Tendrils of Agony), equipment voltron with expendable 2-drop unblockables, and a deck abusing the lower ninjutsu cost to feed the (meanwhile banned, I know) Birthing Pod. There was other stuff, but it's been a while. I can't remember every crazy idea I tried out.

August 12, 2015 5:05 p.m.

electromancer says... #18

I like the idea with equipment. I'll see what I can find. My first thoughts are find something so broken that Dimir Infiltrator can transmute for it profitably, abuse Triton Shorestalker's low cost, and find a way to make Invisible Stalker scary.

August 12, 2015 6:18 p.m.

I threw a rough idea together yesterday. It's just a few jumbled cards now, but I think it has potential.

The main idea is to put Slagwurm Armor on a Dimir Infiltrator and give it infect with Tainted Strike or Grafted Exoskeleton, then go for the throat with Twisted Image if it goes through. Blighted Agent too, since it already has infect. Livewire Lash or Throne of Geth if the first hit isn't lethal.

Then of course typical dimir control cards as Thoughtseize, Dispel, topped with some Hissing Miasma and maybe a few Devour Fleshfor destruction as well as emergency lifegain. Dizzy Spell, Fabricate or Trinket Mage for tutoring.

Do you think that's viable?

August 13, 2015 5:33 a.m.

Here's the WIP decklist: Unblockable Defense

August 13, 2015 5:47 a.m.

I've just built something similar in UG, and it works a lot better thanks to cards like Assault Formation and Tower Defense. Dimir is so useless outside of mill...

August 15, 2015 7:53 a.m.

My first deck was UB for the longest time until I gave up and added red. I focused on stealing my opponent's stuff and beating them with it. It was pretty fun. It revolved around Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver, Dimir Doppelganger, and Life's Finale. It was slow, but I think if I dropped Finale and added some Delver cards such as Gurmag Angler, Tasigur, the Golden Fang, and Thought Scour, along with more gentle mill cards and some 8-rack stuff, it could be pretty fun and halfway-decent. I refuse to post my decklist because of how awful it was at the time (I was a new player), but the idea wasn't half bad.

I think the best idea for theft would be to have some really fat evoke or cycling creatures so I can make my Dimir Doppelganger into one of them after ditching it to the grave along with a lot of cheap countermagic and hand removal to slow their deck a lot. So basically control with Dimir Doppelganger and Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver as wincons. And some delver cards. So a control-heavy delver with weird wincons. Sounds decent to me. I think the advantage is that you have cheap lands playing 2 colors and can have a lot of utility lands.

August 15, 2015 11:40 a.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #23

I think Grixis 8Rack could be strong. Red cards are obvious. Lightning Bolt and Blightning but blue offers Academy Ruins Spellskite and Creeping Tar Pit.

August 16, 2015 12:13 a.m.

electromancer says... #24

@Triforce-Finder, Looks interesting, but a bit of a 4 card combo. It's definitely neat how you're using Dimir Infiltrator's usually high toughness.

@Figag, you hit the nail on head when you described why I like dual color decks. Insanely consistent land base with lots of fun lands you wouldn't normally be able to play well in a 3 color deck. In dimir's case, I think River of Tears has a cool mechanic- black when you want to play Inquisition of Kozilek, blue when you want to play Cryptic Command. I like the direction with Gurmag Angler, Tasigur, the Golden Fang, and Thought Scour. Making a midrange variant of U/B "delver" like what you described, seems worth investigating further.

@APPLE01DOJ, I know it's stupid, but I don't really like "bolt lands" (fetchland -> shockland), so usually I keep shocklands to a minimum. I probably should have been much more specific in the original post, but I wanted to make a U/B deck (just 'cuz), and started to give up on the idea. I figured I'd ask around before entirely giving up.

1 U/B card I think is very playable: Countersquall- Negate with a free Shock feels like a lot of value. I'd probably run as a 2-of in the right deck. Are there are any more cards like this? Not necessarily counterspells, I'm pretty much looking for any dimir "good stuff"

August 16, 2015 12:52 a.m.

@ electromancer

Good Dimir cards... Some of the best dimir cards, like Baleful Strix, Lim-Dul's Vault or Vela the Night-Clad are not modern legal. But I think there is some cool dimir stuff in modern. Let me go through my cards and list a few of them...

Shadow of Doubt (natural 2-for-0 and fetchland hate), Perplex, Dream Salvage, Fate Transfer (summon your best hydra, please), Dimir Infiltrator, Etherium Astrolabe (thopter tokens, anyone?), Shipwreck Singer, Scarscale Ritual (undying loves -1/-1 counters), Mask of Riddles, Warped Physique, Whispering Madness, Notion Thief (circumstancial, but if used right...), Consult the Necrosages, Disciple of Deceit... I skipped on the Glen Elendra stuff, and the mono-colored staples that are just so much more effective when running both colors.

However, most of these are utility cards, best used in support of the deck's actual key cards.

August 16, 2015 2:28 p.m. Edited.

APPLE01DOJ says... #26

Well I've been working on a Dimir deck for a little while that utilizes the synergy between Phylactery Lich, Darksteel Citadel and Ensoul Artifact it's comprised mostly of cards I already own so the instant suite is basically all flex spots.

Casual deck WIP

August 16, 2015 10:47 p.m.

electromancer says... #27

@Triforce-Finder, good call on Shadow of Doubt, and Dream Salvage is definitely one of those cards that I wish I knew how to use effectively.

@APPLE01DOJ I like it, definitely a dimir deck. Not sure if Darksteel Relic might also have a home there, that might be more for an affinity route.

August 17, 2015 3:47 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #28

I tried Dream Salvage in 8Rack & it was pathetic but maybe it could work with Dark Deal?

August 17, 2015 4:49 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #29

Darksteel Relic is interesting but I did drop Menmite for not doing enough... Maybe though!

August 17, 2015 4:51 p.m.

electromancer says... #30

I was thinking Dream Salvage would go with some permanent that facilitates decent discard every turn, but I don't think that exists in modern (for a good reason).

August 17, 2015 5:05 p.m.

APPLE01DOJ says... #31

August 17, 2015 6:10 p.m. Edited.

Dream Salvage isn't that hard to use. Just follow up on any discard effect, like from Esper Charm or Consult the Necrosages. Some of my faves:

Alternatively, you can follow up on costs that opponents payed by discarding to maybe draw into a counter, or follow up after "draw x, discard x" effects used by the opponent.
One special opportunity I recall is when playing against Living End decks that use excessive cycling. Those discarded cards can be translated directly to card draw for you. That way you are closer to getting the counterspell you need when Living End hits the table.

August 17, 2015 6:47 p.m.

electromancer says... #33

@APPLE01DOJ yeah... liliana (not sure what I was saying) that would do it. But even with liliana it didn't work well? Well, not sure it's worth it then.

@Triforce-Finder Dack Fayden would be insane (unfortunately not modern legal). Wistful Thinking might do the trick. It kinda looks better than Dark Deal in a Liliana's Caress centered deck.

August 17, 2015 7:27 p.m.

The Minefield: A Modern Artifact Recycler (T3 Win)

Although technically esper, the white is just a very light splash. It's a Pili-Pala + Grand Architect combo deck that is surprisingly effective. Probably the most competitive UB deck you will find. Check it out!

August 18, 2015 5:46 p.m.

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