Aether Vial in Hatebears
Modern forum
Posted on June 24, 2016, 9:32 p.m. by BlueMageBrandon
What would the advantage be of not playing AEther Vial in Hatebears?
TheAnnihilator says... #3
Not correct -- there is an advantage to not playing Vial, but it's pretty outclassed by the speed Vial grants to the deck. The main downside to playing it is the fact that it's a terrible draw. On it's own, Vial doesn't attack or disrupt the opponent. Starting with a vial or two in hand is like mulling to 6/5 to get some fast mana -- not a bad exchange, right? Starting with 3/4 vials in hand is like mulling to 3/4 to get some fast mana, but then you run into the problem of having little to do with said mana.
The biggest upside to cutting vial is that you can never topdeck it when you need creatures or disruption (you can't topdeck a card that's not in your deck).
June 24, 2016 10:03 p.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #4
All that said, I do not recommend cutting Vial in any Hatebears or Death and Taxes build, especially MonoW. If you're playing WG, then you prolly have a more midrangey deck, and could shave the vials for Loxodon Smiter or something, but I still don't prefer it.
June 24, 2016 10:06 p.m.
BlueMageBrandon says... #5
But the Modern Format Primer said that adding Vial makes it slower and more control-y.
June 24, 2016 10:15 p.m.
The Format Primer is wrong, then. Vial's primary purpose is to be an accelerant and let you cheat on mana.
June 24, 2016 10:34 p.m.
As elpokitolama told me, "once you go vial never go back!" It is very much true.
In my hatebear Estate Agency deck vial is an absolute MUST, but there are ways around it via budget concernens..just takes some deep knowledge of your meta.
June 24, 2016 11:34 p.m.
elpokitolama says... #8
Vial is probably the card that holds the deck together. That's the reason why even if you play a budget version of the deck, you're going to need 4 of those. The deck doesn't have a lot of good turn 1 plays, and it also solves this issue. :)
June 24, 2016 11:51 p.m.
Wait does it say "Adding vials makes it slower" or "NOT adding vials makes it slower"?
Will amend right now.
June 25, 2016 4:24 a.m.
Sorry. I don't know who wrote hatebears- shame on them!
June 25, 2016 4:25 a.m.
Oh I think I know why someone would write this but it is confusing. Hatebears with aether vial focuses on flashing in 2 drops that may sacrifice power and toughness in favour of relevant hate effects. Whereas non aether vial decks may play 3 drops that have impressive stats. However whether the two drop version closes out games slower than the three drop version is probably false because being able to play two 2/2s a turn is just as good and sometimes better than a single 4/4
June 25, 2016 4:29 a.m.
WizardOfTheNorthernCoast says... #12
I usually use 3 Vials in my builds, sometimes 2. You want one in your opening hand and that's all. Like my mates mentionned it's a terrible draw mid-late game and I'd like to avoid that as much as possible :)
June 25, 2016 5:54 a.m.
forforforest says... #13
You just can't cut AEther Vial or Flickerwisp. those two cards alone account for thousands of interactions that aren't really replaceable. If you don't run the vial, then you might as well drop the Ghost Quarter's and Tectonic Edge, and Leonin Arbiter and Aven Mindcensor since they're a big reason you're playing the vials... and pretty soon you notice you're not playing the same deck anymore...
June 25, 2016 9:46 a.m.
What does Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter have to do with AEther Vial? I honestly don't know...
June 25, 2016 1:11 p.m.
JoshRigone says... #15
@capriom85...
I think that forforforest is hinting at the fact that Hate-bears plays many different lands that will most likely be sacrificed at some point during the game (Ghost Quarter, Tectonic Edge, Horizon Canopy). This would typically make it rather difficult to cast spells and keep pressure on the opponent. However, AEther Vial lets you tax your opponent's mana while still "playing" your own spells.
The very same principle is what allows the Legacy deck Death & Taxes to work except in that case you're dealing with Wastelands and Rishadan Ports.
Hopefully this clears everything up.
June 25, 2016 11:35 p.m.
Vial under the right circumstances is broken. Hatebears often leaves it on 2, the main thing your holding up would be Leonin Arbiter against a deck that fetches or searches.. as an example.
This is hatebears and not death and taxes yes?
THERE IS A DIFFERENCE DAMN IT.. T~T SHAKES FIST
Death and taxes with no vial is.. a pile of cards..
Hatebears with no vial is just boring g/w value.
Vial allows plays on an opponents turn, sometimes in situations that pincer an opponent, others when you would rather your opponent made plays and potentially tapped out, so their choices allow your threats safety. Its along the same lines of play as attacking first, then making plays in the 2nd main phase. In the case that your opponent would have interacted differently.
Nothing feels worse to me in magic, than t1-t2 destroy my AEther Vial.. Its that good.
Scouty says... #2
None. With Vial, you cheat on mana, get around counterspells, and just swarm the board more effeciently
June 24, 2016 9:40 p.m.