Sundering Titan in U-Tron
Modern Deck Help forum
Posted on July 20, 2015, 2:49 p.m. by buildingadeck
I have found Sundering Titan to be underwhelming and overcosted in most matchups. Maybe against Delver he can be useful, but in general, I just don't find myself wanting to play him that often.
Here are some cards I'm considering in his stead:
Platinum Angel: Having two Platinum Angels in the deck allows me to more consistently draw them and to have back-up if needed. This could be useful.
Silent Arbiter: I've seen this run in a multitude of Tron decks now, and I think it is a good fit. It does not, however, have good synergy with Treasure Mage, a key tutor in my deck. Still, a pretty good option.
Karn Liberated: Generally, I feel that Karn fits better in GR Tron because of Ancient Stirrings and the emphasis to get him out on T3, but I have to say, the ability to exile an Inkmoth Nexus or a Glistener Elf on T3 or 4 can change the game in your favor drastically.
Ugin, the Spirit Dragon: Like Karn, Ugin hits hard at any stage in the game, but unlike Karn, Ugin can't hit lands. He does, however, wipe the rest of the board in any non-Tron/Affinity matchup.
AEtherize: I have two in the sideboard right now, and they come in very handy in a slew of match ups. Having one handy could often make the difference between life and death.
Pact of Negation: I am convinced this is better in the sideboard for control matches, but I like to keep it in my mind because I think it can be a powerful card.
Steel Hellkite: Steel Hellkite is another threat that allows me to wipe out Affinity much easier if I get the opportunity to swing in. In actuality, that makes me a much bigger fan of this card than I was initially. The fact that it is a 6-drop is also nice.
Anticipate: I have heard this card is pretty helpful in a lot of matches, and digging a bit more probably wouldn't hurt.
Mindslaver: There is a large number of versions out there that run 2 Mindslaver, and it can be useful to help ensure that you can get the lock sooner. I figure that with 4 (maybe 5 if I decide on another Fabricate) fetches to grab it, I shouldn't need 2 of them, but it is an option.
Mana Leak: Sometimes having an early counter that stops a threat can be useful, and it beats a Condescend for 1 at many times.
Let me know what you think, or if you think that Sundering Titan is still worth the play. Thanks, everyone!
buildingadeck says... #3
lordoftheshadows: Thank you for an in-depth response. I am not currently running two Slavers. Here is my decklist. I should have put it in the original post.
I have also been considering Chalice of the Void. Let me know what you think.
July 20, 2015 3:13 p.m.
filledelanuit says... #4
As a disclaimer I am new to U tron (I play storm normally and like to ROFL stomp GR Tron).
I'll post some more comments on your decklist.
July 20, 2015 3:22 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #5
Sundering Titan is going to be a meta call. If you're facing a lot of mono-colored decks like Elves and Merfolk or decks that don't run many basics like Affinity, then I'd cut it. It does work against Abzan, Zoo, 3-4 color burn, etc. He can be tricky to resolve at a good time versus blue decks like Twin and Grixis Delver due to his cost.
In your case, if you're going to cut it, I would add in another Mindslaver.
July 20, 2015 4:08 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #6
Thanks, Taped. I don't really know my meta yet (haven't returned home from break), but I think that having the second slaver is just value. I'm also running Platinum Emperion, and it has proven very useful, so I'd rather have it or another Ugin, the Spirit Dragon at 8 than Sundering Titan.
July 20, 2015 5:26 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #7
I would keep it as a one-of in the side. If you try to get a T3 Tron, a turn 4 Titan can essentially win the game on the spot against something like Zoo.
Do you side a One-hit robot (Blightsteel Colossus)? Have you found him useful?
EDIT: Or I can check your list and see that you don't.
July 20, 2015 5:37 p.m. Edited.
buildingadeck says... #8
Haha! True. I've been considering some of the "lower cost" Eldrazi for that spot. Either Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre or Kozilek, Butcher of Truth. But I do love Blightsteel Colossus. He could be an instant-win, but why not just fetch Mindslaver? Did your Academy Ruins get blown up by a Fulminator Mage? If so, why not just run Crucible of Worlds in the side?
In speaking of the sideboard, will you check mine out, and let me know, either here or on the deck, what you think? I definitely don't know where Sundering Titan belongs in there.
July 20, 2015 5:45 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #9
I don't know for sure as I haven't played my list in a while, but your best bet should be to make sure you can explicitly list why each card is in your sideboard. Bottle Gnomes is clearly there for burn, Hurkyl's Recall for Affinity, etc. Next, make sure you have a plan for what comes out for the aforementioned cards. If you can't place or replace a card, then it shouldn't be in your sideboard.
Looking at your sideboard, I might cut the Crucible. It can be cute, but ideally you don't play Ruins until you're ready to establish the Mindslaver lock. At the least, leave mana open for countermagic in preparation for a Ful. Mage.
I have a pretty good idea, but which matchups would see AEtherize and Hibernation come in?
July 20, 2015 5:57 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #10
Hibernation is almost an explicit FU to Elves. It can come in for Mono-G Stompy (which I've played once I believe) or Abzan (Kitchen Finks, Melira, etc).
AEtherize comes in in almost any creature match for 1 Remand and 1 Repeal (usually). Against Affinity, I sometimes sub out 2 Repeal for the AEtherize because the Repeals don't hit Inkmoth Nexus, and it's a pain in the a**. AEtherize is generally a very good sweeper, though.
Hibernation, along with Dispel, is newly added in favor of Relic of Progenitus, which is really only favorable in the mirror and against Loam Pox. Mayyybe against Delver to screw over Snapcaster Mage, but eh. Just win the counter wars. XD
In regard to Crucible of Worlds, you cannot counter Tectonic Edge or Ghost Quarter, except with Stifle or Squelch, so I find it to be a pretty useful sideboard tech against Jund, GR Tron, U-Tron, etc. Most decks run some form of non-basic land hate.
I'm considering what lordoftheshadows said about Repeal and Remand on my deck and might throw in Solemn Simulacrum in their place and test that for a while.
July 20, 2015 6:06 p.m.
- If you aren't already running 2 copies you should be. The stock list has had two copies for a while now. The first mindslaver can get blown up, eaten, countered or any number of things. Sometimes the lock is the only way to win a game and if you don't have any more you're screwed.
lordoftheshadows Just to point out that unless your opponent has a way to permanently remove it from the graveyard, like Scavenging Ooze, a second Mindslaver isn't necessary since the lock involves Academy Ruins.
July 20, 2015 6:52 p.m.
filledelanuit says... #12
Slycne The problem with Academy Ruins to get it back is that you have to wait a turn. The second one allows you to get it with Treasure Mage or Fabricate when you don't have ruins.
July 20, 2015 7:05 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #13
lordoftheshadows: In that circumstance, I believe you Fabricate for an Expedition Map to find the Academy Ruins. Then you can hold up control magic until your next turn and gain the Mindslaver lock on the next turn.
Okay, I have been considering Solemn Simulacrum for a bit now. I realize now his importance in garnering Islands for a counter war or something of the like, as well as for giving you raw advantage in a body that draws upon death. I am considering dropping one Dimir Signet, one Remand, and one Repeal for him. Do you think this is a good idea, or will dropping the third Signet put me in mana screw circumstances quite frequently?
July 20, 2015 8:07 p.m.
filledelanuit says... #14
I understand that the cases I listed aren't that common but I have had multiple games that I would have lost had it not been for the second Mindslaver. Having said that I understand why people sometimes run only one.
Blue is super important. I run one copy of Solemn and I would like two but I have found that Ugin is a bit better. It is ok to cut remand/repeal for solemm because his ability to act as a speed bump makes up for the missing tempo but I don't think you can afford to cut mana for him. This deck already runs lighter on mana than feels right and cutting the little bit we have feels wrong (unless you're going to play with Anticipate but that changes the whole deck).
July 20, 2015 8:14 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #15
I am heavily considering Anticipate. The faster I can cycle through my deck to find what I need, the better. I am, of course, not entirely convinced on the card, but I've heard it can be helpful.
July 20, 2015 8:19 p.m.
SwaggyMcSwagglepants says... #16
Mindslaver is just as much of a blowout to Delver as Sundering Titan. And it works well against most decks.
filledelanuit says... #2
Let's look at each of your options:
Platinum Angel is ok but it is either good or crap. In control matchups it does almost nothing. I don't like having a second main but depending on your meta it could be a good choice.
It seems good but I agree that the nobo with Treasure Mage is annoying. However we already run Chalice of the Void and Oblivion Stone which cannot be tutored by mage. You can try playing some number of Fabricate.
Karn isn't any good on turn 6 or 7. We don't race to get Tron and he doesn't have the impact on the board that we need from a 7 drop. He can't even block.
Ugin is amazing and I am probably going to go up to 2 of him when I can make space.
I don't like this mainboard but it is a meta choice. If you have a lot of aggro then it seems fine but know your meta first.
No. Pact is really hard to pay for and we can easily get blown out by a removal spell on a Talisman.
It doesn't impact the board when it is played so it doesn't make the cut. It is a bit too slow against affinity although it can work. Unfortunately it needs to attack to do much which makes it too slow.
I don't have any experience with this but if you want to play Anticipate you will need to rebuild the mana of the deck. It allows you to play a fewer talismans.
If you aren't already running 2 copies you should be. The stock list has had two copies for a while now. The first mindslaver can get blown up, eaten, countered or any number of things. Sometimes the lock is the only way to win a game and if you don't have any more you're screwed.
Mana Leak seems all right but I would severely hurt in the control mirrors or when a game goes long.
July 20, 2015 3:07 p.m.