Kalitas vs Blood Baron of Vizkopa
Modern Deck Help forum
Posted on May 6, 2016, 12:22 a.m. by ToolmasterOfBrainerd
I've been toying around with:
Mardu Midrange
Modern*
SCORE: 3 | 8 COMMENTS | 220 VIEWS
I currently run a 1-of Blood Baron of Vizkopa. Would it be just better to play Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet because it's 1 less mana, has creature exile relevancy vs Podless Pod, and can make tokens. Downside is that Blood Baron is more evasive (dodges path and terminate, both of which Kalitas dies to hard).
On a side note, I'm also looking for a better name for the deck.
Thanks!
Or possibly Mardu the Right Thing. Or Just Mardu it.
Out of puns now
May 6, 2016 12:36 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #6
Kalitas is a ton better. Easier to cast, better effect. Mainboard hate for Company.
And Jesus Christ, the previous comments are unhelpful and really damn stupid. Grow up. Mardu puns are not good at all.
May 6, 2016 3:45 a.m. Edited.
I vote for Blood Baron of Vizkopa. Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is great, but keep him in side for Podless match ups. Honestly, his exile is not relavant everywhere. Baron dodges so much removal in the format he is almost unstoppable or results in a 2 for 1 to the opponent who burns him. He also walls against Siege Rhino all day long.
May 6, 2016 9:06 a.m.
I say Blood Baron as well. With as creature light as your deck is, you need threats that are hard to answer and can close out games. Blood baron does that 100 times better than Kalitas. Kalitas is nice, but he's not what your deck wants. Now there could be a meta call and if podless pod was really that big of a problem you could run Kalitas instead, but unless that's the case BBoV is going to be the better option.
May 6, 2016 9:17 a.m.
You could also run both...Kalitas in the 4 slot and Baron in the 5 slot. That's a ton of life gain and a big "haha" to your opponent that's happy to see Kalotas BC they have a kill spell ready. But unless it's a meta thing, like was pointed out, Baron is the right main deck option.
May 6, 2016 9:20 a.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #12
I'm tuning this for the general meta, not my own. I don't plan to build the deck, since it's too expensive.
I don't think I have room for both. However, as good as Archangel Avacyn Flip looks on paper, I think she's lackluster in a creature-light deck. I like the mainboard wrath potential, but if I cut Avacyn to add Kalitas, then my creature package becomes 1 Obzedaddy, 1 Blood Baron, and 1 Kalitas, which sounds pretty good to me.
May 6, 2016 10:26 a.m.
I like it too. New Avacyn seems cool all around, but she is best in creature-centric decks I think.
May 6, 2016 10:49 a.m.
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet is worlds better in Mardu, which has all the removal in the world and just wants cards that finish the game quickly. Kalitas does that, and he gives you extra value from your removal as icing. Blood Baron of Vizkopa is cute and dodges Path to Exile and Terminate, but being a 5-drop hurts, and having that barely-ever-relevant secondary effect won't change that. I'm honestly surprised by the comments of it only being a sideboard card for Abzan Company - have you all not seen Jund kicking butt and chewing bubblegum post-Eldrazi ban? Kalitas is a huge part of that. If it sticks, most aggro decks just can't win. And it gives you a fighting chance against the Wurmcoil Engines of the world. If anything, the Blood Baron is the sideboard card you would bring in the midrange mirror.
May 6, 2016 11:03 a.m. Edited.
I wasn't referencing the other Jund decks out there because he has his specific deck tagged. Being able to dodge Path to Exile, Terminate, Murderous Cut, Dismember, etc. is extremely relevant when he runs 6 creatures total (3 of which are Wall of Omens) and isn't in blue for counter magic to protect them.
So when asked to choose Kalitas or BBoV for his deck, BBoV fits in with HIS deck better. However, looking at it beyond the original question, the suggestion was made to play both and remove Avacyn. Which is probably the better option than choosing between Kalitas or BBoV. Kalitas has more value beyond just attacking than Avacyn does every turn they go unanswered plus it has more synergy with the rest of the deck.
So, if you had asked the same question.... Kalitas or Avacyn, I would say the obvious answer is Kalitas in that situation.
May 6, 2016 1:57 p.m.
Fair point. I'm also wondering why Nahiri, the Harbinger is in the deck and Emrakul, the Aeons Torn is not. I don't see the point in running Nahiri without Emrakul, frankly.
May 6, 2016 2 p.m. Edited.
I'm assuming it was more for the draw and exile ability. Although being able to cheat an Emrakul is nice and you pitch and shuffle to her +2 if you draw it. Definitely something they should think about.
May 6, 2016 2:05 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #18
Thanks for the help everyone!
I opted to not run Emrakul because then the only way to put Emrakul into play is with Nahiri's ult, so if we don't manage to ultimate Nahiri, then we can't really win. If you want to play a '-8 nahiri I win immediately', Ajani, Nahiri and Kiki walk into a bar... copy is a Restoration Angel + Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker Mardu combo deck. I found that when playing that, by the time I comboed, they were at roughly 8 life anyway, and between the burn spell in my hand, Shambling Vent on the battlefield, and Resto angel in play, I had enough to kill them without the combo: it was win-more. The thing about Mardu is that with burn spells and Shambling Vent, we're great at chipping away at their life until they lose, regardless of whether we can land a Nahiri ult.
Personally, I think the only viable Nahiri + Emrakul deck is a Possibility Storm Jeskai deck, which a pretty good deck, or Legacy Miracles, but neither of those are Mardu and it's not what I really want to be playing.
If we're in the stage of the game where we can ult Nahiri, then we've already won, and putting Obzedaddy or Blood Baron into play will be more than enough to finish out the game.
Using Nahiri for removal or value with Lingering Souls is a great use of her too. More than worth the cmc=4.
May 6, 2016 6:09 p.m.
Paying 
for the option of either bad looting (because you have to discard first) or bad removal (because it has to be tapped) is not appealing. The only purpose of Nahiri, the Harbinger in Modern is to ultimate and combo off - removal is what Mardu does better than any other color combination. I think that's a suboptimal inclusion.
May 7, 2016 11:18 a.m.
Using her at all. If the deck doesn't have some huge, game-ending fatty to sling out there, Ajani Vengeant is usually just better.
May 8, 2016 3:33 p.m. Edited.
I can see that. So unless you're cheating Emrakul or something out, he other abilities really are lacking. Good call.
May 8, 2016 3:56 p.m.
ToolmasterOfBrainerd says... #23
On the contrary, I've found Ajani's abilities to be much more underwhelming than Nahiri's. I have ulted Nahiri a lot in my testing, and have yet to lose after I've successfully ulted her. This confirms for me that Emrakul is unnecessary, since I've also won many a game without even drawing Nahiri. So I don't think you can judge Nahiri based on the available targets for her ult, since it doesn't much matter; we have about a 98% (give or take 2%) win rate after that point anyway.
Nahiri's +2 has been astounding for me. Cycling away extra lands or gaining pure value from Lingering Souls leaves my opponent in the dust. Her -2 is repeatable and although conditional, I've seen it take over the game. If the opponent is too far ahead on board, then Nahiri isn't very good, but at that point neither is Ajani or any of our available planeswalkers, for that matter.
Additionally, because she has a +2, I can get to her ult by turn 6, and with enough board control (which I have), I can, in some ways, use Nahiri to race my opponent - they kill me or her by turn 6, or they just lose.
If you're playing Jeskai Control, I agree, Ajani is better all day long. But in Mardu control / midrange, I've found Nahiri to be the better option by far.
May 8, 2016 6:51 p.m.
I keep forgetting that we are talking about THIS particular deck and not in general.
May 8, 2016 8:15 p.m.
Just run Faithless Looting if that's the case. The utility provided by a Nahiri who's not a threat to end the game if it goes off is not worth 4 mana.
Draw_Wurm says... #2
Much Mardu about Nothing?
May 6, 2016 12:28 a.m.