Uncharted Realms: Brink of Extinction

Lore forum

Posted on Feb. 10, 2016, 10:54 a.m. by RussischerZar

The battle begins ...

clayperce says... #2

His companions, four other Planeswalkers and some very brave planebound fighters...nodded. Yes. Kill two enormous, unfathomably ancient beings using nothing but their own abilities and ingenuity. That made sense, didn't it?

Azor help me, he thought. I've signed on with heroes


Oh yeah!!!!

February 10, 2016 11:01 a.m.

GoldGhost012 says... #3

I like it when Jace narrates. There tends to be a lot of snarky gems.

February 10, 2016 11:25 a.m.

JANKYARD_DOG says... #4

So...is Ugin gunna be pissed at our little group of heroes after finding out what happens? He did say not to kill them...

February 10, 2016 11:36 a.m.

Rayenous says... #5

This was quite riveting, for a story arc with no battles that's all about developing a plan.

I also like how every interaction between Jace and Nissa brings a great strengthening of trust, which has now clearly grown to a stronger bond than just some PW's that will go into battle together.

February 10, 2016 11:37 a.m.

Rayenous says... #6

@Mj3913 - I don't find Ugin all that trust worthy. - As far as I can tell, he may have created the Eldrazi.

He always states he knows all about them, but never divulges any information other than "Trap them, don't kill them."

Being a Colorless PW, it would make sense that he would want to strip the Multiverse of colored mana. - He would be the most powerful being (only having to contend with Karn Liberated, as far as we currently know).

I would even submit that it would be a good reason for Bolas to attempt to kill Ugin, and release the Eldrazi... allowing others to kill the Eldrazi, without Ugin's protection. - Bolas would not want the Eldrazi to succeed, as it would be his undoing.

February 10, 2016 11:44 a.m.

meecht says... #7

@Mj3913 - Well, they aren't technically killing the titans. Just dispersing their essence throughout Zendikar.

...which doesn't exactly sound like a good idea. Creatures that absorb life are going to have their essence spread throughout a "living" world.

Could we have another Argentum -> Mirrodin -> New Phyrexia thing happen, where Zendikar gets converted into something else?

February 10, 2016 11:49 a.m.

GoldGhost012 says... #8

I don't know if he'd go as far as Multiverse domination, but I've always loved the idea of Ugin trapping the Eldrazi instead of killing them so that they could be used as tools against Bolas. Of you think about it, the Eldrazi are really the perfect weapon to use against Bolas, whose hallmark magic is the ability to shatter his opponent's mind by merely touching them. Since the Eldrazi don't truly think like other cognitive beings do, they very well might be immune to Bolas's touch.

February 10, 2016 11:52 a.m.

Anyone know where that art of Nissa and Sorin is from? I don't recognize a card or anything. Is it new?

February 10, 2016 12:21 p.m.

meecht says... #10

Some art is commissioned strictly for the story pages and doesn't show up on cards.

February 10, 2016 12:34 p.m.

GoldGhost012 says... #11

It's actually art from the original Zendikar block, if I remember correctly.

February 10, 2016 12:46 p.m. Edited.

clayperce says... #12

You remember correctly, GoldGhost012.

It was the splash art for Rise of the Elzdrazi

February 10, 2016 12:58 p.m.

Ej1997 says... #13

Zendikar is going to eat the Eldrazi. I don't know how I feel about this.

I can however see the repercussions of this transforming Zendikar or at least giving sustainablity to the wastes there. Also I see the brood lineages becoming native to zendikar similar to the Slivers on Shandalar.

February 10, 2016 1:16 p.m.

mpeach1 says... #14

Idk how I feel about their plan, about zendikar tearing the eldrazi apart, about the leylines stripping them of their power...but I'm excited to see it all unfurl

February 10, 2016 1:47 p.m.

AgentGreen says... #15

But just remember

Only 2 Titans are in play here

Where's Emrakul

And why is Ugin so hellbent in keeping the Eldrazi alive? Are they basically the linchpin on something worse?

February 10, 2016 1:48 p.m.

meecht says... #16

Oooooooo....wild speculation time!

The Eldrazi haven't "always been" as we are lead to believe. Instead, they were actually a byproduct of The Mending and their existence is what keeps everything "mended." They're absorption of various planes helps to keep the multiverse repaired.

If they are destroyed, The Mending becomes undone.

February 10, 2016 2:13 p.m.

saj0219 says... #17

Obviously there will be some big repercussions for killing the Eldrazi. I can't decide if I'm hoping there are some disastrous negative consequences for the multiverse (a la "Oh shit, we thought we were helping, but we just made it way worse") or if they just ruined the secretly nefarious plans of Ugin ("Oh shit, now there's this hugely powerful ancient being who is super pissed at us.")

February 10, 2016 2:26 p.m.

Rayenous says... #18

The great "unMending"?... "DeMending"?...

February 10, 2016 2:45 p.m.

TheFoilAjani says... #19

I like that theory, meecht. It would be super cool.

Rayenous I think it's the Re-mending. Mending the mend so that it un-mends.

February 10, 2016 3 p.m.

Rayenous says... #20

No. "Re-mending" would be to 'mend again'.
That is what the PW's would need to do if a 'demending'/'unmending' were to occur.

February 10, 2016 3:17 p.m.

Faytl says... #21

I love how just the act of these guys planning how to kill Eldrazi is still an interesting and engaging chapter. I could read about these walkers just chatting for weeks and be content. Especially loving any interaction between Nissa and Jace; it gives us such delicious character moments.

February 10, 2016 5:53 p.m.

greyninja says... #22

I thought Ugin, the Spirit Dragon didn't want them to "kill" the eldrazi because they're only killing the peice stuck on zendikar; thus setting the rest of their entity free to destroy the multiverse (?)

Jace's plan is to suck the entirety of the titans into zendikar, which I don't think Ugin expected

February 10, 2016 10:51 p.m.

RussischerZar says... #23

Although I love the wild speculations by the others, I think greyninja is on the right track here :)

February 11, 2016 5:32 a.m.

GobboE says... #24

In addition to greyninja

And perhaps Bolas wanted them free so that the Mending would be undone, (unMending, re-mending, what about Broken :) ?) Perhaps Bolas hopes his old powers he had as a pre-mend Planeswalker would return? Hence, Bolas, killing of Ugin and setting the whole plot in motion.

February 11, 2016 6:16 a.m.

meecht says... #25

The Brokening

February 11, 2016 8:12 a.m.

RussischerZar says... #26

The Breaking. :P

Btw: Bolas killed Ugin a thousand years in the past, so waaay before the Mending, which happened somewhat recently in comparison (about a hundred years ago).

February 11, 2016 8:13 a.m.

GobboE says... #27

the breaking... yep, that's it :)

Hmmm, that is true. Too bad, it was such a nice speculation...well, perhaps Bolas saw it coming in a vision and pre-empted (yes, let's have another time-spiral set! ;) )

February 11, 2016 8:17 a.m.

meecht says... #28

Bolas old. Like REALLY old. He's already eternal due to being a dragon, so time has basically no meaning to him.

It would be nothing for him to orchestrate an event that would take hundreds of years to actually happen.

February 11, 2016 8:21 a.m.

Can we just stop for a moment and talk about how awesome Chandra is?

"Well?" yelled Chandra, from outside the ravine. "Do you have a plan yet?"

"Bigger?" asked Chandra, almost eagerly.

That, and the part where she's entirely pissed that she can't just incinerate the Titans as soon as she sees them. I may almost like her more than Sarkhan. And that's really saying something.

February 11, 2016 8:50 a.m.

Rayenous says... #30

@meecht - While that is true, what RussischerZar is stating is that the claims that Bolas killed Ugin and freed the Eldrazi in order to 'revert the mending' and restore his previous power makes no sense.

Since he killed Ugin before the mending (and thus the weakening of Planeswalker powers) occurred, the purpose of killing Ugin is/was not for the intentions of 'rebreaking' (...yeah, I'm not sure I like that any better.)

Edit: ...Oh, and it also means the Eldrazi were not 'created by the mending'. - They were definitely around long before the Mending.

February 11, 2016 9 a.m. Edited.

GobboE says... #31

On my point of preempting and what Rayenous states. It does make sense, to a certain degree, that Bolas - who likes to have options - would have speculated: 'what could loose my my powers' answer: and Mending event. Question two then is: 'How could I restore them?' Answer: if I kill Ugin I could set a future plot in motion to restore them. And in an after thought he concluded: and since I don't like Ugin anyway, let's do that right away.

February 11, 2016 10:13 a.m.

Rayenous says... #32

I do believe that it would not be impossible.

Prior to the Mending, Bolas had 25,000 years of 'arcane experience'. - This could have allowed him to predict that Jeska's Spell, required for the Mending, would change the nature of the Planeswalker Spark.

But that would beg the question, "Why did he not simply kill Jeska and stop the Mending from occurring in the first place?" - It was certainly within his ability to do so... It would have been simpler to do that than to go through all the hassle of trying to 'rebreak' the Multiverse.

Besides, even if the Multiverse is 'rebroken', there's nothing to say it will increase the PW's powers at all... it was a secondary effect of a 'Spell' that caused the weakening of the sparks, and not the Mending itself.

February 11, 2016 10:49 a.m.

meecht says... #33

I love how there's a subtle side debate on what term to use if the Mending was undone.

February 11, 2016 11:13 a.m.

GobboE says... #34

hmmm, that is true Rayenous, perhaps he was attached to Dominaria (or something like that), or he anticipatd that the time ripples would have had even worse effects (shattering of the mutiverse) and thus that the spell had to take place.

February 11, 2016 11:21 a.m.

GobboE says... #35

@ meecht : lol indeed, but I think The Breaking, with the Rebroken Mending has the most candidates so far :)

February 11, 2016 11:23 a.m.

Rayenous says... #36

Then there's quite the story-tellers conundrum.

Assuming Bolas was worried about the destruction of the multiverse and thus allowed the mending to occur when he could have stopped it; why would he 1) risk the multiverse by releasing the Eldrazi, and 2) risk the multiverse by attempting to rebreak it.

I suppose that if the multiverse became rebroken, it would cause the remaining Planeswalkers to sacrifice their lives and/or sparks to seal the rifts once more (Remending). - But this, of course, risks weakening Planeswalker Sparks further, including his own which would not be in his best interest.


Everytime I try to think of how this story line might work, I realize it fails...

I'm going back to my original theory.

Ugin created the Eldrazi!

February 11, 2016 11:34 a.m.

RicketyEng says... #37

Here is what I think:

Nissa is the only PW we've ever encountered who can directly manipulate the leylines of a plane (it remains to be seen if she can do this for any plane other than Zendikar). Part of what makes the new plan different from Ugin's original plan is bringing the Eldrazi titans into direct contact with the leylines so their essence can be dissipated through the leylines instead of just suppressed and caged. None of Ugin, Sorin, or Nahiri could directly manipulate the leylines, so the best they could do was trap the Eldrazi using the hedrons to manipulate the leylines. Ugin's warnings against attacking the Eldrazi for fear of driving them away might be based on the assumption that trapping them really is the best that can be done. Ugin and Nissa have never met so he may not be aware that a method other than the using the hedrons exists for manipulating leylines.

Zendikar's resurgence has already been hinted at slightly in Jori En, Ruin Diver's story and Mina and Denn, Wildborn's story. I believe that dissipating the Eldrazi essences back into Zendikar will cause one final series of Roils larger than any before. In this final Roil Zendikar will get a jump start on rebuilding itself.

As for the Mending, the Eldrazi existed and were trapped millennia before the Mending so they are definitely not a product of it.

Wrt Bolas, I maintain that he is in the midst of a very long term agenda which includes using the Eldrazi either as a distraction or a weapon or maybe as a power source. The effectiveness of the Eldrazi as any of these devices would be in jeopardy if Ugin were around to help trap them again, so naturally, Ugin had to go.

I think distraction is the most likely of the three possible uses. To use them as a weapon or power source, Bolas would probably have to directly interact with them, but he has never appeared on Zendikar. It follows then that while we and the heroes of the Multiverse are focusing on the Eldrazi, he has his hand in a different cookie jar.

If, however, Bolas did want the Eldrazi as a power source (as Nixilis has proved is possible to do) then perhaps he just hasn't shown up yet for some reason and is about to miss his chance? Maybe he wanted the Eldrazis' bonds weakened but not destroyed. After all, he orchestrated the meeting of three PW sparks at the Eye of Ugin, but not the actual release of the Eldrazi by Nissa.

In other news, I think it would be really neat if, when Nissa pulls the titans fully into the plane, that they not only get bigger, but also change in appearance somewhat. After all, a hand does not look much like the rest of the body it is attached to.

February 11, 2016 4:26 p.m.

JANKYARD_DOG says... #38

RicketyEng, In one of Nissa's Origin stories I believe, when she first travels to Lorwyn it said she could detect the leylines and knew she was no longer on Zendikar. Could be possible she could manipulate them on other planes.

February 11, 2016 4:58 p.m.

greyninja says... #39

RicketyEng I agree with everything you've said

February 11, 2016 7:45 p.m.

RicketyEng says... #40

Yes, based on Nissa in Lorwyn, I would guess that she probably can manipulate leylines on other planes. That story also mentioned that Lorwyn felt a lot different than Zendikar kind of like having vastly different personalities. I wouldn't be surprised if she required a bit of time or something to get familiar with another plane's heart and soul before she could work with its leylines the same as she can with Zendikar's.

Now I also begin to wonder though, what if Ugin is aware that bringing the titans into direct contact with the leylines could be a way to kill them? Has he not suggested such an idea because he doesn't want to see it happen or because he is unaware that there exists a way to implement it? Either scenario fits the facts and I don't imagine we will get any further clues until after we find out how well the plan works.

February 11, 2016 10:47 p.m.

Faytl says... #41

Here's my opinion: @GoldGhost12 said the Eldrazi are the perfect weapon against Bolas. This is true; Eldrazi don't give a single f*ck about a madness-indusinc touch, theu're mindless, and a single Eldrazi Titan one on one with Bolas absolutely would obliterate him. Ugin thus wanting to keep them penned up as a countermeasure against him is not a terrible idea. That could explain why Bolas would purposefully release beings that pose such a threat even to him; Better to have them roaming free and causing chaos and diverting the attentions of planeswalkers that pose a threat to him than allowing them to stay penned up where Ugin/Nahiri/Sorin can crack the lock and potentially sic them on him at a time of their own choosing.

Probably why he didn't journey there himself to release them, even though he would have been perfectly capable of doing it by just bringing Sarkhan and Tezzeret along with him. He didn't want to be anywhere near Eldrazi Titans when they got out, and he probably didn't want to be on Nahiri's home turf either. She bound Ob Nixilis to the plane, she MAY have the ability to do the same to him, in which case he is SO boned.

So yeah. Ugin wanted the Eldrazi as an emergency deterent against the most dangerous planeswalker in the Multiverse, a sort of "nuclear option" that Bolas tripped himself to take the control out of the hands of his greatest foes. That's what I'm thinking his game is.

February 12, 2016 1:31 p.m.

AgentGreen says... #42

Here's a theory

What if Bolas knew about Ob Nixilis and allowed the Eldrazi to roam free, knowing how to trap them, he counted on Nixilis to use the Hedrons to reignite his spark. Now that has happened Nixilis is in his debt, and Bolas will want to collect on that debt, and having a very powerful planeswalker by his side in addition to Tezzeret would be pretty powerful

February 12, 2016 2:50 p.m.

Ej1997 says... #43

Faytl

I think you're on to something. Back in that era bolas was insanely powerful and more godlike then even other walkers. It would make sense that in a last ditch effort Ugin Nahiri and Sorin would trap bolas with the eldrazi.

I do offer another theory for consideration as to why Ugin would not want the eldrazi destroyed aside from using them against bolas in a last ditch effort. I've been thinking to why Emrakul is so much bigger and more threatening then the other eldrazi. My conclusion has came to that Emrakul is getting ready to spawn new eldrazi titans? Either that or at the death of their children we see the original eldrazi parents or a singular being named eldrazi.

Like what if eldrazi isn't just a creature type but also a name of an insanely powerful planeswalker who was locked away and with the death of each eldrazi Titan another lock is undone. The consequences of Titans death would therefore give Ugin who is in all honesty trying to protect the multiverse and would not want world devouring monsters running around a good enough reason to just trap them and risk them getting loose. It's either one measly Emrakul or one ancient being beyond all evil we've seen since yawgmoth.

February 12, 2016 6:51 p.m.

bennybubbles says... #44

Ej1997 that's a pretty cool theory. Personally I think that there could be more titans, though the planeswalker thing would be cool though.

February 13, 2016 5:57 a.m.

This discussion has been closed