CHEATER CAUGHT
Limited forum
Posted on March 1, 2015, 2:24 p.m. by Gathering4Magic
FOR THE RECORD: A user by the name of Parkerb30 on here, (parkerb32 on untap.in), was just caught cheating at draft. We drafted on here in the tappedout.net draft simulator, and when we were playing on untap.in, he played an extra copy of a card that he drafted. He drafted one scion of glaciers, yet played (at least) two in his deck. When I noticed the discrepancy, I called him out and asked him why he had two copies of a card in his deck that he only drafted one of. His response was "wait, what?" I proceeded to link him to the record of our draft and we sat in silence for a minute before he left the game.
Let it be known, Parkerb30 is willing to cheat, and made no excuse for his behavior. I find cheating to be reprehensible, and thus wanted to let anyone who happens to read this know that if you happen to draft with parkerb30, and play against him as parkerb32 on untap.in or elsewhere, you should be aware that he has cheated against me in the past.
Public shaming is bad. Didn't you read the Scarlet Letter in high school?
March 1, 2015 2:39 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #6
Also, I'd like proof next time, like screen shots, otherwise the validity of the accusation is a little lacking.
March 1, 2015 2:39 p.m.
Isn't knowing your opponent's deck list in a draft also cheating? That isn't supposed to be public information. That doesn't excuse him from cheating, but having everyone's deck list is just as bad.
March 1, 2015 2:43 p.m.
BlueEyesRedMage says... #9
Cheating? This hardly sounds like it. Sitting in silence for a minute after you "found him out" hardly sounds like "made no excuse for his behaviour", it sounds like the guy left what was suddenly an awkward interaction. I found what I assume to be his deck list judging by the date and contents of the deck FRF / KTK / KTK - 2015-03-01 http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/01-03-15-Sem-frf-ktk-ktk-2015-03-01/and I note 2 Scion of Glaciers in there, which obviously doesn't gel with the 1 that your record of the draft shows.
Call it giving him the benefit of the doubt but it hardly sounds malicious, it's likely the result of a careless typing input error or simple mistake.
March 1, 2015 2:46 p.m.
Im more concerned that you used a list of everyones picks.......
March 1, 2015 2:47 p.m.
BlueEyesRedMage says... #11
Also yes, serious big no no on the knowing your opponent's deck list bro. It might be easy to find but hooollly crap is that not cool. Also technically cheating.
March 1, 2015 2:47 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #12
I believe our draft simulator makes it public knowledge, that is if you can draft with other people in it (I can't recall, it's been way to long since I've used it)
March 1, 2015 2:50 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #13
The drafting simulator does allow you to see everyone's picks after the draft, yes. EVERYONE'S, including your own and the other seven or whatever draftees. I'm a combination of impressed/weirded out that you kept that info of the one card that one player drafted amidst ALL THE PICKS OF EVERYONE ELSE.
March 1, 2015 2:54 p.m.
Well he only played against the one guy so he probably looked at that one guys decklist and then played the match, which seems kind of bullshit.
March 1, 2015 2:55 p.m.
BlueEyesRedMage says... #15
Super bullshit. Also, I really don't appreciate the vitriol with which you've written this threat topic. This isn't some PSA dude, if someone is actually cheating or whatever you can tone down the Fox news reporting style and I can personally guarantee I will be 300% more likely to listen to your side of the argument.
Also, I feel like parkerb30 might actually want to see what he's being accused of. Poor guy is being blasted and he's not even here to see it.
March 1, 2015 2:58 p.m.
JakeHarlow says... #17
What the dithering fuck is going on here? Knowing your opponent's deck list is cheating!
March 1, 2015 2:59 p.m.
It looks like he somehow just switched up one copy of Glacial Stalker with an extra Scion of Glaciers. There's a fair chance that while organizing his decklist, he wrote out the names of some cards instead of copy/pasting or edited numbers and accidentally switched up the cards.
Seems like a pretty minor thing to be concerned about, unless for some reason you bet money on the game?
March 1, 2015 3 p.m.
JakeHarlow says... #20
Lol what the fuck is happening to T/O? So many "bitch" threads of late. Like...seriously?
March 1, 2015 3:03 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #22
I think a situation like this is something that you should keep to yourself. Make a list of users you no longer wish to draft with, then don't draft with them.
Also, refrain from looking at their deck list till after the game, then you can compare what they play to what they drafted. Only really matters if you are drafting in the league.
March 1, 2015 3:16 p.m.
notamardybum says... #23
if he cheatef against you before stop fucking drafting with him
March 1, 2015 3:23 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #24
I'm actually glad that the OP is watching out for the community, I'd just like some concrete evidence, rather then just words.
And maybe it could be handled better next time.
March 1, 2015 3:27 p.m.
Schuesseled says... #26
I once had hacks installed on my computer and saw someone wall hacking on counterstrike, it was obvious cause i could see through walls too.
Got that guy banned from the server.
True story, also got banned myself by steam later, also true story. :P
March 1, 2015 3:29 p.m.
Please avoid profanities. Please avoid shit posting.
I appreciate what OP is trying to do but questions remain over why he was looking at the other users list.
March 1, 2015 3:31 p.m.
... aaand OP disappears after sitting for a minute in silence.
March 1, 2015 3:36 p.m.
Wait... Isn't it just a casual draft? Wasn't it just a little mistake?
March 1, 2015 3:38 p.m.
CanadianShinobi says... #30
This is all very lovely and good and pointless. As has been noted I too would like some proof, otherwise I can't even commend you for looking out for the community, because accusations without evidence do more harm than good.
March 1, 2015 3:53 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #31
Damn kids...
SMH. When I was their age we drafted in the snow... With no shoes!
And had to play a tournament during "Black Summer"...
And if we mulligans three times, we lost the game.
Damn kids.
March 1, 2015 3:59 p.m.
gathering4magic is a regular organizer of drafts and so it makes sense he was validating a deck-list.
the drafting community is kind of an off-shoot of the tappedout community, not a lot of overlap and visibility in the forums, but a very present bunch.
anyway, just hand the guy a normal disqualification from the draft and move on. i hope he shapes up!
March 1, 2015 5:17 p.m.
also, this post reminds me of similar posts on other sites about traders that rip you off. i would shut down trading on this website if it ever became a problem that required such posts.
that doesn't mean i will shut down the draft sim, of course, but to the OP, I recommend you come up with a technical solution, such as a 3rd party volunteer review of drafts, so that this doesn't happen again or frequently because as you can see it turns into kind of a mess.
good luck :P
March 1, 2015 5:24 p.m.
JakeHarlow says... #34
yeaGO, there you go again, being all reasonable and mature. :D
March 1, 2015 5:25 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #35
Well i mean to be fair we should all be like that to a degree. Especially us regulars. We really shouldn't troll every one of these posts because it encourages shit posting in general. Hopefully i don't come off as naggy I'm just concerned for the overall being of the site
March 1, 2015 5:34 p.m.
Gathering4Magic says... #36
Sorry I didn't respond to anything, I got offline after posting and am just now getting on here to see all these comments. I will try my best to respond to all relevant things.
Sure, next time, I will remember to screencap the cheating so you all don't just have to take my word for it. Fair point, but to be honest, I was flat out flabbergasted at first, and just exited the game after he left without a word, and it didn't even cross my mind to take screen shots to evidence it. It was only after I left the game and was salty about the way the situation turned out that I thought to let others know what had happened.
For the record, I do not scope out people's deck lists/draft picks before going to a game. If I was scoping out other people's decks before building my own so I knew how to build against the opponents I was facing, that would be a form of cheating. However, that is not at all what I was doing. I only looked it up because the situation was suspicious to me (I just got an odd gut feeling when he played the second Scion right after the first, make of that what you will), and so I looked it up, since having just dealt with a cheater in my last draft tournament. I tend to be more alert to and suspicious of shady behavior in drafts because I run draft tournaments on a regular basis, and this kind of cheating also just happened on Thursday, actually, with a person just blatantly putting a Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker into his deck in a draft that had zero Sarkhans even in it. I wasn't in that match, but as the organizer of the tournament, when I was alerted to suspicious behavior, suspicious looking decks, and the like, I have to make sure people are on the up and up in my tournaments, and so that means checking drafters picks at times when things seem suspicious.
As for some of the commenters saying I shouldn't be able to know other people's draft picks in this online format, are you saying you want tappedout.net to change the way they structure their website's functionality in the draft simulator so that it is EASIER for people to cheat? That seems silly and highly undesireable.
As for comparing this to a real-life situation, where I'm drafting casually with friends (not in a tournament setting, as this specific instance wasn't a tournament either), you're right, I don't get to know other people's picks, but I can still see that same suspicious guy pulling out cards from his personal collection and adding them to his draft picks in the real life draft, which is the closest parallel to this.
If someone needs that small of an edge that they want to see my draft picks before building their deck, so be it. That kind of thing can't be helped when we are drafting on tappedout, as it IS public knowledge what everyone else in your draft picked. Personally, however, as a Tournament organizer on these free online drafts, I find having everyone's draft picks public knowledge very useful in keeping people honest. If I couldn't see these, people would just blatantly cheat the system, kinda like how they still ARE trying to cheat, even when it IS currently public knowledge.
The vast majority of the time, there is no need to examine other people's draft picks, but when I find two people with cards in their decks that they shouldn't have, I'm going to use whatever means I have at my disposal to detect when people are cheating, and I'm also going to call people on it if I discover this kind of mistake/cheat. If a person wants to discuss what happened and it was genuinely a mistake, then I'm willing to work with people, but when they just dip, what else am I supposed to think other than this person doesn't want to face the fact that they got caught cheating?
If he was innocent, I would understand, and be gracious, but he didn't try to explain himself, he didn't say, "sorry, I must have accidentally typed the name of that one card twice" or whatever and let us work it out from there. I can have grace, and we could have figured the situation out. What is suspicious to me is when you say nothing, and just leave. Yeah, cheating IS an awkward situation to deal with, but if it was an accident, say so, and we can figure out if a game is salvageable or not. I am a kind and friendly person to everyone as a rule. I try to be helpful to newer players who are just figuring out the site, and I speak kindly to others as I want them to be kind to me. I do not, however take kindly to being cheated, and when it is the second incident in the same week, I get angry about it. Thus, I will admit that I may have been a bit angry and "vitriolic" when writing the OP, and for that I apologize. That said, I don't think there is anything wrong with letting people know that certain players have done troubling things. Do you really just want me to shut up and not talk about being cheated? Do you also tell the kid at your LGS that they shouldn't call out that scumbag who cheated them on a trade, or in a FNM match for packs if they catch their opponent cheating, and that they should just keep it to themselves, and let other people get cheated too? That is not the kind of person I am. If I can prevent even one other person from getting cheated by informing others of person's who are willing to cheat, and unwilling to account for the mistake if that is what it was, then I think the OP was worth it.
Again, I get that I was a bit angry when I wrote OP and could have worded it in a less hostile way, but I was salty. I get that I could also have toned down the "fox news reporting" too, I just wanted to let others know that this behavior has happened, and tried to be as factual in my account as possible, even though I see now that it was more hostile than I would now like it to be.
Also, I already messaged parkerb30 directly on untap.in as soon as it happened after he left the game to no reply, so he is well aware that I am calling him out for this behavior.
March 1, 2015 6:11 p.m.
I want to see exactly 0 more of these decklord dogpiles on the site.
0.
March 1, 2015 6:28 p.m.
Gathering4Magic says... #41
it appears that decklord is a term (formerly?) used to describe a particular status one reaches on here. This question & Answer from 5 years ago is all I could find on decklord.
"A dogpile is a disagreement on an Internet message board wherein one person says something wrong or offensive, and a large number of people comment in response to tell the person how wrong and/or horrible they are, and continue to disparage the original commenter beyond any reasonable time limit.
People commenting at the same time, without realizing others are jumping on the person as well, do not make a dogpile. The requirement is to join in with an angry group to yell at an easy target, or to get popularity points for being seen to agree with the group. They see that everyone else is doing something, and they copy it.
The original commenter typically does not respond at all, because they are completely overwhelmed or scared off. Once a dogpile has been established, an apology from the original commenter is less likely to be effective." (From Urban Dictionary)
March 1, 2015 11:02 p.m.
Oh so in other words don't have fifteen regular users gang up on someone for a post. Yea, makes sense haha. Didn't know there was an actually term for online dogpiles.
March 1, 2015 11:09 p.m.
JakeHarlow says... #43
Ok, sounds fair to me. I'll be conscientious of this in the future. Sorry, OP, I should have waited for your explanation.
March 1, 2015 11:21 p.m.
I was just cracking wise lol. Wasn't trying to be a dogpiler.
March 1, 2015 11:52 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #45
Im not counting mine as dogpiling, since I agreed with the OP, cheating is bad, and I think making us aware is good, but proof is good too :P
And the OP agreed that proof is good too, in hindsight, and will provide proof, and we all grew closer as a family and yada yada yada
March 2, 2015 12:33 a.m.
Gathering4Magic says... #46
where is the like button? ...upvote? hmmmm....... I think this will do though.
March 2, 2015 12:35 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #47
I thought this was going to be about cheating in professional Magic. How disappointing that it was just petty cheating. Cheating is always bad, but at a casual level, it's not nearly as important to watch for.
March 2, 2015 5:05 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #48
Dogpile is a pretty sweet card though. It's oldschool Massive Raid.
March 2, 2015 5:50 a.m.
00xtremeninja says... #49
not only is he a cheater, he owes me child support! the kid is so malnourished that when he is forced out of his sandbox, he blows up everything. pets, dishes, fine china.
March 2, 2015 12:31 p.m.
vampirelazarus says... #50
JexInfinite I was hoping for that too, because wasn't there don't SCG event this weekend?
ChiefBell says... #2
How do you know what he drafted?
March 1, 2015 2:36 p.m.