Yesterday's EDH frustations
General forum
Posted on Sept. 29, 2014, 2:32 p.m. by Phaetion
Yesterday, I went to the league at my local store (I usually go every Sunday), got my deck read and all that.
The game in question: Sliver Hivelord (me)*, Asuza, Lost But Seeking (Let's call him One), and Oloro, Ageless Asectic (Two). The others were irrelevant as they were eliminated before it all happened.
I was at 28 life with a Malestrom Wanderer, Sliver Hivelord , and Ankle Shanker in play. One had a bunch of stuff including Asuza, Seedborn Muse, and (most importantly) a pair of Maze of Ith s. Two had Medomai the Ageless and some other stuff I can't remember.
- I run the Hivelord because he's a 5-color indestructible beater, and I needed another General option.
Anyway, Mine and Two's attacks kept getting stopped by the Mazes, and I was mana-flooded (I kept drawing lands, even when One had a Horn of Greed out), so I couldn't do much. Frustrating; doubly frustrating. Just my luck. Two didn't have answers to either the Mazes or One's board state. Then, One proceeds to vomit all over the board and win.
Now, how the game turned out was fine, despite me barely holding in the tilt from the combined mana flood and the Mazes. But, the main issue, and what continues to haunt me was One's attitude. Me and Two were on a team, so it was a 2v1 game. Whenever we did something, his response was: "Don't Care," "I will win," etc. Normally, this wouldn't get to me this badly but this time it did, and at this point, I'm trying my hardest not to come across as a douchebag (even though it sounds like it).
Now, I was rather infuriated about it all. I went as far as to build a Vorosh, the Hunter deck that want to make everyone cry, especially Asuza (I'm running somewhere in the realm of 10 each of the following: Creature Spot Removal, Counterspells, and Recursion). However, I feel like I'm becoming something I'm not, all because of One's attitude. I did give him a lame vote (which obviously translates to negative points) originally for the Mazes but even as that wore off, it was still completely justified: One's attitude RUINED the entire game. Even if it was just a couple lines, the game stopped becoming fun in a matter of seconds. And I'm still VERY bitter about it. I want to run the deck again (albeit in another form) but I have a desire to bring the Vorosh deck in and make everyone suffer out of pure, unadulterated spite.
I know it's a long post, and if you read it through, I commend you. Bottom line is (DISCLAIMER: This is not a Spirit of EDH discussion necessarily): Does the attitude of people dictate how fun an EDH game can be? I don't want to run Vorosh and power it down but I'm feeling vengeful enough to keep it intact. I need some advice. I got a week or two to decide what to run but I'm not sure what to think here because that tilt about attitude is hard to ignore. Run the same old deck or take Vorosh in and show Asuza who's boss? Thanks in advance.
asasinater13 says... #3
attitude definitely has a big effect on how fun the game can be. I've run games of nothing but lands or not hitting a land that are much more fun than games where I'm winning in a pod with a bad attitude about it (slightly different situations than each other, but you could see the point)
September 29, 2014 2:40 p.m.
canterlotguardian says... #4
Do you enjoy playing Vorosh? If so, then go right ahead and play him. Don't worry about ruining Azusa's fun. If it happens, it happens. That's on him that his fun was ruined, not you.
September 29, 2014 2:41 p.m.
Yeah, this was the first time attitude came up in such a huge way.
It depends on what that certain attitude is. If it's the kind where the player's enjoying themselves, then that would increase how fun the game is. In this case? Completely the opposite.
Well, I'm not one to be cutthroat and competitive. If I played the deck right now, I just know that I'm not going to have much fun at all, if any.
September 29, 2014 2:42 p.m.
You need to look after yourself before you think about dealing with someone else. If you don't think you'll enjoy it - then don't do it.
September 29, 2014 2:44 p.m.
I didn't use Vorosh in the league because I felt that once he got tucked, the deck flops belly up and dies (It's an issue I'm trying to resolve). But, if I power down the deck, then it should be more fun for others to play against.
September 29, 2014 2:46 p.m.
Don't consider how much fun others have playing against your deck. You need only consider two things - 1) how much fun you have playing it and 2) how nice you are socially with others. You have no obligation to be 'nice' from a deck building perspective.
September 29, 2014 2:47 p.m.
I know I shouldn't but I get the feeling that the deck I normally run can stand up but it's never won a game. Winning never mattered to me, and that is true still. That should be the icing on the cake, not the water you drink everyday (Hopefully you see where I'm getting at).
I probably might not end up running Vorosh but I might need to pile shuffle before I leave to play.
September 29, 2014 2:48 p.m.
Dont worry about that players. Last time when I was playing EDH with a couple friends the usual d-bags of my LGS came (they are 2 and they are always d-bags not just in EDH) and they was like ''we have the best EDH decks,yours dont stand a change,change your deck etc''. Just ignore them and smash their faces.(in the game!)
September 29, 2014 2:56 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #11
"Winning never mattered to me" then don't let it bother you. If you play in a league and want to win more, play like it. As long as your nice and have fun who cares?
September 29, 2014 2:58 p.m.
Problem is, it is bothering me. It's not a case of "I want to win more" but a case of "man, lie sucks now" because of the attitude used.
September 29, 2014 3:02 p.m.
Dont play with him again.Thats a choice.Or complain about the event to the store owner.
September 29, 2014 3:06 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #14
Ignore him and move on. At the end of the day is it worth it? No. Magic like every other hobby should be done for your enjoyment, don't let him ruin you day/how you play because they're a POS.
September 29, 2014 3:06 p.m.
Ohthenoises says... #15
I have a edh deck (AT&T and Cingular's Love Child) that regularly wrecks my local shop doing something similar to what One did. It's really not even fair because I am very adept at baiting counter magic and 9 times out of 10 it just wins out of nowhere.
I feel bad when I win with it because I feel like it was a cheap win. To combat this, I am very open about what's in my hand. If I draw my Primal Surge I'll show it to people, just so they can prepare themselves. If they can kill me before I get to cast it I will congratulate the table. This takes the edge off of the consistent wins that it puts up and makes people hate me less.
September 29, 2014 3:57 p.m.
What? That sounds fucking awful. The whole "I win now" mentality that everyone's complaining about. Gloating about an imminent win is one of the worst things you can do.......
September 29, 2014 4:03 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #17
I gotta agree with ChiefBell, why show them? From the sound if it, doing so still means you win and its practically taunting the table.
September 29, 2014 4:11 p.m.
Ohthenoises says... #18
ChiefBell were you talking to me?
If you were, i very RARELY play the deck. Only when they have the "god as commander" restriction in place. Normally I play other stuff.
I'm not "I will win, suck it everyone!" Rather, I'm more along the lines of "Look guys, Primal Surge in hand with mana to cast it next turn, now's your chance to kill me."
I rarely get oppressive with my attitude, it's just a general warning.
If you weren't talking to me just TL;DR me.
September 29, 2014 4:14 p.m.
No, I was. I thought your comment was sort of like 'hey I'm about to win LOLOLOL suck it', rather than something else. I guess it's hard to judge tone on the internetz.
September 29, 2014 4:18 p.m.
Ohthenoises says... #20
I like giving them the chance to win, I like giving them the chance to kill me. They've gotten better as a group. One time someone reanimated a Gray Merchant of Asphodel 5 times in a turn just to drop me to 2 so that the NEXT person could Sorin Markov me to death. I was honestly impressed as hell.
Insert "I'm not even mad, I'm impressed" meme here.
Point being I don't like to be the guy who just goes "Primal Surge you all die." I'd rather see them work together to stall or outright kill me. I know the deck wins so I like to play fair.
September 29, 2014 4:19 p.m.
I kind of see where you're coming from. I would urge caution as you toe the line between being playful and arrogant.
September 29, 2014 4:22 p.m.
allthingsMTG says... #22
Ohthenoises my prossh deck is like that but a lot of my playgroup doesn't get the memo, cause my deck can win subtly....hah suck it blue, the other colors can be stealthy about winning. right not the topic......sorry I get distracted a lot, my point is my deck uses to things to win 1.) I infinite combo with earthcraft purphoros and squirrels nest for infinite damage to the entire table, or 2.) food chain, prossh and infinite kobolds to sac to prossh with haste and kill with GD(aka general damage).
September 29, 2014 4:24 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #23
One thing I love about my group is that we don't have to justify playing a game ending card.
September 29, 2014 4:25 p.m.
MindAblaze says... #25
I tend to get frustrated when Fortune is not handing out milk and cookies. I don't like it when she gets in the way of my deck doing what it's supposed to do and as a result I lose. When this happens, I could see myself being annoyed by what Ohthenoises obviously intends to be a helpful "the end is nigh" comment. That being said, I see the value in giving them the heads up when you're playing the deck that always wins, and you know somebody probably has an answer...although if they're playing against you and they see you have the 10 mana to cast Primal Surge they should probably be doing that anyway.
To the OP I think generally play whatever deck feels right. I'm considering taking Iona, Shield of Emeria
out of my Mayael deck because I happen to play in a playgroup that 4/6 guys play mono-colored commanders 50% of the time. I feel bad locking one or two people out of the game while everyone else continues to grow around them. I love Iona and I use her to protect myself from mass exile or bounce, but sometimes it's just cruel.
September 29, 2014 4:52 p.m.
Ohthenoises says... #26
MindAblaze! I usually do it just to give other people a chance to win. Like I said, it's cheap how I can go from almost nothing to "hey look, 2 eldrazi gods and 162 other fatties."
I never say it in any kind of tone other than apologetic. More like "oh crap, I drew it, I mean I can't NOT play it...." I found people would rage more if I DIDN'T say anything and just cast it. So I just simply started to play with full disclose in mind. It seemed to make things a little better at the table.
I mean I have 13 commander decks right now in paper. It's not a deck I play all the time, I was just making a note that I have a deck that does a similar thing and that he could have done something like I did rather than be a dick about it.
Usually I will put myself on a self imposed "losing streak" for a few weeks just to not get too much hate. I go to play not to win and I like to feel welcome.
September 29, 2014 5:05 p.m.
MindAblaze says... #27
Yeah. I hear you. I'm sure everyone you play with knows the score too.
I was just saying people should be aware of their own emotions before interpreting someone else's attitude. That's all. It sounds like OP has put a lot of thought into this, even so far as to elude to their own misfortune resulting in a bit of a tilt beyond what Azusa Player brought on.
September 29, 2014 5:29 p.m.
I've cooled down a bit since I posted the thread (having an outlet helps immensely). I just might stick with my main deck as it's one I can have fun with.
I thought about leaving the league since my power level is lower than average. THen again, it's the only place I know, and I'm nervous about going onto MTGO.
September 29, 2014 5:30 p.m.
I was thinking earlier as well, attitude does have a role to play in deckbuilding as well, in a way.
For example, my three main decks at the moment is Xenagod, Vorosh, and 5-Color. Xenagod I know is not a whole lot of fun because I terrorized the table one time, plus it tends to get dull from time to time. Vorosh has not been tested yet but unless I power it down, it will make everyone groan, and perhaps I get hated on for running griefer.dec or something like it. 5-Color, however, is a deck everyone can accept: There's literally nothing that people will groan about (except the occasional Prophet of Kruphix but I don't use her very often). It's a deck I have fun playing because it features a lot of my favorite cards. Against? I know one person said that it's a fun deck (after we traded decks for a bit) but no comment otherwise from anyone.
What I'm trying to say is: If you don't have fun with the deck you're using, then that attitude will reflect during the game, and maybe one or two people could pick up on that. Otherwise, it's a deck you truly like and refuse to rip apart. Then again, I do believe that an EDH deck is a reflection of its owner. I wonder if that's relevant somewhere...
September 29, 2014 6:45 p.m.
If it's EDH, how did player one have a pair of Maze of Ith s?
September 29, 2014 7:55 p.m.
nikki_dubs says... #32
I really don't blame you at all for getting that upset. Attitude ruins any game, especially cockiness like that. It just stops being fun when you can tell the other person is not only a gloating egomaniac, but also doesn't respect you. I stayed away from playing Magic with anyone outside of my group of gamer friends specifically because I didn't want to deal with people like him (thankfully I went to my first prerelease when Khans was dropping and played against some really awesome dudes). They just destroy a good time, and it's on them for doing it, not on you for getting upset about it.
If you think you're going to have a good time slaughtering his Azusa, then by all means, go for it. But you seem concerned that running a deck out of spite will take all the fun out of it. Why bother then? This kid sucks. Beating him isn't going to make him suck less. As fun as taking a dump in his arrogant Cheerios would be (and God, I really kind of want you to), he's probably going to have the same crappy attitude--or worse--if you beat him. You'll get bragging rights, but it sounds like you won't really be doing it on your terms. Sort of a hollow victory, don't you think?
September 30, 2014 8:51 p.m.
I agree at that point. I'm more or less over it now but this is why my old playgroup was so good. There was none of that cockiness/"I must win" stuff going on. Shame I graduated...oh well.
Honestly, I tested my so-called "competitive" decks against my main one, and the latter won them all (except once), so it's pretty clear that I should stick to the deck I truly like. I have no say in whether I play against him or not (It's decided by die rolls, pod sorting...you know) but I don't play with him often.
I agree with the hollow victory; I would have had my revenge satisfied but there's no real victory in it. A true victory is one where you win on your own terms-and have fun doing it. I especially would lose out on the latter. I thought about leaving but it's the only real-life group I know (And I'm nervous about joining MTGO).
September 30, 2014 10:26 p.m.
Larzachard says... #34
Personally, I think attitude is important in any game, and that if you think winning is the only point to playing you have some misplaced priorities. The best thing I can say is don't add fuel to the fire. People with the "I don't care I still win" attitude are like cancer, soon everyone will adopt the same just to compete/prove him wrong, and then the whole playgroup loses sigh of the important part of the game: having fun and turning cardstock.
Also I know what Ohthenoises is talking about. I often find myself in the same situation with my Dark Lord Kresh. -help! deck at my local store. The deck itself may not be a competitive behemoth, but it does radically negate the most common play styles in the group, making it hard for most everyone to deal with. Instead of taking advantage of this, I often encourage others in the group to gang up on me, or drop less than subtle hints at whats on its way next, giving time for everyone to come up with counters. Instead of adopting the "I win, you suck" attitude, I make try to make the game fun by keeping an upbeat and comedic attitude about whats going on. That alone keeps the game in a good flow, instead of pooping on poeple's parade
October 9, 2014 1:38 p.m.
Yeah. I had another game where that happened, this time with Derevi and its Prophet of Kruphix /Deadeye Navigator shenanigans. Everyone, including myself, gave the player the lame vote for it. Karmic Justice, I'd say.
Now, I don't run Prophet of Kruphix often but when I do, I don't try to protect it, and for good reason. Once I got my creatures out, she could hit the bin for all I care.
The last game was super sweet. I reaped so much advantage with the combination of Jeskai Ascendancy , Temur Ascendancy , and Maelstrom Nexus . Then, when an Oloro player wiped the board, I gained up to 30 life thanks to Mycoid Shepherd . I won the game soon after. Better yet, no negative attitudes. at all.
ChiefBell says... #2
Does other's attitude affect how you perceive the game? Of course it does, absolutely yes.
Should people feel obligated to have a certain attitude to increase the fun of others? Probably not, but it's a nice thing to do.
Should you be afraid of running a 'good' EDH deck because you don't want to offend people? No, you shouldn't. Personal attitude is separate to how good your deck is. You can be a nice guy and still crush everyone.
September 29, 2014 2:37 p.m.