My thoughts on some M11 spoilers...
General forum
Posted on July 4, 2010, 8:30 p.m. by cardcoin
Ok, firstly this is just a general rant and apologies if this is in the wrong place... But after looking into what M11 has in store I couldn't help but fire off my thoughts on some of the cards that have been spoilt thus far...
Blue
I no longer need to hear anyone who is a blue control player complain.
I say this because of 1 card that could potentially spell the end of their crying... I am of course referring to Leyline of Anticipation .
Now, if anyone wants to tell me this won't see play. May I point out what this card means...
- It's a "In your hand, then come out and play for free if you like!" card. and by that it means that you will most certainly want one of these in your opening hand... It's almost worth a mulligan for!
- Your none land cards now have FLASH. Ok, now correct me if I'm wrong, but Flash works something like this... You play a card, I'll FLASH in my Mana Leak , you can't counter it, you must pay 3 or your spell is countered. Infact, no one else can play anything until the flash spell is resolved...
Now with Mana Leak to boot, can you really complain blue player? :)
Oh how about Jace? No, I know Jace has not been spoiled... but there is 1 cards I'm interested in myself...
card:Jace's Erasure Cost: 1U Type: Enchantment Rules Text: Whenever you draw a card, you may have target player put the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
Now, with this, I can start milling you on the basis of using cards like jace,-the-mind-sculpture or See Beyond , and whilst I'm millin' ya, I'll search out for some answers for X,Y and Z... X being that feckin' millin' artifact Keening Stone ... Y being Graveyard Removal, and Z being an alternative Win Condition.
Lets face facts... Milling can be a lot of fun already. But this is just insanity.
I can see anti-enchantment cards being used a damned lot more in future games... Now what else dare I point at in fear... Oh yeah, the trickery of...
Black
Well, Diabolic Tutor is back, and it's brought about a new scary titan target to hunt...
Grave Titan is a 6/6 Deathtouching giant for 4BB that has the following ability... "Grave Titan enters the battlefield or attacks, put two 2/2 black Zombie creature tokens onto the battlefield."
Ok, now immediatly I'm thinking... BUSTED.
- It's not a LEGEND. (black/green mana excel anyone?)
- It makes card:Demon of Death's Gate A damned site easier to come out and play.
- It brings tokens INTO PLAY, Not just when attacking... BUT WHEN IT ENTERS THE BATTLE FIELD...
It's almost aching for some form of crazy flash removal/return trick just to get a few more zombie tokens into play, and thats BEFORE it gets it's attack in. This will be a big gun and a threat that will be packing a lot of counter ready decks that will fear this card...
As far as tourney play is concerned, I could see these cards seeing some play in the next year's standard qualifiers...
To polish off blacks Creature rampage...
Phylactery Lich Cost: BBB Type: Creature - Zombie Pow/Tgh: 5/5 Rules Text: As Phylactery Lich enters the battlefield, put a Phylactery counter on an artifact you control. Phylactery Lich is indestructible. When you control no permanents with phylactery counters on them, sacrifice Phylactery Lich.
Theres a lot of enchantment hate, but VERY little Artifact hate, which is why I'm thinking this card could potentially see some play...
Now... Green to which i'm sure everyone is drooling over...
card:Gaea's Revenge Cost: 5GG Type: Creature - Elemental Pow/Tgh: 8/5 Rules Text: Gaea's Revenge can't be countered. Haste Gaea's Revenge can't be the target of nongreen spells or abilities from nongreen sources. Illus. Kekai Kotaki Rarity: Mythic Rare
I don't really need to say anymore about this other than... it's nice, and it's green and it can't be targetted... Just doesn't have trample though... I'm sure though that the trampling issue will be fixed up soon enough with a nice card.
Now for the elf lovers out there...
Fauna Shaman Cost: 1G Type: Creature - Elf Shaman Pow/Tgh: 2/2 Rules Text: G, T, Discard a creature card: Search your library for a creature card, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Then shuffle your library.
Finally a card Elf Decks will love... Oh, and Omnath will love elves too! Hmm, What do you get if you mix elves with Mana, Omnath, and a few of those mythic rare Vengevine ? Answer... A Solid deck idea that pulls threats from all areas... This card could make type 2 next year look insane.
The 1 other standout Green card for me is... Mitotic Slime Type: Creature - Ooze Pow/Tgh: 4/4 Rules Text: When Mitotic Slime is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, put two 2/2 green Ooze creature tokens onto the battlefield. They have "When this creature is put into a graveyard, put two 1/1 green Ooze creature tokens onto the battlefield."
This is a broken busted card of many many tricks... Momentous Fall just got a great combo peice for Green to draw with that doesn't lose board advantage!
Oh, and anything that runs come into play effects, or leave play effects will love this card.
Well, thats my thought, Anyone else got their thoughts on the cards being spoilt? What's your views on what you've seen? Is it tourney worthy or just stuff that won't work very well. I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Yeah, confused flash with Split Second I did. Still, i find Leyline of Anticipation a very interesting and disruptive card. Espicially for sorceries. :)
July 4, 2010 11:55 p.m.
Leyline of Anticipation looks fun, but I think the real blue threat is from cards like Preordain , Foresee , and card:Jace's Ingenuity. Cards like this allow blue to power through their deck and find exactly what they need and, because of their rarity (or lack thereof) you will see them way to often in drafts. Then there is big blue daddy: Redirect . Strictly better than Swerve while providing blue a good way to deal with pesky "uncounterable" spells. Also good for stealing auras.
July 7, 2010 1:18 a.m.
Redirect is gonna be a monster as it gets round the issue of uncounterable spells... like Banefire .
card:Jace's Ingenuity is an awesome card draw mechanic that will be held back until the end of your opponents turn, and doesn't need laylines-of-anticipation to do so... unlike most other big draw spells in Type 2.
Preordain and Foresee will be awesome cards for draft, but also interesting for the new 4/4 Conundrum Sphinx 's ability.
Standard and Extended could see some major radical shakeups with M11 being released... Times are indeed going to be interesting :)
July 7, 2010 2:35 a.m.
To continue my ranting...
I thought blue was coming up to par, but apparently from the spoilers to date, I've only one colour that I'm gonna hate more than any other...
White.
Life (gain) is a joke. And M11 has made it somewhat easier...
What is the best 1 drop in EDH? Well, this surely has to be a contender...
Just take a moment to think about the amount of abuse in Multiplayer games this little 1 drop creature can take advantage off...
Lifelink is bad enough, but to give it a +5/+5 boost if you have 30 life or more? This guy could get seriously busted and make white hated. Two Headed Giant where ya share life totals and begin with 40 life? 1st turn 6/6 life gaining flyer? insane!
and if you think thats bad... what about this instant to compliment it?
Now, not only does white get to be life hoarding, it can also setup to do it for a turn without anyone budding in... Or this gem of a card will stop certain decks from going off at all... (It's just a card waiting to be busted)
What about the Sun Titan ? It's basically a god card in limited and draft (if your lucky enough to get this) though what does it bring to the table in standard is yet to be seen... though getting your oblivion ring back may prove interesting... Or for that matter any assortment of creature or enchantment... the potency of this card could be fantastic or a flop... Just depends what White will get in future sets. (Never mind Oblivion Ring being back in)
Of course, if Oblivion Ring was cycled out of Standard, then decks would be all about the eldrazi. Thankfully it's back, but with things like Sun Titan coming back in... Oblivion Rings are going to be feared even more.
July 7, 2010 2:39 p.m.
Now when it comes to Red, there is a few things I'm thinking that are rather good...
Making people reset is always a good thing if you plan ahead for it... now straight away I'm thinking mid range plan, using blue with Red, you could get layline-of-anticipation into play, and then play Destructive Force at the end of your opponents turn with 1 mana left in your pool for a devestating-summons to get the board effectively wipped out and have 2 6/6 creatures left that can attack on your turn.
It's also interesting to see Fling come into a core set. Getting an eldrazi into play and being able to fling it could effectively end the game. But of course Red has more than enough pumpers to make Fling a powerful end game spell
leylines-of-punishment Is going to be a massive sideboard card against life gain and prevention decks.
Red seems to be getting a boost also from goblins.
2 cards really standing out from M11 though for me. Reverberate could be the new non-blue counterspell!
Pyretic Ritual is screaming for combo abuse... Eldrazi token's + this card could help fuel an awesome combo to abuse things like Wild Evocation ...
Good thing then that Inferno Titan doesn't destroy lands :)
Speaking of which wouldn't it be funny with Wild Evocation in play that come your next upkeep you play the instant and bring into play that Emerkul you have left in your hand? :)
Overall, Red have a mixed bag of tricks to which seem to be a powerful colour to splice into other colours, as a colour to stand out on it's own, we can only wait and see...
July 7, 2010 4:13 p.m.
In regards to Serra Ascendant , I'm pretty sure that ones individual life total is technically half of the team total. This means that if your team has 40 life to start with, your individual total is still 20. You would actually need to reach 60 life for the ascendant to get nasty.
As for Sun Titan , yea, it will pretty much dominate in drafts, but that is what good mythics do. I remember playing in the m10 pre-release against some insanely lucky individual who packed two Baneslayer Angel . I didn't stand a chance, but that's just the luck of the pack.
July 7, 2010 8:32 p.m.
@csmash
Now I'm not 100% sure about the ruling as of now, but I haven't played 2 Headed Giant or EDH since 7th ed. lol
According to random checks online... (thanks google!)
For 2 headed Giant...
How do life totals work? Each team has a shared life total, which starts at 40 life.
And EDH...
10- If a player has been dealt 21 points of combat damage by a particular General during the game, that player loses a game.
13- Players begin the game with 40 life
So whilst life totals should be equally something like that, your sharing the life total, so automatically the Serra Ascendant gets the +5/+5 boost. So yeah, I could actually see it being banned in these formats.
July 8, 2010 4:59 a.m.
misshepeshu says... #11
@cardcoin: in terms of abusing conditions on cards that depend on life when it comes to EDH, in my experience, some groups have informal agreements about amending the required amount of life in order to make play more fair and fun. It's why Timmies like me love EDH more than just about any other format. In our group, we agree that anything that's triggered by life points need to have the life automatically doubled, so Felidar Sovereign needs 80 life to give its controller the alt-win, Divinity of Pride requires its controller to have 50 life before gaining the buff to its P/T, Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant requires 60 life before being flipped, etc. That's just our group, of course, but I just wanted to make the point that EDH is a format that allows for (even encourages) people to come up with agreements that help make the game fun and, if broken, at least broken in a hilarious and awesome way.
Can't speak as to two-headed giant rules since I've never played it in any kind of formal setting.
July 9, 2010 3:56 p.m.
Hex-Talvenan says... #12
So in my playgroup everyone always seems to go straight after me no matter what type of deck I am playing. I was just wondering if it is ok to scoop in a casual game when everyone seems to be after you or what the general opinion of this is?I mean by your turn two you are already dead or if you survive for long they just kill all your creatures and deny you playing anything but don't kill you. Am I justified in scooping? I don't like to, but when they do this it just makes me want to quit playing magic.
April 11, 2014 1:17 a.m.
Hex-Talvenan says... #13
And what could I possibly do to remedy this? I don't want to have to find a new group cause they are my friends and I like playing duels with them. Should I just not play multiplayer games?
April 11, 2014 1:19 a.m.
CanadianShinobi says... #14
Totally. I would also recommend finding someone else to play with if that's the way things are.
April 11, 2014 1:20 a.m.
Tell them if they keep ganging up on you you'll stop playing. And then, if they keep doing it, just scoop. Eventually, they'll either decide they want you to play and stop ganging up on you, or you'll have to find better friends.
April 11, 2014 1:44 a.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #16
First, ask yourself why they keep doing it. There's a 50/50 shot that it's something you are doing that is triggering t his behavior. I'm not necessarily saying it's justified behavior, just that they probably have a reason.
For example, do you play decks that seem considerably stronger than those played by your friends? If so, they are justified in ganging up on you if they are otherwise guaranteed to lose.
There's also a chance that you're a jerk and they're trying to make a point. Again, I don't know you. You could be very nice and this paragraph could be irrelevant.
Have you tried asking them why you're being singled out?
April 11, 2014 2:58 a.m.
Hex-Talvenan says... #17
I am pretty sure I am not a jerk, but we have a new player coming tonight and I will ask him what he thinks. I switch between three different decks. A W/U spirit tribal deck, an Izzet Midrange deck, and a Golgari Aggro deck. My favorite deck was a Naya Hexproof deck that I used to run, but I stopped playing it after they told me it made the game no fun for them. Of all the decks above the Naya deck is really the only deck that their decks cannot deal with. I try not to attack anyone unless they start the aggression, and even at that I only defend myself against what they do.
April 11, 2014 8:09 a.m.
Servo_Token says... #18
Typically, if you point out that you are being targeted, and don't appreciate it because you are also there to play Magic, then it will stop. Sometimes they just don't realise that they're doing it, as it's just natural from back in the day when you had that one awesome deck.
I know when I used to play casual, there was a guy that had an Eldrazi deck that was actually competitive modern viable, and it just wrecked all of us. So we would all gang up on him. This became the norm, and soon we found ourselves defaulting to ganging up on him, even though he had switched decks to something far less relevant. He then told us that he didn't appreciate it, and we took note and stopped.
April 11, 2014 8:31 a.m.
It could also be nothing you're doing. It could just be that they know your skill level and they fear that (not literally afriad abviously).
My group often refers to me as the strongest player in the group. I've been playing the longest, play tournament events regularly (they play casual only), have extensive card knowledge due to the amount of time I have been playing. Because of this, games can often turn into 2HG or archenemy depending on who is there that night.
I think NobodyPicksBulbasaur is right about just asking them. As he stated they do have a reason that they are doing it. It might not be a good in reason in your eyes but to them something is justfying this behavior of singling you out.
April 11, 2014 8:34 a.m.
ThatBlueMage also makes a very valid point. It could just be old habits. Good catch blue.
April 11, 2014 8:35 a.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #21
If they're your friends then you'll be able to talk with them honestly about this.
"Guys, I know I had to stop playing my Naya Hexproof deck because it made your games no fun, but game after game of everyone ganging up on me is sucking up all of my fun. Are my other decks still so scary that you feel like you have to play this way?
April 11, 2014 9:29 a.m.
Schuesseled says... #22
Eventually they will stop attacking you and focus on more recently threatening players in the group. People are thickle that way. What i would recommend is to design your decks under the assumption you will receive a lot of hate.
stupidly op indestructible stuff, chump, chump and more chump.
and group hug, everyone can draw a card, everyone can search for land. etc. People don't tend to try and kill the guy still giving them three cards a turn.
April 11, 2014 5:21 p.m.
capt_pantsless says... #23
It might also be you're playing the political game wrong. Free-for-all is generally about how many people you can manipulate, and less about the magic-game going on at the same time.
That said, if you don't find political games interesting, you should stop playing FFA and switch to attack-left or whatever. Also, you can always just suck it up for a few losses with FFA - having friends and playing in a group means give-and-take; just don't let everyone constantly take from you during your free time.
Best of luck!
April 11, 2014 8:05 p.m.
Hex-Talvenan says... #24
I talked with my group and they said they go after me because they are scared of all my deck. We discussed it and now we have a one player reach distance rule for free for all.
April 12, 2014 2:19 p.m.
capt_pantsless says... #25
Glad to hear it worked out for you.
You might also want to play crappier decks. Feel free to look through my profile for a wealth of examples!
April 12, 2014 3:28 p.m.
Hallowed_Titan says... #26
I had/have this very same problem. But I know the reason is my many more years of experience and card knowledge. I've somewhat remedied the issue by actively helping them understand what makes a powerful card or interaction and helping them get better cards and strategies.
archz says... #2
With Leyline of Anticipation it doesn't mean that other players can't counter the spells that you cast, it just mean that all of your spells can now be played as if they had "Instant" in their type line.
July 4, 2010 9:59 p.m.