Dimir Keyrune
General forum
Posted on Jan. 7, 2013, 7:14 p.m. by Fleetfiend
Is it just me, or is Dimir Keyrune a bit overpowered than the other Keyrunes?
Especially versus, say, Boros Keyrune:
Dimir gets 2/2 with the addition of being unblockable (which is stunning with the Cipher mechanic). However, Boros is a 1/1 with double strike, meaning it's only a BIT better than being a 2/1.
I'm not trying to be the "thatz sooooo OP!" person, but I just don't feel like the keyrunes are balanced very well.
Nonetheless, some thoughts on Dimir/Boros keyrunes? I personally love the Dimir Keyrune, but as mentioned the Boros one is underwhelming. It should at least be a 1/3, or something.
The key runes seem to be built around the guild's mechanic. as you said the dimir key is madly powerful with the cipher mechanic because the dimir mechanic is cipher. take Gruul Keyrune for example; it has decent stats and TRAMPLE, why trample? because it works tremendously with bloodrush. the boros keyrune is probably going to be less powerful because the boros mechanic has such a simple requirement: Creatures. they tried to make up for it a little with double strike but the fact is the boros mechanic doesnt need an amazing keyrune to work, so wizards didnt give them one
January 7, 2013 7:40 p.m.
Does a ciphered spell stay ciphered on the dimir keyrune even once it switches back to an artifact?
January 7, 2013 7:42 p.m.
Does a ciphered spell stay ciphered on the dimir keyrune even once it switches back to an artifact?
January 7, 2013 7:42 p.m.
gheridarigaaz says... #6
I kinda anticipated the boros one to be more like a 1/2 double striker, e.g. Boros Swiftblade , but if you think about it... boros keyrune is meant to work in a guild that's pretty strongly powered by Trumpet Blast effects, couple it with the possibility that there'll probably be a fair number of battalion cards that do that, it makes sense to give it the same stats that Fencing Ace recieves.
Bar that, either one could be coupled with Exalted to devastating effect. I kinda look forward to running Cipher on a double-striker.
January 7, 2013 7:42 p.m.
EleshBlade says... #7
Wouldn't the cipher spell fall of DImir keyrune after it goes back to an artifact?
January 7, 2013 7:43 p.m.
gheridarigaaz says... #8
Nope... cipher isnt like an enchantment which can only be attached to a specific permanent type.
Think of it as more like Imprint. The cipher card is removed from the game and imprinted on a permanent, wether the permanent changes type the imprint stays regardless...
January 7, 2013 7:47 p.m.
no, it stays encoded on the card. you will just have to pay to make it a creature again and hit your opponent.
January 7, 2013 7:47 p.m.
The encoded spell doesn't fall off the keyrune after it transforms back into an artifact, just like +1/+1 counters don't fall off a manland, which is why the keyrune is just stupid with the mechanic.
January 7, 2013 7:49 p.m.
Fleetfiend says... #12
Yep, that also makes it harder to get rid of, too.
I mean, I don't think the Boros Keyrune is BAD. I just think the Dimir one is ridiculous! xD
January 7, 2013 7:54 p.m.
The_Darkhorse says... #13
The problem is cipher is one of the weaker mechanics to come from the set
January 7, 2013 7:55 p.m.
Say whaaaa??? Cipher is like so freakin awesome with stuff like Latch Seeker , Invisible Stalker , and Dimir Keyrune. Extort and Bloodrush are much weaker in my opinion.
January 7, 2013 7:58 p.m.
Fleetfiend says... #15
Yeah, Darkhorse, I'm not sure where that came from. I agree with Chubbub.
January 7, 2013 8:03 p.m.
hollandboys says... #16
Cipher could be one of the most broken mechanics. However, with the cards printed so far it does strike me as being viable in competitive play. I've been wrong before though
January 7, 2013 8:19 p.m.
In defense of bloodrush, it is almost impossible to counter this ability when activated in response to not being blocked and is just gives a choice as to whether or not you want a creature or a buff spell and even the less efficient bloodrush creatures like Zhur-Taa Swine can push in 5 extra damage for only 3 mana.
January 7, 2013 8:22 p.m.
hollandboys says... #18
As for the keyrunes, I agree that boros got the short end of the stick, it's definitely the worst one. But I find there is an imbalance in lots of the stuff released this set. I mean, compare Selesnya Charm or Azorius Charm to dimir charm or Izzet Charm
January 7, 2013 8:23 p.m.
MagnorCriol says... #19
1/1 double strike is not barely better than a 2/1 - double strike is a very powerful ability. Any static p/t boost or attack trigger that boosts power gets massive value from double strike, and that's exactly what we can probably expect from Boros cards.
2/2 unblockable is still pretty powerful though, no doubt. It's hard to deal with since you can't kill it with sorceries and you can't stop it in combat unless they have to block with it. I'd still rate it behind the Rakdos keyrune though, and it might be behind Golgari and Boros' too; Ill have to play them to figure it out.
January 7, 2013 8:25 p.m.
Fleetfiend says... #20
That's a good point about the pumping, for sure. But the 1 toughness still makes me cringe. xD
With bloodrush, though, it could be quite powerful, as well as with battalion if they show up with team-boosting abilities (which I don't doubt they will).
January 7, 2013 8:29 p.m.
MagnorCriol says... #21
You know, come to think of it, the Boros keyrune is pretty brutal with cipher as well, as long as you have a way to get it through. How would you like to get that cipher spell twice? =p
January 7, 2013 10:04 p.m.
cartwheelnurd says... #22
the eyrune's not thak broked open with cipher. You cand encode cipher on it unless its a creature. TO get Call of the Nightwing on a stick with it it costs 6 mana ff the bat and then 2 each turn. Its not so great once you have to be playing other stuff.
January 8, 2013 12:51 a.m.
MagicalHacker says... #23
Scar175 and I are currently trying to build keyrune decks, involving three keyrunes in a wedge/shard with board wipes (Terminus , Blasphemous Act , Bonfire of the Damned , Supreme Verdict , Mizzium Mortars , Mutilate , etc.) and a couple of particular buffing permanents (Homicidal Seclusion , Cathedral of War , Curse of Stalked Prey , Collective Blessing , Kessig Wolf Run , card:Slayers' Stronghold, Gavony Township , Rancor , Sorin, Lord of Innistrad , Liliana of the Dark Realms , Ajani, Caller of the Pride , Angelic Benediction are all of them, although re-equipping a great equipment each turn could be possible too). If you have any ideas you would like to share, let me know at Key To Success.
That being said, the Boros Keyrune, even though it has a small butt, is by far the best keyrune for this strategy so far. Dimir Keyrune, not so much. Two mana every turn for a shock is not OP, and unlike the Azorius Keyrune , it can't block fliers. With just one power buff, the Boros Keyrune matches the same damage as any other keyrune with the same buff. More than that, and you're looking at something scary.
January 8, 2013 7:12 a.m.
cartwheelnurd says... #24
a great dude for your strategy is the new gideon. I think hes great as a 4/4 or bigger that lives through board wipes. Get his +1 once, then wipe turn 5, and he attacks for a ton.
January 8, 2013 1:15 p.m.
card:Angel's Tomb with Archwing Dragon would be an interesting addition that could survive board wipes.
Also, Obzedat, Ghost Council would be interesting. 2 damage, 2 life and a 5/5 attacker each turn that will survive your removal.
January 8, 2013 1:27 p.m.
I can't wait to throw a Civic Saber on a either the boros OR Dimir keyrunes in drafts.
January 8, 2013 5:53 p.m.
cartwheelnurd says... #27
@rayenous
Obzedat dies to sorcery-speed board wipes that you play. He exiles on your end step.
January 8, 2013 7:34 p.m.
Roborapter says... #28
i'm just wondering what ability the simic keyrune is going to have, the izzet one already draws you cards so what will the simic one do? what flavorful mechanic will fit!?
January 8, 2013 9:32 p.m.
Fleetfiend says... #30
That's a good point. Maybe something like "Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, put a +1/+1 counter on target creature." Since just plain Evolve wouldn't make much sense on a keyrune.
January 8, 2013 9:59 p.m.
doinitwrong says... #31
My guess is that Simic Keyrune will be a 2/2 Hexproof. The Izzet one having a triggered ability rather than keyword was probably just due to there not really being any UR keywords other than Flash.
January 8, 2013 10:40 p.m.
Fleetfiend says... #32
2/2 Hexproof would actually be pretty awesome. Then again, Keyrunes are already hard enough to get rid of. xD
January 8, 2013 10:47 p.m.
10vernothin says... #33
call of the nightwing+invisible stalker is enough to churn out chump blockers, and they're reliable, so you can cipher in 3 or 4 and have them all happen.
January 8, 2013 11:18 p.m.
Roborapter says... #34
i think the +1/+1 counter one would be pretty cool. i'm not sure about the hexproof one, sounds cool but that's not much of a simic thing
January 8, 2013 11:32 p.m.
in a format that still has Searing Spear and Brimstone Volley , i don't think Dimir Keyrune will stack up as power as you think it will. this isn't even mentioning all the artifact hate (because keyrunes are still artifacts even if they are turned on)
i highly doubt your opponent will let a 2/2 unblockable just sit there, if he has a chance to do something about it then he or she will.
Dimir Keyrune is going to be a champ in limited though.
January 9, 2013 6:56 p.m.
The only problem with puting cipher on the keyrune is you cannot put it on the keyrune as an artifact. So if you wish to play a cipher effect on the keyrune that spell essentially costs an extra B/U. Most of the cipher effect cards we have seen so far cost at least 4cmc already
Roborapter says... #2
you're definitely right about the balance of power BETWEEN the keyrunes. i think rakdos keyrune is definitely the best of all so far, 3/1 first strike? the only other one that can kill it is boros keyrune and as we can see, it is not nearly as powerful
January 7, 2013 7:38 p.m.