Group Hug EDH
Deck Help forum
Posted on Oct. 15, 2016, 9:28 p.m. by Eiti3
I have a wonderful group hug edh deck under construction, but like usual, I am about 50 cards over the max. Won't share it for irrational reasons and I'll worry bout the cutting later. But that isn't the main reason I'm here. I'm here to ask Group Hug Questions.
How functional can a group hug deck be? How many huggy cards is enough or too much? 30? 50? Is running an additional (smaller) theme like tokens or control too much of a burden that takes away from the overall group hugginess?
Thoughts? I think I really need a solid conversation on this sort of deal. I've never even played a group hug deck before, but I always like the idea behind it.
I have seen a group hug deck run 5 colors with child of alara as the commander. He gave everyone lands and card draw. Then he would play field wipes the rest of the game, 36 of em' if I'm not mistaken.
Then I have seen another group hug deck that was built purely for group hug. He played things like Tempting Wurm and holowing mine effects. We were all drawing 6 cards a turn and had 3 land drops. I think this decks win condition was just to deck everyone with sheer card draw. But the deck did nothing but help everyone else and nobody attacked him. Because he was giving all that card draw and was preventing everyone from discarding cards. ( Skip discard step for everyone)
It all really depends on how you want to play.
October 16, 2016 3:35 a.m.
I've been running a group hug deck for a while and I have had some really fun games with it. However, my experience with the deck is that it can be a real hit or miss in terms of play experience. Here are a few ways a group hug deck might make a game unpleasant that you'll want to watch out for when selecting your cards:
1) Some people play group hug in a way that stifles game play. They try to constantly save other people and make everyone "play nice." This can potentially bring the game to a crawl and just frustrate people. In my opinion, a group hug deck should should aim to help enable other players, not limit their plays. Still, a little bit of spot removal and counter magic might be needed to keep you in the game.
2) They often benefit combo players more than other deck types. Group hug decks tend to make other decks draw a bunch of cards, which just helps combo decks hit their combos faster. Avoid playing cards like Fecundity, which some decks are able to combo off of.
3) Group hug decks can slow down the game with a bunch of triggers and extra effects that everyone has to keep track of. This may or may not be an issue for a group, but it's something to be aware of when running the deck. If people are getting tired, trying to keep track of a bunch of triggers can start to burn the group out mentally and make the game feel taxing. Take that into consideration when trying to choose between a 1-shot effect like Skyscribing vs. a permanent like Howling Mine. It might help to keep a selection of cards on hand so that you can switch cards out depending on how the group is feeling before the game.
4) Another way that Group Hug decks can slow down the game is by letting control decks draw a bunch of their wraths and other control spells. If more than one of the other players in the group is playing a control heavy deck, it might be better to set the group hug deck aside for that game and play something else. I've had games drag on for 2.5 hours because of all the control spells being thrown around. Games that go that long can really cut into an evening and limit the number of games that everyone gets the chance to play.
Anyway, I'm not trying to say that playing a group hug deck is a bad idea. It's just that there are ways that a group hug deck can make games unpleasant, and its worth noting while trying to decide what style of group hug deck you want to play. I like to play a generally friendly deck that can still possibly win through potentially drawing my opponents out or through cloning the powerful creatures that they drop onto the board. Some people don't care about winning at all, while others just play friendly to hide that they are digging for their own combos to win. Deciding which way you want to go with your deck will help with selecting which cards you'll want to run.
October 16, 2016 6:38 a.m.
I thank each of you for your input. Each post was quite enlightening.
BLEATH, I am not really going for a wincon. The deck I've constructed so far just has two accidental ways of winning. Concordant Crossroads + Loads of tokens (with all my Doubling Seasons) and Mikokoro, Center of the Sea + Earthcraft. The former requires me making the choice to attack. The ladder requires me making the choice to deck someone. Either way, I would need to make the conscious choice to actually win. Other than that, the deck just fuels others.
Slogmog, yea. I can completely see that. My want is to make a completely group hug deck. It doesn't hide a fact that it may kill someone around the corner. It won't have Counterspells or any sort of control. That's the playstyle I'm trying to go for.
SaberTech, your words have concerned me the most. While I doubt I'll be heading down the road of #1, but the ladder 3 are all things I've noticed with playtesting. I have the majority of Howling Mines and Rites of Flourishing hug cards. But as a counter argument, the point of a hug deck (or at least to my knowledge) is to fuel your opponents to maximize their decks. And when you maximize the effects of their decks, the more potential fun can be had. Yet, if people tend to play decks that make the game less fun, control decks and combo decks that win on T3, then it isn't the group hug deck's fault for the enjoyment not being had, but the deck being fueled to do so. However, if I am wrong, do let me know. I know I have skewed outlooks on some things.
But I also noticed the deck I've been building has an immense amount of triggers. Triggers outta the wa-zoo. While I know how the deck works, I can usually minimize the time and run through the triggers as fast as possible. And not too many happen on other peoples' turns, just the Howling Mines and such. I'm wondering if this is too much of a downside? If I know how the deck works, and can make my turn last no longer than 30 seconds and just give a slight reminder on each other person's turn, that should be fine, right?
Lastly, due to my 150/100 cards, how many huggy cards would you recommend running in a group hug deck? I currently have 30. Would you recommend slightly higher, or lower, what?
Thank you all again. It is much appreciated. Anything, and everything else is greatly appreciated.
October 16, 2016 11:18 a.m.
Well... I didn't read the card. That was my bad. Good thing I have Prismatic Omen, but yea...
October 16, 2016 3:20 p.m. Edited.
I agree with you when you say that the point of a group hug deck is to fuel everyone else's decks, but if a game goes sour because a control player gets out of hand with the cards I help them draw then I feel that I still have some responsibility for the game going that way. MtG is a tactical game, and other players will get on my case if I play a group hug card that benefits the person who is already winning the game the most. When I play, I try to figure out which other player is having the hardest time and I'll try to make plays that benefit them the most so that they can get back into the game. However, that just might be because of my deck's focus; I designed it for playing with newer players who wanted to try the format and might need a "pick-me-up" if their deck stalls out on them.
And you are right, even if there are a lot of triggers it's possible to go through them quickly. The trick comes with making sure that everyone knows what's going on, especially if your group hug cards are frequently being put into and removed from play. Some people get used to drawing 3 cards a turn and accidentally keep doing that after your Font of Mythos has been removed. I took Upwelling out of my deck when it became clear that it was too big a hassle for everyone to constantly keep track of the mana that was going in and out of their mana pool. Keeping track of mana like that isn't something people are often prepared to do and it lead to errors, confusion, and possible accusations of people cheating.
In regards to how many group hug cards to run, I run about 26 in my deck plus my Commander. However, with that amount I can say that there have been some games where I haven't drawn any group hug spells for several turns that were worth playing. I would think that most group hug decks want to drop at least one group hug card by turn 3. If you are aiming for a completely friendly list then 30 is a workable number.
BLEATH says... #2
Usually running some sort of token sub-theme helps protect your pillowfort. Don't go super into it with things like Doubling Season (though on second thought it might be worth an include if you're trying to hug token decks).
The amount of "hugginess" depends on your personal playstyle, too. I've seen decks that have absolutely nothing for a win-con and serve to help others win. I've also seen decks that sneak in a win when others aren't paying attention. Develop where you want to be using that type of scale as a reference and go from there.
October 16, 2016 3:04 a.m. Edited.