The Unkillable Player
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on Dec. 13, 2014, 1:20 a.m. by Timekeeper
For a while I've been interested in presenting a game situation in which a player actually cannot lose the game. This line of thought came from trying to figure out what on earth to do with Sigarda, Host of Herons as a commander. I looked at her ability and just thought of all the blanket, overlapping protections that I could.
What I have so far:
Of course we start with a Platinum Angel, but it wouldn't hurt to have Phyrexian Unlife and Melira, Sylvok Outcast to prevent that particular kind of game loss. Then we need an Asceticism or Priveleged position effect, a Witchbane Orb, and Avacyn, Angel of Hope. Lastly, Gaddock Teeg will prevent all mass removal (at least, mass exile) of which I am aware.
My question for everyone now is this: How do I stop Cyclonic Rift?
(Note: Keeping to G/W would be preferred, but I understand this may be impossible. I would still love to hear ideas of any color here, if you have them. Heck, I could always change the commander to Progenitus.)(Note the second: Aside from Gaddock Teeg I would like to avoid locking down my opponents as much as possible. The deck is supposed to be defensive. So no Stax-y Winter Orb nonsense please.)
Nevermore, Voidstone Gargoyle.
There's still mass -X/-X, but of the big possibilities, two (Black Sun's Zenith and Mutilate) are stopped by Teeg, and one (Toxic Deluge) is stopped by Angel of Jubilation. Decree of Pain being cycled kills Teeg, but that could be stopped with an anthem (perchance Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite?)
Platinum Emperion is useful too. Privileged Position does funny things with Sterling Grove or Greater Auramancy. Creatures not attacking you could also work. Maybe Blazing Archon or Moat (if you're made of serious cashmoneydollars)?
December 13, 2014 2:38 a.m.
Also, as far as I can tell, there's no way to become totally unkillable without heading into blue for the Teferi/Knowledge Pool lock.
December 13, 2014 2:46 a.m.
x754: Well, a lot of the better mill targets, which Witchbane Orb gets around; a lot of the stuff that doesn't has X in the cost, which is stopped by Teeg; and then there are two or three that do it on attack or damage, which can be stopped by Blazing Archon or something.
December 13, 2014 3 a.m.
You need Dovescape. Now the opponent can only play creatures. You need Stabilizer to prevent cycle cards.
Melira, Sylvok Outcast, Stabilizer, Dovescape, Platinum Angel, Melira, Sylvok Outcast, Asceticism, Witchbane Orb, Avacyn, Angel of Hope, Sigarda, Host of Herons.
Now you shouldn't be able to lose to anything!
December 13, 2014 4:16 a.m.
also, Vexing Shusher and the dovescape lock is gone.. without an hard lock (null and void, teferi lock) it's really hard to shut down other player's chance.. also, i do not understand why u want to reach an unkillable status, that won't be really funny to your opponents, but u don't want a lock; i mean, the game is over.this combination is hard lock, and i think it is a real thing, i know u asked for non-stax solutions, but ehy, it works =PTeferi, Mage of Zhalfir + Knowledge Pool + Platinum Angel + Mycosynth Lattice + Null Rod + Blood Moon + Moat + Mystic Decree.Teferi + knowledge pool shuts down every spell of your opponents, platinum angel grants you the unkillable status, and mycosynth lattice + null rod, aka null and void, remove activated abilities and mana from the game except for Simian Spirit Guide and Elvish Spirit Guide, but there are no cards that cycle or channel for 2 mana that can bother you; blood moon stops annoying lands such as The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale; moat + mystic decree prevents creature from attacking, cause things like Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis or other trigger-when-attack creatures still work. i think this is the minimum amount of cards you need.
December 13, 2014 5:14 a.m.
TelleoStar says... #11
Better plan: Avacyn, Angel of Hope, Nevinyrral's Disk, Mycosynth Lattice. This ensures that your opponents can only cast one-drops, as all lands they control get destroyed every turn. Then you just need one of the following options to finish the lock-out.
Option one: The only real threat to this setup is Swords, so let's toss in any of a number of spells that give Avacyn hexproof, for example Champion's Helm. What about mill? Well, let's throw in one of the Eldrazi titans and a sac engine like Altar of Dementia and mill goes out the window. Throw down an Aegis of the Gods to prevent burn, and there you go. Unkillable. And that's even a mono-color deck.
Option two: Isochron Scepter and Silence. Use Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas to make the scepter a creature, then enchant with Freed from the Real. Add in Palinchron and Deadeye Navigator and your opponents become unable to cast spells. But for this, you're running a three color deck in blue, white, and black. On the other hand, bonus points for havining infinite mana while simultaneously destroying every land you opponents play. I mean seriously, dick move.
Option three: or, just use Knowledge Pool and Curse of Exhaustion. We're back to a mono colored deck, but only works for as many players as you have copies of the Curse.
December 13, 2014 7:06 a.m.
fadelightningmm says... #12
In gw I can see Nevermore as working but as an edh card that'd be a slot not to waste
December 13, 2014 9:55 a.m.
Doom_of_Valyria says... #13
Timekeeper how about Iona, Shield of Emeria and then declare blue. Boom! No more Cyclonic Rift
December 13, 2014 10:12 a.m.
I built a deck with "wall of I can't die" in it but I used Mycosynth Lattice, Darksteel Forge, Leonin Abunas, Platinum Angel, Witchbane Orb and a crap load of counterspells.
Throw in some Nevermore for rift and then use Phyrexian Metamorph to stop anything else i dont like and I'm golden because everything is hexproof and indestructible including what keeps me from losing. Probably not perfect but it wins a lot.
December 13, 2014 10:33 a.m.
Ok, got this.
Iona, Shield of Emeria + Painter's Servant + Stabilizer + Platinum Angel + Blood Moon...
Now the opponents can't play spells, cycle cards and their lands are mountains! :D
December 13, 2014 10:39 a.m.
Schuesseled says... #16
Teeg locks out rift as well, at least they cant cast it for its overload.
December 13, 2014 12:11 p.m.
Schuesseled that is not right. Just because you pay 7 instead of 2, it doesn't mean that the CMC will be changed. Like, Burst Lightning doesn't get another CMC because it gets kicked! :D
December 13, 2014 12:25 p.m.
The closest I've seen to an immortal boardstate is only possible in GWU and requires around 30 cards. Make it so people can do absolutely as few things as possible. I think I've listed the whole thing before, but if anyone's interested, I could write it out again.
December 13, 2014 12:51 p.m.
Schuesseled says... #19
Good catch, I wasn't reading that properly.
Anyway, Counterspell stops the rift just fine.
December 13, 2014 12:52 p.m.
MagicalHacker says... #21
Unkillable: Blatant Thievery on an opponent's Lich's Mirror.
Tada!
December 13, 2014 12:57 p.m.
Hickorysbane says... #22
@erabel...I'm intrigued...please do go on
@MagicalHacker Why not just play Lich's Mirror?
December 13, 2014 1:03 p.m.
Alrighty. A lot of it has been said here, so I'll try and be as quick as possible.
- Platinum Angel, so you can't lose. I guess also Platinum Emperion, so your life total can't change, but it's not entirely necessary.
- Mycosynth Lattice and Darksteel Forge/Avacyn, Angel of Hope, so your things are indestructible.
- Tajuru Preserver/Sigarda, Host of Herons, so you can't sacrifice things because of opponents.
- Melira, Sylvok Outcast, to prevent infect and also losing your dudes to -1/-1 counters.
- Privileged Position and Sterling Grove/Greater Auramancy, to give your things hexproof/shroud. Alternatively, Archetype of Endurance or Leonin Abunas.
- Mirror Gallery, to stop Legend Rule shenanigans.
- Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite, for reasons regarding the next card.
- March of the Machines, because a lot of these things only affect creatures. This also has the side effect of making all lands 0/0s (because of the Lattice), so Elesh Norn lets you keep yours.
- Witchbane Orb/Leyline of Sanctity/Aegis of the Gods/True Believer/Ivory Mask, so you can't be targeted.
- Blazing Archon, so you can't be attacked.
- Linvala, Keeper of Silence, so your opponents can't use their things (remember, they're all artifact creatures).
- Stabilizer, so no cycling can ensue.
- Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and Knowledge Pool, so only you can cast spells. That won't be too relevant in a minute, though. If you are okay with this being universal, Rule of Law, Eidolon of Rhetoric, or Arcane Laboratory can be used instead, but those would have to be cast last.
- Rest in Peace, to stop graveyard shenanigans.
- Possessed Portal, to stop draws. This makes you sac a permanent every end step, though, so we need a way to make something to sac every turn. Verdant Force works, or Unwinding Clock, some mana, and a way to make tokens without tapping (Heliod, God of the Sun, Centaur Glade, Dragon Roost).
- Teferi's Puzzle Box, which, combined with the Portal, empties everyone's hand.
- Ugin's Nexus, to stop extra turns.
- An Isochron Scepter imprinting Stifle or Trickbind, to stop Bane of the Living's morph trigger from wrecking your day.
- Nevermore naming Humility, the other card that will wreck your day.
End result: Players have no hand or graveyard; your permanents can't be destroyed or targeted; you're the only one with lands; no one can attack you or target you; you're the only one that can cast any spells (assuming you get any somehow); everyone's sacrificing a permanent each turn, which you get around with tokens; and your opponent's permanents are useless.
December 13, 2014 1:27 p.m.
Hickorysbane says... #24
@erabel, oh that's sweet. I thought when you estimated 30 cards it took ALL 30 cards. That's a lot more practical than what I was expecting too xP
December 13, 2014 1:38 p.m.
MagicalHacker says... #25
Because when you would die, normally Lich's Mirror would shuffle in the rest of... well, everything. But if it's not a permanent you OWN, it stays on the battlefield.
AKA, as long as it's there, you can't lose. Platinum Angel is vulnerable to Humility. This... this is not.
The only other thing that needs to be protected against is spells, so Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and Knowledge Pool seem enough to finish it off.
December 13, 2014 3:30 p.m.
TelleoStar says... #26
erabel: For token spawning, in order to sac every turn, Bitterblossom would be perfect, since you've already got a Platinum Angel/Platinum Emperion to stop it from killing you.
December 13, 2014 3:58 p.m.
TelleoStar: I would've used Bitterblossom, but it's a fourth color in a 3-color deck, which doesn't quite work in EDH? It also doesn't work because Possessed Portal causes every player to sacrifice a permanent every end step, so you need one token per player every round, basically.
Jimhawk says... #2
Nullstone Gargoyle gives you a chance to counter whatever they're planning to do unless they wanna toss two spells for it.
December 13, 2014 1:25 a.m.