Superfriends Help yet Again...

Commander Deck Help forum

Posted on July 7, 2018, 10:32 a.m. by BMHKain

Jodah, the Walker that wished He Was...

Commander / EDH* BMHKain


Sorry to say, but I need help yet again. I need 13 (Un... Lucky.) cuts for the deck. I just wanted to know what I should cut, replace, and/or add in place. I'm currently working on a list of combos for this deck. I want the following changes from hereon...

  1. -13 cards.
  2. Possible CMDR Replacement (In the Works...)
  3. Other good cards that could help.
  4. Get the deck to 100% competitive, even though Tappedout can't seem to fix the Meter Glitch...

EXTRA: Try & plan out a cEDH Boros Deck... Got a link found and everything here:

Competitive EDH Staples

Commander / EDH* Lerker


& no: it IS possible, & if nobody wishes to help, so help me... XS

I hope this isn't asking too much. Sorry about that... >~<

Anyways, IF you want to help, just comment if you wish...

Later. Poor Rowan... X'/

BMHKain says... #2

Anyways, I'm now down to 12-13 cuts left. I'd like some ideas for what to cut, since I now have stuff that works wonders with Rowan Kenrith, thus will make the cut soon! ^-^

Of course, I'm open to suggestions if needed. Just post, & I'll see what I can do...

BTW: Here's what I got for Rowan to warrant a spot for her:

Norn's Annex

Ghostly Prison

Sphere of Safety

Sandwurm Convergence

Lightmine Field

If they are good, let me know...

July 8, 2018 9:41 a.m.

cdkime says... #3

Most of those cards are terrible in Superfriends.

  • Norn's Annex wants more support, which the rest of your cards do not provide. A single pillowfort card (a card that makes you harder to attack) does not really help you much, particularly one where your opponents can simply pay life.

  • Ghostly Prison does not protect your planeswalkers from attack.

  • Sphere of Safety requires a critical mass of enchantments you will not find in superfriends.

  • Sandwurm Convergence is a solid card with Jodah as your Commander. It provides strong defence as well as a significant body each turn, particularly with Doubling Season.

  • Lightmine Field does not work in token decks, which most superfriends decks lean toward. You want a small number of large creatures, as they can survive the damage. With tokens, you will not be able to attack without Lightmine Field killing all your creatures.

As I said on my post inspiring you to add these cards, you cannot force Rowan Kenrith into your superfriends deck. As stated previously, if you want to run her, build a new deck around her strengths.

(Propaganda, No Mercy, and Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffsare solid pillowfort cards. I should not have to say this, but feel I must, they are also bad cards in superfriends.)

July 8, 2018 10:30 a.m.

BMHKain says... #4

Hmph. Then it's settled in default. Rowan gets canned for good. Surprising that Sandwurm Convergence gets a thumbs up though...

July 9, 2018 8:54 a.m.

cdkime says... #5

It's not that surprising when you look at it. I'll break down my reasoning to help you better understand where I am coming from, on the assumption detailed analysis of a card might help you make cuts/additions of your own:

  • At eight mana, it is a bit difficult to cast, and, by the time you have eight mana open, there are better cards to be playing. But Jodah lets you cast this for five. Even if you do have to cast this for eight, it's not the end of the world, and you will be able to cast this for five often enough to make it worth running.

  • Superfriends tend to generate lots and lots of tokens, but not so much in the way of flying tokens. That leaves you solid ground defence, but weak to flying creatures. Sandwurm Convergence eliminates that threat. Most importantly, it has that key "you or planeswalkers you control" language several other pillowfort cards are missing.

  • Sandwurm Convergence immediately leaves its mark, as you get a 5/5 the very turn you play it. With Doubling Season, a staple of Superfriends, you get two extremely large creatures for five mana - that would be a pretty good deal even without the pillowfort effect.

July 9, 2018 9:36 a.m.

BMHKain says... #6

Fair enough. Unfortunate that I do have other ideas to a degree:


I already have Avacyn, Angel of Hope in the pruning status; but I couldn't just let it end there. If Lightmine Field is considered garbage in such a case, & Avacyn is nowhere on the field, I have two alternatives; One being weaker than her Sun's Champion form, & a walker already rejected by you, but I still have thoughts on her:

Elspeth, Knight-Errant

Gives you a token, can buff a creature & give it flying, & gives all permanents but your walkers Indestructible as an emblem. Indestructible essentially bypasses the damage done by Lightmine, but there is one other Walker in the running; & you already turned her down before:

Vivien Reid

I wasn't kidding when I say her abilities can make my tokens trample down opponents & allow indestructibility. Even her 2nd ability trumps that of Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury. For Her first ability, we already have Liliana Vess's second ability to put a much needed creature or land into play anyway. Think about that for some time...

With two chess pieces set, I ask: cdkime. I already have Avacyn as a result. Question now, is... Which do you think is the better Walker in your opinion, or neither? Just asking to be sure...

Oh, & Oath of Jace works great with Vivien as well. Remember that. Then again... Surprised Prismatic Geoscope isn't in the roster yet... Maybe I might be able to switch to Sliver Queen after all...

July 9, 2018 10:27 a.m.

cdkime says... #7

I would recommend Eldrazi Monument over any of these options. It provides evasion, a power boost, and indestructible, all at the insignificant cost of one of your tokens per turn.

July 9, 2018 10:48 a.m.

BMHKain says... #8

Hmm... Didn't think the cost was THAT insignificant... One question remains unanswered; Unless I do get Sliver Queen, is Geoscope worth it in Jodah Superfriends? The Manabase I have seems to state otherwise (eg: not enough Basic Land Types to warrant a slot.)

Alright. Since I'm such a damn fool, I'll consider the Cube Grid as I call it. BTW: the Manabase used in the deck is "Tier 1", and might be comparable to some cEDH decks. Shame I haven't enough Basics...

July 9, 2018 11:56 a.m.

BMHKain says... #9

BTW, cdkime (Dunno if you're busy or not...): Imagine if I am able to switch from Jodah to Sliver Queen, would stuff like Sandwurm Convergence be worse, even with Eldrazi Monument? Also, since we got two sources of Indestructibility, would Lightmine Field be useful as a result again, or is it just as bad as before (Not implying Rowan in case you care.)?

Also, it seems the Competitive/Casual Meter is glitched. It is seriously stuck on 91% Competitive. I already know this is irrelevant as anything (So please don't mention that. X/), but do you know if the staff is going to have a fix in the future or not?

I'll shut it for now...

July 9, 2018 12:48 p.m.

cdkime says... #10

Bit busy, so you will have to pardon the abruptness of my answers:

  1. Yes, Sandwurm Convergence would be worse. I do not recall how aggressive your ramp package was off the top of my head, which would be the largest factor in whether it is playable. It still might be worth it to help your tokens in defence - you should playtest the decision at the very least and think about the other decks in your metagame.

  2. I would still be skeptical of Lightmine Field. Since you are going wide, you would really need the support of other cards to make it playable. Without those, it would be a problematic draw.

  3. I do not know enough about this site's behind-the-scenes support. Based on some posts I have seen by administrators, I do not think the competitive metre is a high priority. If it is glitched, it might be a while before it is fixed. It's also possible the metre is not glitched at all and the current alignment Venus with the cards on Mark Rosewater's desk (I am 91% sure this is the method by which the metre calculates the rating) has determined your deck shall be 91% for the time being.

July 9, 2018 1:02 p.m.

BMHKain says... #11

  1. Copy that. I'll probably try & find some Token Friendly Ramp; back to Gatherer I guess...

  2. If Eldrazi Monument isn't enough to support such a minuscule Stax or whatever it is, again, back to Gatherer; though maybe... Stuff that doubles damage might help? Or not? I'll see what to do before review...

  3. Quite understandable. I'll try & rip the zipper on my trap open during this...

July 9, 2018 1:19 p.m.

BMHKain says... #12

I only found two cards of note:

  1. Cryptolith Rite: ALL my tokens can be used as mana; combine with Paradox Engine, they untap after casting.

  2. Leyline of the Void: Combine with Lightmine Field means even with Rowan Kenrith (IF APPROVED), they are forced into a death trap. & even with Eldrazi Monument, this means hell. Not sure if this is enough for Sandwurm Convergence though...

July 9, 2018 1:37 p.m.

cdkime says... #13

You will have to do some playtesting to see if that is sufficient. Cryptolith Rite is a pretty good option, particularly if you switch to Sliver Queen (you can leave your tokens untapped for blocking, then, on the end step before yours, tap them all and get 50% more tokens).

If you want to attack with your tokens, you should not run Lightmine Field - it is too much of a liability. A well-timed removal spell targeting your source of indestructibility can result in your tokens dying in droves. Further, it adds very little to your deck as both tokens and Lightmine Field are designed to cover the exact same threat - attacks going wide with small creatures. Larger creatures with trample - one of tokens' big problems - can shrug off the damage from Lightmine Field, as their controllers tend to focus on a smaller number of very large creatures.

This could change if you are not using your tokens to attack (at one point you said tokens was one of your victory plans - frankly, I've lost track of what your primary win condition is at this point, as it changes). It also might change based upon your meta.

As is often the case, probably worth playtesting it against some deck archetypes you commonly see in your playgroup.

July 9, 2018 1:58 p.m.

BMHKain says... #14

Don't worry. I'll mention a list of combos by the time I reach 100. I actually have several paths to a wincon already; most, unfortunately, due to the Walkers themselves. Me wonders if there will be any kind of card Superfriends friendly that can tutor like bonkers... The Foulblooded may be too much... I'll see what I can find besides Genesis Wave...

July 9, 2018 2:30 p.m.

BMHKain says... #15

Well... The question now is... What can stop spot removal that can also exile...? I'll have to find out tomorrow... Later... At least Rune-Scarred Demon can be a repeatable tutor with Venser...

July 9, 2018 2:40 p.m.

BMHKain says... #16

Still there? Just added Rune-Scarred Demon. Really want to know what exactly to cut (Yep, I said the forbidden tongue.); Lethal Vapors is good with Narset Transcendent's Emblem alongside Eldrazi Monument. So, one combo confirmed. What 13+ other cuts do you suggest? I don't normally playtest until I reach 100... :/

July 10, 2018 2:36 p.m.

BMHKain says... #17

Okay... 6 cuts left. I wonder what to remove... I want to Keep Lightmine Field in case I throw in Rowan Kenrith, already have Avacyn for Indestructibility & Eldrazi Monument for the same thing. Maybe I could remove Lethal Vapors... The other 5 are easily the hardest. Any suggestions, cdkime? Also, would Rowan's +2 + Lightmine Field's ability trigger as the enemy creatures attack? Just want to know to be sure; I have two Indestructibility sources now, you know.

July 12, 2018 12:14 p.m.

BMHKain says... #18

Okay... 3 cuts left, cdkime... 4 if I somehow find other ways to protect my walkers, & Lightmine Field stays for the sake of Rowan Kenrith; otherwise known as "Rowan the Vengeful". 3-4 cuts left, I need to keep Jace, Architect of Thought, Ajani Steadfast, all the stuff you suggested; actually, make it 5 cuts, Djeru, With Eyes Open is coming back. Sorry for trying to get your attention; I'm trying to find ways to backup Lightmine Field + Rowan Kenrith as a combo...

That, & one question in my previous comment is still on the table...

July 12, 2018 1:18 p.m.

Please login to comment