Viper's Esper Control

Standard* viperfang4

SCORE: 58 | 38 COMMENTS | 10143 VIEWS | IN 20 FOLDERS


Marvel is Banned —June 14, 2017

While the ban takes affect on the 19th, I have gone on to make changes to this list, but do know that people will get there Last Laugh with Marvel this weekend. I have removed my transgress and rejections in the sideboard and pushed the Approach of the Second Sun and Dec in Stones their from mainboard, and bringing in 1 more Cataclysmic Gearhulk and 2 Overwhelming Denial for control. In the main I readded 2 Fatal Push to help against vehicles, since I got rid of Rejection in the side, and brought a Sphinx to the Mainboard.

I am still contemplating Pull from Tomorrow, I don't think it is better than glimmer here because I need the energy to power the Aether Hubs, and Anticipate let's me search for an answer and play it easily int he same turn and helps early.

I am expecting control to become the best deck in the format since the creature decks are fairly easily answered. Watch out for Vehicles as it will be back. Constrictor in the forms of +1/+1 counters, energy, and delirium will be back. Temur energy is good. Turbofog is a thing now that ulamog is not happening (check out my version, it's really good). Temur Tower might be back, grixis control will pick up once Hour is here, azorius control will pick up some now, Jeskai and Esper too. Orzhov Control Might be back if this meta proves creature heavy, which it should. Zombies is still a thing that will only get better with hour. Izzet Emerge will likely go from tier 2 to top tier since that deck is really good with combo out. New perspectives, aetherflux reservoir, infinite Whirler Virtuoso, and brood moniter are bad combos. We will actually be seeing a midrange again soon. Izzet prowess is a bit relevant. Metalwork Colossus is decent, usually with 3-4 colossus out the turn the first hits. Humans are still good in any combination of Naya. Rakdos Eldrazi or Heckbent might take off a little. Simic Crush is good. Gruul Gods and Pummeler. Orzhov Arisocrat Tokens. I probably missed a deck, but this covers a lot of relevant to tier 2.5 stuff that will be seen now that the menace of Marvel is gone.

saintyyy says... #1

So updates on performance after gameday?

May 23, 2017 3:17 a.m.

viperfang4 says... #2

I am thinking that if Ulamog was not in the format Cast Out would be great, but that card is dead in that matchup, and it is 4 mana in control matchups when it could be removed. I am thinking of getting rid of it for other answers, 3 Anguished Mainboard might be pretty good. I am to the point against marvel of mainboarding some specific hate for it, that shell is just so hard to deal with and my LGS is getting overrun with marvel variants (around 25% of the decks and growing).

Marvel Rant: The shell is just annoying cause it can go wide mainly with Whirler Virtuoso and go big with Ulamog. So, if you deal with the go wide, you didn't deal with aetherworks or ulamog. If you deal with aetherworks, you get beat down by the rest of the shell. Something that Eastside Rock said over on his grixis control deck is that against aggro/midrange you side in more removal and against control/combo you side in more counters. When a deck does something on both sides of that structure emerges, control can barely deal with it. It is why the 4 color cat did better than the jeskai cat. Control and Combo are on the same side of the spectrum, while the 4 color was on the opposite. Cat combo had more points of reaction and I minded it less than this as you had to get 2 things out for it to work so you could still use on board removal. Marvel you have to stop on the stack or before, once it hits the field, there is no interaction, they tap and ulamog. I Dispossessed marvel 4 games and still only won 1, got steamrolled by virtuoso once, and got hard cast ulamog twice on because this deck is meant to stabilize and win over a long game. The ulamog is fairly uninteractable as he has a cast trigger that is hard to deal with, is a large indestructible creature, and has another ability that allows him to win without dealing damage. If he had 2 of those 3 things it would be bad but no unbearable, but the 3 are bad. It's kinda funny that cat was holding back such a worse deck for the format. The deck also puts 4 dispel and sphinx of the final word in the side to spite control. This is the stock version; flamecaller, sultai, and control are so much worse. The flamecaller version just has more threats coming off top, chandra is not awful to deal with though unless virtuoso is going nuts too. The deck just spins marvel or makes thopters if you target anything though. The sultai deck has even scarier cards like ishkanah and pulls ulamog and other stuff back from the grave adding a recursive element making it that much harder to stop. The control version still packs large threats like flamecaller, but waits for mana and does marvel when they can hold up 2 counterspells while applying pressure with refiner and virtuoso. I am having to side more than ever for just one archtype where I only had 2 consuls for cat cause my other stuff was sufficient. Overall, it is just a really tough match. I am hearing from other people Dispossess and Lost Legacy are not cutting it, it's just disappointing how untouchable the deck is right now. People playing it said they thought the deck felt bad and it was like rolling a die, but is easy to pilot and uninteractive. I am just trying to find stuff for this, probably going to take Cast Out out of the deck and put To the Slaughter in the side to hit flamecaller and ulamog at once at the hard cast point. Might try Lost Legacy and Transgress the Mind as well. Just having to side in a lot.

Zomnbies: Zombies was pretty easy to deal with, I kept Lord of the Accursed from hitting the table and pumping so all the creatures were within Flaying Tendrils Range so they couldn't recur and also kept Liliana's Master off as well. This deck is good because it is fast, grows, and is recursive; if you prevent it from growing and recurring, gg.

Vehicles: Flaying Tendrils once again kept all the low drops off the baord and made it where scrapheap couldn't come back. Marvel being in the format hindered this deck more as I had Dispossess and Ceremonious Rejection in the side. The Planeswalker sideboard was also pretty easy to deal with. The deck is good because it's threats are evasive and fast and it has a morph sidebaord. Esper is well equipped for evasive threats like Gideon, Heart of Kiran, Scrounger, and Walkers.

Other combos: Aethflux and New Perspectives are the 2 other main combos and hinge around 1 card so heavily that if you keep that card off you're fine. These decks are good because they don't card about your board state much. Marvel is a cmobo deck that doesn't hinge around it's combo going off, that's why it's an issue.

B/G/X: Non evasive and non recurring threats, easiest matchup.

Control: Izzet breaks to Sphinx and I have exile and sac effects that remove things you can't otherwise which makes control in general pretty easy, could use a touch more for in the side.

Other decks: Metalwork colossus is a surprising weak point as colossus is big, recurring, and sanctum of ugin being a cast trigger means that 3 usually come out at once around turn 4-5. I have to keep Hedron Archive especially from hitting in this matchup as it is 6 towards a colossus. Improvise decks are pretty easy, Cataclysmic Gearhulk just wins here. Izzet Emerge is interesting with cast triggers, explosive turns, instant speed threats, and recursiveness, a tough but doable matchup though. Humans is nonrecursive, which makes board wipes and life gain back breaking and an easy match.

Overall: The deck is still very good, I will update it soon. I have basically every matchup except marvel figured out, but that fault in the deck is exceedingly glaring. If anyone has suggestions let me know. My meta just has a very large variaty of decks and is still pretty healthy. Marvel is slowly consuming it though. I am also on cockatrice with the same username if anyone is interesting in deck testing.

May 23, 2017 1:18 p.m.

saintyyy says... #3

Dear viper im a huge fan of ur deck testing it alot and its doin grt. Ur right bout marvel tho it aint an easy matchup. Shaheen soorani also made a black blue control im following. He spoke of how he counters marvel and he is doin grt it seems.check him out it may help. In all cases i looooove ur deck dude testing it hard too

May 24, 2017 7:03 a.m.

lords2001 says... #4

Declaration in Stone may not seem the best answer to Marvel, but I often find it is. You can remove their tokens en masse without requiring a sweeper, and it hits Gearhulk/Ulamog. Alongside some copies of Anguished Unmaking to hit plainswalkers and Marvel, it works quite well.

Another option can be Jace, Unraveler of Secrets as its - option can return Ulamog to hand, which is the worst place for it until they can hard cast it.

Final option is Summary Dismissal as it can hit abilities on the stack from a Marvel cast too. Its expensive and painful, but it does the job.

May 24, 2017 10:28 a.m.

viperfang4 says... #5

@saintyyy glad u like the deck. You can link his deck if you want for me to look at. I am about to make a few edits to make the deck more effective.

@lords2001 I am going to add in Declaration in Stone over Grasp of Darkness or possibly even Fatal Push. The only thing that should cause issues with is Heart of Kiran but I have so much artifact hate because of Marvel I should be okay. That will also make zombies, emerge, and Metalwork Colossus (since usually 3 hit and all 3 are exiled and can't come back) a bit less potent.

Kalitas is being for the most part useless on cockatrice testing nor do I own any atm or want to pay for it when it will rotate soon. It just dies to Grasp of Darkness the moment it comes out against zombies. I will add 1 more Cataclysmic Gearhulk in the side, it is proving very effective against a variety of decks. It wipes the board and is a big body with vigilance that swings every turn and can still block. I will also add a Summary Dismissal in the side. I don't know if I am going to still go with Dispossess or switch to Lost Legacy or Transgress the Mind. I am also thinking of adding 1 Linvala, the Preserver back in the mainboard. I am going to put my Anticipate back in though, was trying to test the deck without them and more lands because of the cycle lands, I like having both for even mroe consistency. Just thinking of options. This deck went about 80-15 during testing on cockatrice for all of AER standard, the thing about control is figuring out the right answers. The meta changed, the answers have to change, as soon as I get it dialed in though the deck should be fairly unstoppable. I also need to write a primer about the deck, so hopefully that comes soon, have to play around with the code and formatting for it.

Also, don't forget to upvote the deck if you like it!

May 24, 2017 6:36 p.m. Edited.

saintyyy says... #6

Viper here is the full article. http://www.starcitygames.com/article/35134_UB-Control-For-Standard.html

May 25, 2017 4:21 a.m.

Geo67 says... #7

saintyyy, Great article, thanks for the link.

May 31, 2017 2:22 p.m.

viperfang4 says... #8

@saintyyy I read the article before but will comment on it now.

Planeswalkers: Liliana, the Last Hope is not that great in standard as she doesn't really do anything and takes a long time to ult, I am not trying to pitch cards either, overall kinda bad. My walkers all have a plus that draws, a minus that is removal, and an ult that just wins the game. Sorin's plus also gets you closer to winning the game and can factor into damage with Torrential Gearhulk.

Creatures: Yes, I know torrential gearhulk and Sphinx of the final word are good, that's why I am playing them. 1 Baral in the side is a trick I have considered. I don't have any intention on purchasing Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet, it is really good, but I am exiling already anyways. Kefnet the Mindful as a 1 of is interesting. I like my Gearhulks in the side, they double as removal and are very good.

Counters: Disallow and Negate are both hard counters and are good. Censor I am not particularly interested in running, it is low to the ground and counters everything and is proven to be useful, but I would much rather know the spell will be countered with something else. It does cause people to play around it though if they know you have it. Essence Scatter I have thought about, but I have enough removal that I don't care for it. We both have Ceremonious Rejection side for marvel. I would run Overwhelming Denial if marvel gets banned over Rejection. Dispel is also good in the control mirror and against decks you think sided in dispel for you themselves.

Spot Removal: Fatal Push I once had in this deck and am heavily thinking of adding it back, I just am finding more use out of Dec in Stone right now. Same with Grasp of Darkness, but that will probably never come back. Never, Anguished Unmaking is just better. Blessed Alliance is also super strong in removal as it doesn't target removing some pesky threats, the most annoying thing in this deck from opponent's opinions has been me saying "sac a creature and gain 4 life" off it. It also contributes to an effective life total of 25-30. Complete Disregard is not particularly good when you have the spells I just listed at your disposal. Commit is not permanent removal and I have anguished unmaking. Memory is somewhat useful though. I also have a Noxious Gearhulk in the side and the minus on each walker.

Mass Removal: He has Yahenni's Expertise, I personally like Flaying Tendrils better because it costs one less and exiles. It just comes down faster against zombies and vehicles mainly and exiles their zombies or scrounger. I also don't have any cards I would target off the free spell portion consistently. I also have fumigate which hits everything and a Cataclysmic Gearhulk in the side for mroe mass removal, I would add 1 more if I didn't have to side so much for marvel as it wipes non creatures too.

Card Draw: He has Hieroglyphic Illumination which I find bad unless you're running a cycling deck, glimmer is just better. Glimmer alone also runs my Aether Hubs. We both are running Anticipate, it is good. Pull from Tomorrow is a card I am considering as a 1-2 of, it is good, but is really only good late game. All of my walkers are also card draw, and I have quite a few cycle lands.

Other Spells: we both have 3 Transgress the Mind for marvel and other decks.

Lands: I like mine with cycle lands, he doesn't have to fuel Aether Hub, so that leads to a few other choices. He has no manlands. He does have an interesting Westvale Abbey  Flip likely to put up an instant speed blocker and somewhat of a wincon. Appoach of the Second Sun is also nice.

Last thoughts: I still think esper has the best answers in standard. He hyped Pull up a lot, but Glimmer is still very good and fuels Hub. Torrential Gearhulk is the 4-of juggernaut that he says otherwise. He also has way too few wincons when I think I don't have that many and have more.

June 1, 2017 7:05 p.m.