This is how you make everyone stop playing magic and just scoop every time.So this deck has most of the suggestions added to it.deck: I will switching to that deck for a while just to try and get all suggestions without budgeting as much.




Rzepkanut says... #1

Hello! Nice deck far :) I have a few ideas after looking at it though. I have never personally played with (or against one of these decks much) but I feel like you aren't harnessing the power that your commander is truly capable of yet. If you are really trying to control the whole table against multiple players single use discard spells like Duress are less powerful because you have to spend a card just to get rid of one card from one player so compared to the rest of the table you actually are also down a card. If you want to focus on discard things like Oppression or Necrogen Mists that keep happening over and over are more what you're looking for. Personally I think you should focus on one angle of attack either discard or denial of mana. One of the things that your commander can tutor up each attack is board removal like Detention Sphere and Grasp of Fate. Contamination + Bitterblossom is a little bit harder to set up but can create a hard lock on some opponents. Lunar Force + Sun Titan is a personal favorite combo. Reconnaissance is a great card for commanders that want to attack but not actually be part of combat. Hope some of these ideas are helpful good luck and happy Gathering.

May 3, 2017 5:25 p.m.

Rzepkanut says... #2

Suppression Field can singlehandedly shut down some decks too. And just for completion sake Oblivion Ring & Banishing Light are other quality removal spells to tutor for. Cheers.

May 3, 2017 8:11 p.m.

xander11 says... #3

Thank you very much for the help

May 3, 2017 8:22 p.m.

chaosumbreon87 says... #4

it seems to me that you'd like a whir of invention effect. A lot more tutors would probably help consistency. Also, phyrexian tyrrany is illegal in this deck. knowledge pool seems funny with rule of law, arcane lab, or teferi

May 4, 2017 9:33 a.m.

JaysomeDecks says... #5

I've had trouble building a Zur deck before, so it's definitely not my forte, but I'll help where I can. First, Rest in Peace is a version of Leyline of the Void that is tutorable by your commander. Also, when it enters, it exiles all of their current graveyards, while Leyline does not. Since you said you run largely against dredge, I would definitely recommend this card. The only downside is that it hits you as well.

I would suggest more bounce removal. Cyclonic Rift and AEtherspouts are fantastic when dealing with aggro boardstates. (AEtherspouts especially, as it usually means they are taking multiple turns to draw and recast all of their creatures)

There are some other enchantments that could be more efficient as well. Invisibility would best be swapped out with Steel of the Godhead. It's still tutorable, and gives +2/+2 and lifelink in addition to the unblockability.

If you're playing multiplayer, Grasp of Fate can help you remove some key threats. Overall I'd say you could use a little more removal. It seems like you let threats sit on the field too much and hope you can keep them from hitting you. (Though if that's the case, you could take advantage of it with cards like Clone Legion)

Copy Enchantment is another good card. Basically a 3rd Ghostly Prison.

What are your goals and wincons atm?

May 5, 2017 8:01 a.m.

JaysomeDecks says... #6

Also, is this a 1v1 or multiplayer deck? You have some underwhelming discard cards that seem geared more towards a 1v1 setting. Syphon Mind is a good draw spell that makes all your opponents discard.

But overall, unless you're playing 1v1, you may be dedicating too many resources to hitting hands.

May 5, 2017 8:05 a.m.

xander11 says... #7

It is geared more to multiplayer so the discard cards should be swapped out it was just a place holder to be honest

May 5, 2017 8:12 a.m.

JaysomeDecks says... #8

I would honestly suggest more enchantments. Karmic Justice, Rhystic Study, Greater Auramancy, and Thassa, God of the Sea are some gernerally good ones. Trespasser's Curse is fantastic if you have anyone in your meta who runs tokens, infinite etb combos, or even just a ton of creatures. As Fortold bypasses commander tax. Commander has died 10 times? Still can cast him from the command zone for free is you have 4 counters on it. Imprisoned in the Moon and Darksteel Mutation are fantastic removal for opponents' commanders. They don't exile or kill, so your opponents can't just recast their commanders, and they also remove all of their abilities. Fantastic for shutting down an Avacyn, Angel of Hope.

May 5, 2017 3:50 p.m.

JaysomeDecks says... #9

Anyhow, I hope some of that was helpful. Again, Zur is not a commander I ever considered I'd be able to make work well, but hopefully there's something there.

May 5, 2017 3:53 p.m.

xander11 says... #10

JaysomeDecks Do you think this deck runs enough mana, I am worried that I could easily get mana screwed with only 35 lands.

May 6, 2017 11:32 p.m.

35 lands is enough as 37 is the go to number for most casual EDH players. For reference, due to a high density of tutors and mana rocks, 30 is the about the average for 100% optimized compeditive decks. You also dont run many black cards so I would think about that

May 7, 2017 1:55 a.m.

Firebones675 says... #12

Sometimes the game gets out of hand and you just need a reset button to take care of the scary things your opponents are doing. I usually like around 3 in my decks. (Winds of Rath is especially nice here)

Here are some specific cards:

Ethereal Armor can pump zur and let you go in for the kill.

Animate Dead/Necromancy: Being able to tutor for this catches people off guard

Phyrexian Arena is decent draw

Hanna, Ship's Navigator/ Replenish can bring things back

Greater Auramancy/Solitary Confinement: protection

Crackdown: Stops many creature decks

Grasp of Fate: Removal

Eidolon of Rhetoric back up rule of law that can also block

May 7, 2017 12:53 p.m.

xander11 says... #13

I think adding those cards would be great but what do I pull for them?

May 7, 2017 1:41 p.m.

Winterblast says... #14

I wouldn't play Pox in a multicoloured deck, especially if your manabase is so inconsistent. With BBB it will often be a dead card and if there's only Zur on the board you don't want to play it either...I'd rather use Cataclysm or Armageddon and Ravages of War. Not Damnation and Wrath of God because you probably don't need and want to clear the entire board.

Stax is really good if it prevents the opponents from playing anything useful in the first place instead of reacting to threats, it's the archetype for proactive control. I personally wouldn't play counters, if you don't play Mana Drain because it doesn't fit the overall strategy. You don't want to keep mana open to react, you want to drop something that locks the opponent down. Maybe some more taxing permanents? Sphere of Resistance, Lodestone Golem, Thorn of Amethyst, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Trinisphere...Tangle Wire is also great and you have some cards that prevent untapping too.

If you already play Rest in Peace I would include one of my all time favourite combos and use Helm of Obedience. For more consistency add the Leyline of the Void again as well. This trick has won so many games for me, it's ridiculous. A bit more tutors would be cool though, for example Transmute Artifact if you want to buy that (you find some on ebay for 40-50 USD).

May 8, 2017 3:11 a.m.

xander11 says... #15

So I will pull out counter spell and Pox but what should I take out for Sphere, Lodestone, Thorn, Thalia and Layline?

May 8, 2017 8:21 a.m.

Winterblast says... #16

I don't think Llawan, Cephalid Empress or Fog Bank are worth playing, you could also remove Wall of have 40 life, so aggro isn't as much of a problem as it is when playing stax in other formats. Most aggro decks also have some combo included in case they run against too many protective permanents they can't remove. I don't think a card that is "just a good blocker" has any value in realistic matchups.

I would replace Crawlspace with Ensnaring Bridge because it's more effective (and your commander can always attack after you draw your card for the turn). maybe think about removing the artifacts that have activated abilities completely if you want to play Stony Silence and add Null Rod for an additional card with the same effect. Overburden seems a bit odd because it helps the opponents against Winter Orb and Static Orb - it's a great card, but only if your mana denial plan is based on bouncing/destroying lands instead of having them stay tapped. If you go for land bouncing I can recommend Mana Breach (super effective! you could get rid of Arcane Laboratory because mana breach also punishes players for playing too many spells per turn), Land Equilibrium, Ward of Bones, Words of Wind and Sunder.

In general I think it's best to focus on one or two types of lockdown and build around these. If you do a bit of this and a bit of that everything is there but weak. I would say the tapping locks are the easiest to escape because you leave everything intact and only disable certain permanent types...if the tapping card is gone, everything works again. The most effective locks are those that constantly make you lose cards permanently, for example Mana Vortex, Smokestack, Possessed Portal. You have to choose what suits your playing style best and then focus on that plan with your whole deck.

May 8, 2017 9:02 a.m.

xander11 says... #17

So I need to keep in mind that cards in hand don't matter to me and I just want to shut down lands to stop spells

May 8, 2017 9:24 a.m.

Winterblast says... #18

if that's the way you want to go, yes. disrupting the mana base is always a good strategy, together with making spells and other actions cost more it's very hard to escape such a situation.

May 8, 2017 9:38 a.m.

xander11 says... #19

Okay thank you I now know how I want to proceed with the deck

May 8, 2017 9:44 a.m.

Firebones675 says... #20

On the one hand I get what you're saying Winterblast, but I disagree with what you are sayingabout Fog Bank and Wall of Denial. Yes aggro is weaker in multiplayer but your opponents still have creatures. Zur is one of the scarier commanders and as a result might attract some hate. Also keep in mind sometimes the fastest way to stop the stax abilities is to simply kill the player controlling them and remove them from the game. As a result you cannot ignore defensive creatures and those two walls are some good ones. Other than that I agree with his suggestions.

As for cards in your opponents hand, unless you're planning on doing discard that hits everyone or cards that reward you for your opponents discarding like Waste Not, in multiplayer don't bother with 1 for 1 hand disruption like Thoughtseize

Clock of Omens doesnt do enough in this deck. The focus should be on enchantments and you don't have enough artifacts with abilities for this to be relavent.

May 8, 2017 1:56 p.m.

Winterblast says... #21

Firebones675 I'm probably a too passionate stax player to agree on that matter. When I play stax it means to actively prevent other players from doing ANYTHING harmful, starting in turn also means playing cards that disable many functions of other decks, not even by interaction with other cards but on their own. Zur wouldn't be my favourite choice but he can definitely be made to work, with enough speed.

If you have a look at my Augustin's $t4ks (2017 version) for example, situations are possible in which everything costs more starting in turn one and getting worse with each turn. the best aggro stoppers are The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Moat, Humility or Ensnaring Bridge and there's absolutely no need for a primitive "blocker" anymore. Also Ghostly Prison and/or Propaganda combined with constant removal of lands or after a one time mass removal on lands is very hard to top. Of course, these anti-aggro permanents can be removed, but that's why you play all the taxing stuff and other protective cards. Aggro is only a weakness if you start with 20 life, but in commander it's more important to keep combo and control in check.

May 9, 2017 4:57 a.m.

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Compare to inventory
Date added 2 weeks
Last updated 2 weeks
Exclude colors RG

This deck is Commander / EDH legal.

Cards 100
Avg. CMC 2.45
Top rank #78 on 2017-05-13
Views 278