MediSyntax I've decided to avoid the continued flood of Lithium's build by porting it over here. Some notable differences are:

No thornbite staff. I find myself stuck with it too often. Doesn't work in the deck in the way I want it to.

No more rings combo: I realised after looking back at Lithium's list and looking over my own that I never even included it. I personally think that this deck doesn't need an alternative as the win condition is already compact, redundant and fairly strong.

I've added you to the list, so you should be able to adjust any info on this as you please.

Hey, thanks for cutting me into this. It's good that we won't keep bombarding Lithium, although I do hope our discussion on the original helps other people who find his list.

A couple points: how have you found Erebos, God of the Dead ? Does the lifegain matter often enough? Greed is cheaper to activate and Arguel's Blood Fast  ^Flip is cheaper to cast and can transform into a source of sacrifice/lifegain (albeit unlikely).

Also, what are your thoughts on Reassembling Skeleton ?
It is a dupe for Nether Traitor in Bridge from Below loops with either Pitiless Plunderer/Pawn of Ulamog/Mikaeus, the Unhallowed. It's a great discard target for Lili and just might be worth a go for the redundancy

Reassembling Skeleton is a spicy one - a card I used to run in stax&pox, but cut for this build. It's mana positive which is neat. Yeah, I could see it working. I'll find some room later today.

My inclusion of Erebos is a hate card against storm & reservoir decks in my meta. While Tainted Remedy is a stronger stax piece, it has no evasion/way to generate ca (plus there was an erebos in my binder to jam into the deck.

It was cutting Void Winnower as by the time he hit the field my opponents had played their 0 drops & were playing all of their cantrips- the saltstorm of me sitting there with winnower and they'd be ignoring it made it feel cuttable.

If you feel like readding it - be my guest. I'll do some research into other possible hatebears & maybe write up a section on it.

Honestly, I am 100% on board with a Void Winnower cut. Even the games I have had the ideal discard into early reanimation of it, I am never as impressed with it as I am supposed to be. I have just taken it on faith from Lithium's enthusiasm but I am glad to see it gone.

I can also understand Erebos as a meta call. I don't see very much in the way of Aetherflux Reservoir but I will keep Erebos in mind if it ever does crop up.

There are a few main options available; If your meta is increasingly dork-dependent - Ascendant Evincar is quite useful as a pseudo- Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite . Not ideal, but very much an option. I'll create an additional section for the description to show potential options for this flex-slot. I also feel that Minister of Pain encompasses a flex-slot, as in a dorkless environment the low-sweep is underwhelming (especially when it doesn't remove tymna)

Yeah, I cut Minister of Pain a while ago because it just did nothing too often in my meta; swapped it for Plaguecrafter who always does something for the same CMC.

What do you think of the new Horizons spoiler card, Cabal Therapist ?

Seems like it may be worth a test. Another self-sacrificing one-drop to flip Lili and a decent -1 target for her to renaimate nd pick at the opponents' hands

Hm. As a 1drop that's pretty decent. With fodder every turn like sacrificing GC time & time again it could be good (especially vs apostle-cannon). Without lili it gives us a safer way to discard bridge.

But it can't be used to flip lili the turn she comes down. This card feels like a fair piece for grinding in equal matchups. Worth some testing but my initial reaction is that we're not trying to establish a lock often. That's more like a backup plan.

So, how do you push your game plan when there is a turn 0/1 Grafdiggers Cage?

My point in the above question is, the competitive meta has leaned greatly into grave hate to respond to the advent of Flash Hulk. Effects like Cage, Rest In Peace, and the like are very common these days.

With how prevalent these effects are, and considering Mono-B lacks a way to effectively interact with the aforementioned cards, I highly recommend a backup plan like Bolos Citadel/Top/Aetherflux. It’s worth noting that Aetherflux even wins with your Altar/Crawler combo on storm alone and is even a lot more efficient than the previously mentioned methods.

I really like the idea of the deck, but saying “Fuck Leyline” or any other static grave hate isn’t good enough for cEDH.

I believe that not having a game plan to press in the likely event that you see these very common cards is holding you back from your goal of having this deck be “Tier 2” or fringe viable.

I look forward to hearing your thoughts!

I have had Gate to Phyrexia in and out of the deck numerous times. In a meta where Grafdigger’s Cage was a problem, I would keep it formly in the deck.

As well, the new WAR card Blast Zone is a powerful piece for this deck having a shot to answer anything.

CyborgAeon, do you have any updates from WAR?

I haven’t had much time for Magic lately and I could use a starting point.

I pitched the deck to a series of cedh players, who helped me to realise that this is a cool deck, but won't be pushing the upper bound of cedh any time soon. Similar to the "aggro decks struggle" argument, it's concluded that the lines necessary to facilitate a win require a lot to pull off. Primarily the lack of an a+b strategy. Ie: mikaeus + walking ballista also needs a sac outlet or a blood artist effect.

I'll be adding a brief to the description to say that this is currently not considered strong enough to be cedh viable (maybe in like a t2 pod, but it'll just fall to any hulk deck / pst etc.)

MediSyntax The manabase is a struggle to sac lands to lake of the dead at the moment. But a land that can answer leyline, rip AND grafdigger's cage? That's a solid yes.

After some deliberation Bitter Ordeal is in. It's a 3 card combo with our main engine and is interchangable with a lot of pieces. As praetor's grasp was best for hate before, it'll be replacing that F A S T.

It's likely that due to the gravehate that the format needs that we will be changing some of our value reanimation for reanimation that solves problem cards ie null rod / stony silence.

A lot of people are trying citadel, it seems neat, but I'd be reluctant to try it due to the heavy initial cost. Bontu is a consideration, for the mass draw potential, but as a legend it's holding him back. Liliana's triumph will be going in (too much value to pass up).

I've been glaring into the sun a lot - to the point that command the dreadhorde might be viable. Mostly due to the fact that we could return all of the pieces needed for a win on one card without the danger of sharing fun with your opponents (like living death).

Regarding the cEDH viability of this deck: that is undeniable. This is a 95% deck at best. It really is so elegant though, in that all of our combo pieces are our value pieces are our disruption.

To your point of Command the Dreadhorde, I would be worried about the heavy toll of life loss. The Razaketh engine demands we have a critical mass of activations and I’m worried about eating into that so quickly and backing myself into a corner life-wise.

I’d be interested in hearing your testing results on Bontu because I’m not in love just yet. Liliana’s Triumph is a very solid inclusion though as it will often be a 3-6 for 1

As of late in other decks I've been testing out the use of forbidden tutors: Plunge into Darkness , Demonic Consultation , Tainted Pact (I also tested Spoils of the Vault as a meme - though it went surprisingly well). These tutors are all instant speed, with a massive payoff. The downside is that in a build like this - we couldn't use pact (the safest option), but we could test plunge. It's a safe scry 10 - draw 1 for 2 mana in my experience, and all too often there's exactly what you need, right on time.

In order to conserve as much life as possible, I'm thinking of shifting to snow-covered swamps & Scrying Sheets /another land that draws cards over the fetches - while it's nice to feel like we're deck-thinning this loss of several life per game is sometimes too much.

As a mono deck, with a fair few moving parts - the use of spoils / consultation is very narrow, as we'd be risking a lot, and we'd need 2/3 of our combo pieces in place before using these. Due to this, they'll not make the cut.

The updates to the deck for WAR have been added! It's only 5 card difference, but it's quite a substantial change. Based on the number of pieces required, I feel that this deck could shift towards a heavier stax-variant; the first card to shift out towards this was rain of filth. For a deck that plays a lot from the graveyard, it's not the end if our win gets countered. But if we sacrifice our lands to do so - it's game over. To counteract this, I've put in crucible - thanks to the number of cards that fuel our yard and Liliana's uptick, it'll really help to streamline gameplay with our plan in motion.

If you've got thoughts on the other adjustments made, I'd be glad to hear them! Side note: Chains + waste not is fantastic!

EasyPeezy thank you for taking the time to review the list - you make a compelling argument about the cedh meta. The current build has a very direct way to win, with a few lines. I'd be glad to test Aetherflux Reservoir , but as an artifact it is not recurrable, it provides life (a resource that is running out FAR too fast), but otherwise it feels suboptimal. In order to accomodate the current threats in the format, I'm looking into what can be used to potentially combat different meta-decks.

Chains is awesome but I definitely cannot afford it. I’m sure it’s very powerful here especially!

I could see Plunge into Darkness being useful since we have so much redundancy for our combo pieces that Scry X can probably get us there. And it can “emergency mode” to gain us our life back. I’m cautiously optimistic.

I’d recommend dropping Dusk Legion Zealot for a Burglar Rat . It’s a +3 vs a +1 and I’ve been happy for the change myself.

Hm! I see your strategy. See that's what I was thinking. Already a very good option that changes this from a fast-paced combo deck to a stronger, much mre grindy stax deck.

I'll be on the lookout for some spicy options to include, as I feel this deck would work better if we refined the combo package to the most efficient cards for it and played a greater number of staxables (especially reanimatable!)

How have you found Priest of Forgotten Gods ? I know you tested out the Thornbite package but with that removed, is it still pulling weight?

Also, I have been toying with the very casual-feeling Gray Merchant of Asphodel . It can lead to big bursts of lifegain to keep us going and I’m imagining a wonderful world where you sac him to Razaketh to tutor an Animate Dead and then sac him again to get a Reanimate and then sac him again to get...

Maybe that’s just my own version of Command the Dreadhorde haha

Lol. I think that gary looping is a cool idea, but we've no way to perform it enough (even with raza) to win. Ie: raza & gary & any reanimation enchantment sets our devotion to 6; repeating this 3 times gains us 54, but our opponents only lose 18. If there's ever printed a black version of Neheb, the Eternal it'd be sweet. But without a payoff the investment is too costly.

Priest has been crucial in the games I play him (often discarded early, reanimated for value). Giving the draw, pressure and mana that I need often. I'm considering adding in Bloodsoaked Champion as it's also a warrior for Mindblade Render - of which will likely be sneaking back into the deck, as the 2 mana recurrable phyrexian arena (that also draws in opponent's turns) is too good to pass up.

(Also a side note: check it out, the deck is 100% competitive xD - that bar is such a meme).

I am very excited to test Yawgmoth, Thran Physician . Draw, sacrifice, discard, proliferate, kills dorks. It's a slam dunk in this deck.

Yawgmoth + Mikaeus, the Unhallowed + Pawn of Ulamog / Bridge from Below = Yawgmoth's Bargain (nice)

Insta-win with Yawgmoth in play: Buried Alive for Mikaeus, Delver, and Blood Artist.

I love him.

Oh snap, MediSyntax I hadn't noticed that line to win! That's fantastic! Though it costs a lot of mana to setup with mikaeus, it might be worth considering! I'll have to slot him in for testing, especially with that pro humans - Najeela needs to be knocked down a peg (killing dorks and drawing cards might let this replace some less hot removal).

Thanks dude.

So I've been trying to consolidate the main combo lines for the sake of mental organization. Arguably, the core combo is Gravecrawler + Phyrexian Altar + Bridge from Below .

The redundancies for each piece are:

Gravecrawler (recurrable dude)
- Nether Traitor + Pawn of Ulamog / Sifter of Skulls
- Reassembling Skeleton + Pawn of Ulamog / Sifter of Skulls
- Reassembling Skeleton + Pitiless Plunderer
- Liliana, Untouched By Death + 1 Drop Zombie

Phyrexian Altar (enabler)
- Pitiless Plunderer + Sac Outlet

Bridge from Below (payoff for spinning your wheels)
- Pawn of Ulamog / Sifter of Skulls (Sifter moreso because 0/1s can't kill)
- Diregraf Colossus
- Blood Artist
- Aetherflux Reservoir

MediSyntax firstly I'd like to say way to go on finding Sifter of Skulls . That card is a treasure; secondly I'd like to preface the next update (soon to have some awesome css styles added and custom js elements).

Some changes I'm looking to make are stripping out Walking Ballista in favour of Sifter of Skulls . Furthermore I feel like enough people have mentioned that Yawgmoth, Thran Physician is putting in work, so he'll be going in over the flex slot temporarily (as he draws cards, pumps lily, blocks tymna and hates on the best creature type - humans). If he were a zombie it would be a slam dunk include for now he is in for testing.

Paradox Engine is a really busted card... I think that a couple of times I've been tempted to slide this in, as in the instance that we have a sacrifice outlet, GC and a few rocks we could just use that to function in place of Phyrexian Arena / Blood Artist .

Undead Augur is as streamlined as we could really ask for. The card draws cards at a VERY reasonable cost, and it's a zombie!

Lastly I've been thinking of porting this list into a Gisa and Geralf list, as with abundant mana we can use the general to fill our grave and cast every combo piece within it (also having countermagic would make this list a lot less risky)

P.S: Yixlid Jailer can't be in our flex slots (despite how good he is against some decks).

Paradox Engine is an interesting idea as it does give redundancy for Phyrexian Altar, the piece with the least amount of backups. I think to take enough advantage of this, I'd include more fast mana ( Mox Diamond plays well with Crucible of Worlds, Chrome Mox 's card disadvantage is mitigated a bit because we operate well without many cards).

Yawgmoth, Thran Physician and Undead Augur are my adds from Modern Horizons, with Cabal Therapist on my to-test list. I'm cutting Midnight Reaper and keeping Grim Haruspex for now (the zombie type is nice on the Reaper but no life loss on the Haruspex is probably worth more to me).

I'm sure the change to Gisa and Geralf will have some advantages. Counterspells alone will help you not lose and I know zombies have some combo potential in Dimir with Grimgrin, Corpse-Born , Rooftop Storm , and Diregraf Captain . I can't follow you there though; I have too much fondness for Liliana and love challenging myself to make the best mono-coloured decks.
I'll follow that decklist on TappedOut and put in my two cents though, if you like.