Hey Buddy, Love the Abzan build, played a similiar build when Siege Rhino came out and was all the rage. I would say some good sideboard cards would be Voice of Resurgence and Abrupt Decay, maybe Putrefy? And Fleecemane Lion is a beast. Anywho, good luck out there and May The Mana BE with you!
July 21, 2017 9:25 a.m.
I would probably add a bit more removal into this deck, like adding Fatal Push that combos well with shock lands. I also feel like the lifegain should lead into a win-con, like Felidar Sovereign. You can also add more creatures that gain buffs with lifegain, like Serra Ascendant and Ajani's Pridemate. You can also try Rhox Faithmender for maximum lifegain shenanigans.
July 22, 2017 9:18 a.m.
solar I was considering putting the extra removal such as Fatal Push in the sideboard. I feel on the Felidar Sovereign it it certainly on my radar, I just don't know where to put it. I really like the Archangel of Thune. I considered Serra Ascendant and Ajani's Pridemate they were both on the list at one point but I was having a hard time casting the higher CMC's. As for Rhox Faithmender, he is already on the list and has been since the very beginning. He was a major part of the Selesnya build I used to play.
Thank you both very much for your input and consideration. I hope you don't mind that I responded to you both on one comment for the sake of time!
July 27, 2017 10:28 p.m.
August 1, 2017 9:13 a.m.
Hoschie I thought about the combo and the first version of this deck actually used Chord of Calling, however it was just too hard to cast the high CMC creatures. I had to go in favor of the mana ramp. That just didn't leave room for Chord and with it went the combo. I really appreciate the suggestion. It's something I still consider.
August 1, 2017 9:27 a.m.
Hoschie,solar I thought about what you both said and I decided that more win conditions is exactly what this deck needed. I added Felidar Sovereign, Spike Feeder, and Chord of Calling without changing the main feel of the deck.
August 3, 2017 12:26 p.m.
I think you are going to want some Leyline of Sanctity's in the side and possibly the main as losing life seeing the Chalice plan is pretty detrimental. Also I don't think you are making the most of the Spike Feeder combo as it seems like it was forced in because it is a cool little interaction, I would go up a Spike Feeder and maybe even an Archangel of Thune. Additionally I strongly believe you need Stirring Wildwood if nothing else as a blocker to deal with flying; as well as Utopia Sprawl for some additional ramp.
August 3, 2017 12:37 p.m.
I play a pretty fun Eldritch Evolution Abzan deck that also plays the Spike Feeder/Archangel combo. You sac stuff like VoR and Kitchen Finks to get Siege Rhinos and combo pieces along side Chord of Calling.
If you do end up playing this version you would have to drop a lot of the creatures like Restoration Angel, 2 of the Scavenging Ooze, Nyx Fleece Ram, and Rhox Faithmender, in favor of faster mana, and tutor targets far EE and Chord. Creatures like-
Noble Hierarch or some other 1 drop ramp
In the SB you can tutor for
Lastly I would go up to 23-24 lands for consistency sake. Even in my version with 6-8 mana dorks You still want to make your land drops incase they get killed. Add a Stirring Wildwood, Gavony Township, Treetop Village, Shambling Vent, Hissing Quagmire, Ghost Quarter, or Vault of the Archangel to get some utility out of your lands.
August 3, 2017 1:15 p.m.
Oloro_Magic Leyline of Sanctity seems like a no brainer, but I had not yet thought of it. Thank you very much. The Spike Feeder thing was kinda forced. That's not really how I want to win, however I do want to win so I will just have to do more testing and see what's gonna be best.
Mandalorian Is your deck on the site? I would love to take a look at it.
August 3, 2017 3:46 p.m.
christ4like2l0ve Unfortunately I dont but I can simply post my most updated list here!
Sideboards are obviously meta dependent but here is mine
The deck basically plays like a creature heavy mid range deck with a back door combo. You dont need to combo to win but its nice that its there for the matches you want it.
August 3, 2017 6:12 p.m.
Mandalorian Thanks for sharing. I really like that type of tool box build. A good friend used to play Naya Kiki Chord, and it was so much fun.
August 4, 2017 11:40 a.m.
August 6, 2017 2:06 p.m.
Ok folks, I feel as if we may just about be there.
August 7, 2017 2:14 a.m.
It might be a bit too cute, but something to consider would be Doran, the Siege Tower, which gives a minor boost to Birds of Paradise, Restoration Angel and Siege Rhino, a massive boost to Nyx-Fleece Ram and is effectively a 5/5 for 3 itself.
August 19, 2017 12:22 p.m.
I thought Doran, the Siege Tower was five mana!I think at 3 mana he is certainly a contender. I was considering Assault Formation because this deck just needs to be able to put on a little more pressure. I guess the biggest risk with Doran, the Siege Tower is that he buffs your opponents creatures too, especially enemy Tarmogoyf. But he is effectively a 5/5 himself.
August 19, 2017 12:41 p.m.
This really is too fine a balance to make - with only 18 creatures in the first place you don't have enough creatures to benefit off the Doran/Assault Formation strategy (Birds can now attack, Rhino and Angel both get +1, and the obvious payoff are the Rams, but the Finks get -1) and then you run the risk of playing Rams that don't have much impact on the board (I don't imagine that an Abzan deck is that weak to aggro). You can still devote 3 spots to Doran/Formation if you really want to, but you can try Tarmogoyf instead of Rams. They are usually 3/4s and can become 4/5s or even 5/6s, and they can do something even if Doran/Formation is not out.
September 21, 2017 5:12 a.m.
I certainly understand what you are saying. I haven't had too many opportunities to test since making those additions but it does seem to be hit or miss. I just can't afford to play with Tarmogoyf or I most certainly would. Can you think of anything that could fit that slot better than a Ram, that isn't a Goyf?
Also can you think of anything besides the Doran/Formations that might fit better?
September 21, 2017 3:50 p.m.
I can understand - Goyfs are not cheap. If we got rid of 3 Rams, 1 Doran and 2 Formations (6 cards), I would play 1-2 more Scavenging Ooze, 1 more Lingering Souls, and probably some number of discard spells or utility creatures like Tireless Tracker, Courser of Kruphix, Anafenza the Foremost, etc. Then this deck will firmly be an Abzan midrange deck. It should have fair game against a wide variety of tier decks.
September 22, 2017 7:42 a.m.
If you want to play a lifegain-based deck, I'd suggest Martyr Proc or straight up Soul Sisters or even Norin Sisters. I've been dabbling with the former recently and it's pretty fun.
September 22, 2017 7:44 a.m.
Assuming we did remove those six, I would almost certainly add another Scavenging Ooze and another Lingering Souls. As far as discard spells go, is Thoughtseize my only viable option at this point? I have not played with any of the creatures you mentioned above but I like them all and could see each fitting some way into the deck. What would you say to something like +1Tireless Tracker +1Anafenza, the Foremost and +2 Courser of Kruphix? Am I stretching myself too thin with something like that or am I arming myself with valuable tools?
I greatly appreciate all of your input. This deck has been lots of fun to build and to play.
September 23, 2017 6:57 a.m.
Typical Abzan decks only run around 13-15 creatures currently, I think. They are full of removals (Maelstrom Pulse in the maindeck instead of sideboard), and have a playset of Lilianas (used to be purely Liliana of the Veil but now maybe 1-2 Liliana the Last Hope). So if you want to go 'full' Abzan, the final list will look even more different.
As for the specific changes you brought up in the last post, I think Anafenza is not maindeck material for now. Maybe try 1 Tracker and 1 Courser and see how they fare? Thoughtseize is perfectly fine, but Inquisition of Kozilek and even Duress is good too.
September 23, 2017 10:24 a.m.
christ4like2l0ve great deck! I also built an alternate Abzan strategy and love to see you break the mold. For land I would love to see you get to 23. I would play a few different times with different Utility lands and move forward with one 3X or two 2X. Great options for you are Gavony Township, Vault of the Archangel, Ghost Quarter, and Shambling Vent.
I hope this helps a little. The good and bad of Junk is you can tweak it indefinitely and its never "right". I would love another set of eyes on my attempt at a planeswalkerless Abzan if you have time: Abzan Beatdown. Good luck at the table!
September 23, 2017 4:54 p.m.
Thank you very much, this deck has been a lot of fun to work out and to play. I have played Naya most of my magic career and this is my first time exploring black and The junk color combo. I always thought if I were to switch up a color I would trade the white for black and play Jund but it just kinda happened this way and I am very happy about it.
Shambling Vent is something I have meant to put on the consideration list for some time now, but for what ever reason I keep missing it. I lost to that card in a Nahiri deck at my last PPTQ. Thank you for reminding me about that one. So far I think I like Gavony Township more than Vault of the Archangel but they are both pretty sweet when they do go off.
Is Noble Hierarch really much better than Birds of Paradise? Is it just because of her Exalted trigger? Would that require altering my land base to consider that she doesn't produce Black Mana? My buddy keeps telling me the same thing, but I feel that if I am putting that much bread into the deck it is going towards Tarmogoyf.
I am definitely going to consider adding some more disruption to the mainboard. The lifegain thing almost works, in many cases I find that I gain just enough life to outlive my opponents hand, and I just have enough left going on. I am just not sure it is consistent enough.
I would love to check out your deck and let you know what I think. Thank you greatly for your consideration and your input.
September 24, 2017 2:38 a.m.
Noble Hierarch is crazy expensive but the Exalted trigger is amazingly important in Modern competitive play. I was playing Jacob Wilson's Abzan list before (like my current Abzan Beatdown but with Noble and Birds in place of some disruption). Going from Llanowar Elves to Noble just blew my mind.
Removal magnet. For whatever reason players are super fired up when they see her and she always draws the Bolt/Push/Path.
The nice thing is, if you are not super ego driven, you can play with Birds for a while until you get the deck tweak. Keep track of how often Exalted would have mattered. If you get the deck just the way you want it, and you feel that will put you over the top, then pull the trigger.
September 24, 2017 9:51 a.m.
Is the other list you mentioned viewable somewhere?
September 24, 2017 5:47 p.m.
Sorry. The link won't show up. Just google, "Jacob Wilson Abzan." If you go to the article on MTG Salvation it actually has his list and the Emracool list which is what I am working on for the LGS.
September 24, 2017 7:33 p.m.
I found it about 20 minutes ago. Was actually reading the thread when I got you comment. Thanks a lot man. Has me doing some thinking about my list.
September 24, 2017 7:38 p.m.
September 24, 2017 7:40 p.m.
October 4, 2017 10:57 p.m.
Btw, in the current meta, sigarda is way better than thrun. I used to have both in my deck, sigarda can help against tron and control. Think All Is Dust
October 4, 2017 11:17 p.m.
If the goal is to build a competitive (not necessarily tier -as its not popular at the momnet) abzan list, you could take a look at the so called "next level abzan" archetype.
October 8, 2017 7:07 a.m.
I appreciate the sideboard advice. That's the main thing I still need to work on. I really don't know what would be best for this type of deck.
I considered Sylvan Caryatid, I used to run it when I started building this deck because I had so many expensive spells. I'm thinking about Loxodon Smiter and Wilt-Leaf Liege in which case I may need more Mana. I'm not really in a position to pick up Noble Hierarch right now. The main issue I see there is that to add those guys I may need to get rid of the Assault Formation and Doran, the Siege Tower which makes Sylvan Caryatid less good.
"Next Level Abzan" looks pretty cool. I definitely like the token spamming. I could see that being a very fun deck. Thank you for opening my eyes to it.
October 9, 2017 11:19 a.m.
I have also considered Courser of Kruphix maybe something like that could help make the deck a little more stable.
I also really like Hornet Nest that card is very cool, it's just the type of janky thing I would try.
October 9, 2017 12:16 p.m.
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|Date added||3 months|
|Last updated||1 day|
This deck is Modern legal.
|Folders||Modern, Budget, cool decks, Modern Builds - B/G/W|
|Top rank||#35 on 2017-07-27|