Necronomicon | Teysa Karlov | Primer

Commander / EDH Masterful

SCORE: 367 | 424 COMMENTS | 105499 VIEWS | IN 176 FOLDERS


Ashen0ne says... #1

+1 for you my friend!

Been working on this new Teysa myself since she's my wife's favorite character among the guilds. Since her birthday is right around the release of this set I'm hoping to have it pretty much together so that she can play her the moment she gets her.

This has been a big help. You're thoughts and descriptions are very informative and I can see this deck is going in the right direction. Hadn't even considered the synergies with Requiem Angel and Divine Visitation

Can't think of anything to suggest just yet that isn't already either in the deck or the maybeboard. Are you planning on running the new Smothering Tithe in this one?

January 6, 2019 9:53 p.m.

Masterful says... #2

RecklessN7 I'm glad you found the guide helpful. Smothering Tithe is interesting. It will certainly create at least 2-3 treasures per round, so it effectively taps for 3+ each turn. It also works very well with Anointed Procession. I'll put it in the maybeboard for now until I can figure out what to take out. Cathars' Crusade is on my radar since it's a bit win-more.

January 6, 2019 11 p.m.

kyleskickinit says... #3

I wouldn't put cathars crusade unless you go full on counters theme - which makes Ghave a better commander. I had Cathars Crusade in my deck along with Blade of the Bloodchief, Carrion Feeder and Animation Module. Those pushed out other pieces that I could have put in and made the deck feel less aristocrats.

January 7, 2019 2:21 a.m.

Masterful says... #4

kyleskickinit I don't think Cathars' Crusade needs to be in a counters matter deck to be good, just in a deck that has a lot of creatures entering the battlefield. However I do think that it's a bit clunky due to its mana cost, and its effect being useless at certain times. It's probably going to go once I get around to updating the deck with some of the maybeboard.

January 7, 2019 6:21 p.m.

Wargru says... #5

Teysa will not double the effects of creatures with a trigger that resolves upon their own death. Teysa states that it doubles the trigger of permaments on board upon the death of the creature. For example, as Kokusho states that it triggers upon it's own death, Teysa will not double it. Upon it's death, it is no longer a permanent that you control, and is instead a card that is in the graveyard. It is easy to confuse, and I did the same thing myself before re-reading the card. So, Archon of Justice, Kokusho, Hunted Witness, Pawn of Ulamgog, etc. will not double. It needs to be permanents you control at the time the trigger is placed on the stack. Hope this helps clear up any confusion. :)

January 8, 2019 12:24 a.m.

Wargru says... #6

Although, disclaimer, Pawn of Ulamog triggering off the death of other creatures is still fair game to double.

January 8, 2019 12:29 a.m.

Masterful says... #7

Wargru I had a similar comment on my reddit post, so I'm going to copy my response:

Not sure where you read this (I can see now that the misconception seems to be that Teysa says 'permanent'), but Teysa is the first card printed that uses the term “dying” in place of dies. While no rulings have been released about her yet, this likely means creatures are still permanents while dying, thus her ability works with cards with Afterlife and cards like Doomed Traveler. It seems odd to release Teysa with such an ability if it doesn’t combo with the Orzhov mechanic of the set (especially since her other ability does), therefore I’m working under the assumption that it does. If you’ve seen some official rulings released about her that confirm what you’re saying, I’d like to see them. Otherwise, only the release of the set will tell.

To quote BlazingRagnarok from his MTGSalvation comment:

"If that were true, death/leaves the battlefield triggers wouldn't work at all, since permanent abilities do not function outside of the battlefield unless another zone is specified. The game uses something called last known information to allow such triggers to function, which allows Teysa to double other creatures' death triggers. When afterlife triggers, last known information says the creatures with afterlife were permanents on the battlefield, so Teysa copies their triggers."

January 8, 2019 2:21 a.m.

ZendikariWol says... #8

I would write a primer but I'm too busy trying not to drown in finals. Maybe sometime.

Anyhow, I made a similar brew, borrowed a card or two from yours, and now you deserve to borrow some cards from mine. Thanks for the help and happy brewing!


Teysa, Ayli, Elenda, Ravos, Athreos, Krav, Regna..

Commander / EDH* ZendikariWol

4 COMMENTS | 26 VIEWS | IN 2 FOLDERS


January 8, 2019 2:44 p.m.

Last_Laugh says... #9

Ogre Slumlord makes some pretty significant deathtouch, vigilance, and lifelink tokens.

January 9, 2019 9:42 p.m.

Masterful says... #10

ZendikariWol I'm glad I was able to help. It looks like you made a nice list!

Last_Laugh The rat boy is in my maybeboard, but I'm not sure if I like him better than any of the token producers I'm using at the moment, so he doesn't have a slot in the deck. He's definitely a powerful card with Teysa though.

January 10, 2019 8:42 p.m.

I couldn't help but notice that you didn't put Sheoldred, Whispering One or Demonlord Belzenlok in either your mainboard or maybeboard

January 11, 2019 11:45 p.m.

Masterful says... #12

literaturecult46 Sheoldred definitely should have a home in some lists that want heavy bombs. Belzenlok wouldn't fit my specific build however due to my low mana cost, but I can see running him in higher average cmc lists. I'll add both to the maybeboard.

January 12, 2019 5:38 a.m.

FutureWitness says... #13

Have you thought of Secure the Wastes over Martial Coup ? Or has the board wipe effect edged it out?

January 13, 2019 9:10 p.m.

Masterful says... #14

FutureWitness Secure the Wastes is viable, but Martial Coup 's versatility and ability to wipe the board is definitely useful, especially in a deck that cares about its own creatures dying. I'm also playing it over other board wipes such as Merciless Eviction , Cleansing Nova , Fumigate , and Wrath of God just for its ability to make tokens.

January 13, 2019 10:43 p.m.

FutureWitness says... #15

People are saying that Teysa Karlov is more of a card that belongs in the 99 more than as a standalone commander, I think that her death Panharmonicon effect warrants her being a commander. Have you found her to be under powered compared to most decks(If you have done any play testing)?

January 14, 2019 9 p.m.

willis1234 says... #16

January 15, 2019 1:12 p.m.

Masterful says... #17

FutureWitness I have seen many people saying she belongs in the 99 as well. The main point in favor of this is that Teysa Karlov doesn't provide any of the pieces to an aristocrats deck herself. In comparison, other commanders like Teysa, Orzhov Scion or Krav, the Unredeemed and Regna, the Redeemer provide tokens and sac outlets by themselves. This means Teysa Karlov has overall less consistency; however, she provides other valuable aspects to the strategy.

You mentioned her necronomicon effect which allows for incredible value. With the other commanders, it will be easier to get an engine going since they provide some parts, but with TK, the engine will be much more powerful. Ultimately it comes down to preference. What you've been seeing are the people that prefer consistency over power, and there is validity to that. I would say competitively, the consistency wins out. Though, in my opinion, new Teysa's ability to copy death triggers is something I definitely want in my command zone.

In the testing I've done so far, the deck has been far from under-powered, but that depends on many factors such as meta and power level. My meta is 75%, but if yours is 90%, this deck would definitely be lacking. Inversely, in a heavily casual 30-40% meta, this deck would stomp.

As for whether or not she should be your commander, its up to you. Her effectiveness as a commander is apparent, and unless you're playing in a super competitive meta, she'll do great.

willis1234 Coils is cool. It makes the death engine run a lot faster and provides a lot of tokens with Requiem Angel . However, it's very slow to get running and does nothing until the engine is online. I'll add it to the maybeboard.

January 15, 2019 5:41 p.m.

willis1234 says... #18

wouldn't Ghoulcaller Gisa be really good in this deck?

January 15, 2019 7:33 p.m.

CaptSillva says... #19

A little surprised not so see Seraph of the Scales here. She seems powerful enough, and the flavor would be on point.

Other interesting options would be Dead Man's Chest , Desperate Sentry , Yahenni, Undying Partisan , and Overseer of the Damned .

January 16, 2019 3:25 a.m.

Masterful says... #20

willis1234 She certainly wouldn't be bad in the deck. However, for token producers, I'd rather them be death triggers to combo with Teysa. There's also the benefit of cards like Requiem Angel working immediately if I have a board presence plus sac outlet while Gisa is a bit slower.

CaptSillva Seraph has synergy, good flavor, and beautiful art, but I'm not sure it does enough for the deck to justify its cost. The only part I care about is the tokens, and there are better or cheaper producers. A 4/3 flier than can give itself deathtouch and vigilence isn't bad, it just doesn't work towards our gameplan. Though in other decks I can see why it would be played.

Dead Man's Chest is weird. It's card draw from an opponent's deck that also requires us to kill their creature. In the ideal scenario, we'll draw like 8 to 16 cards off of it. However, none of those cards will be working toward our death engine, we'll need to spend a removal spell on the creature most likely, and many of our removal spells exile instead of kill. With a more control heavy deck, I'd be more inclined to play this.

Desperate Sentry is ok. I value more tokens over big tokens, so I would rather play Ministrant of Obligation .

Yahenni, Undying Partisan is a good sac outlet that seconds as a moderate threat, but I personally don't care about the threat part much, so I'd rather play other sac outlets. If a free sac outlet is needed, I see its usefulness.

Overseer of the Damned is very powerful. If the deck ever needs more of a top-end (which it honestly might atm) I would consider playing this.

I'm going to add all of these cards to the maybeboard since they're all good suggestions.

January 16, 2019 12:05 p.m.

ThaneGarrus says... #21

You have quite a few important enchantments how about adding Academy Rector as a rattlesnake against early aggression and an efficient tutor especially with a sac outlet to improve consistency?

I like the idea of having Wound Reflection to lower the treshold needed for a torment or blood artist kill (fetchable with rector). Revival / Revenge can improve the deck's resilience while giving another wincon with wound reflection.

I am also curious to your thoughts on if Debt to the Deathless be a better Exsanguinate type effect than Torment of Hailfire ?

January 16, 2019 10:07 p.m.

Masterful says... #22

ThaneGarrus Academy Rector is a good card even though it doesn't combo with Teysa, but I'm not sure I have an open slot for her at the moment. Wound Reflection falls under the same slot problem. If I included one I would probably include the other. Revival/Revenge is good and versatile, but each of its effects individually are a bit lacking. The versatility might be worth it though.

Debt to the Deathless is better than Exsanguinate, but the real reason I include Torment of Hailfire is for its early potential. Debt and exsanguinate are not great when cast for even 7 or 10 mana. Hailfire can get rid of cards or deal even more damage when cast for that much. In a deck that needs a huge mana payoff, I'd play all three, but since this deck isn't focusing on that, I'm just playing the more versatile one.

January 17, 2019 2:23 p.m.

match_lighter says... #23

Thanks for the primer, very useful. I’m not sure if this works but maybe Matter Reshaper if it does work then you get two cards from the top. If it doesn’t work please let me know. Thanks for everything!

January 21, 2019 11:03 p.m.

Masterful says... #24

match_lighter Reshaper definitely works with Teysa. You'll get some mix of drawing cards or playing low cost permanents. These permanents could also be lands which is good ramp. I'd say this is probably the best card draw you'll get from a self death trigger, much better than Filigree Familiar or the like. Added to the maybeboard and thanks for the suggestion.

January 22, 2019 11:57 a.m.

ThaneGarrus says... #25

Thanks Masterful for the earlier explanations, I have come to agree with them.

What do you think of adding Ranger of Eos since you now have 2 creature sac outlets and Hangarback Walker, and also mainboarding Recruiter of the Guard

January 22, 2019 12:59 p.m.

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