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Just Froggin' Around - The Gitrog Monster Primer

Commander / EDH BG (Golgari) Competitive Infinite Combo Primer

kiebitzen


Description

The Gitrog Monster Combo is a complex series of quasi-infinite loops utilizing The Gitrog Monster herself, a free discard outlet, and Dakmor Salvage, along with a few other cards to create a reliable and hard to disrupt instant-speed win against any number of opponents.

In this primer I will break down the individual phases of the combo and different variations based on what resources you have available.


The Combo

Phase 1: Draw your deck Show

Once you have the basic combo pieces set up. the first step is to draw your deck. There are two different loops described here, one to use if you need to play the combo out manually and the other for when you can shortcut it. The reason for this is that the Manual Loop is not quite deternimistic, so it cannot be shortcut, but the Shortcut Loop, while it is deterministic sacrifices some of the combo protection that the Manual Loop provides. I recommend explaining the Shortcut Loop and asking if people are okay with you moving to the end state of that loop (entire deck in hand) and if they want to interact with the loop at some point or want you to play it out, just explain that you are manually going to use a slightly different loop.

NOTE: If Gaea's Blessing is your ONLY discard outlet, you cannot use the Shortcut Loop because you might draw it and lose the ability to shuffle.

1 - Discard Dakmor generating a TGM draw trigger
2 - Resolve TGM's trigger by replacing the draw with Dakmor's Dredge ability
3a - If a land is one of the two cards dredged, resolve the trigger and draw a card
3b - If the Shuffle Effect is one of the two cards dredged, put the shuffle trigger on the stack (before the draw trigger if you also dredged a land) and continue in response
4 - If you drew the Shuffle Effect, discard it and continue in response to the trigger. If you drew a land and you have more than three lands in hand, discard it and draw another card
5 - If there are only one or two cards left in your library, discard lands to draw them
6 - If you already have the shuffle trigger on the stack, resolve it now and return to step 1
7 - If you drew the Shuffle Effect in one of the last two cards, discard it and resolve the shuffle trigger and return to step 1

Repeat this loop until your deck contains an odd number of lands and the Shuffle Effect with no other non-land cards. From there, you can skip straight to the Phase 2 loop to draw the rest of your deck and generate any number of draw triggers.

1 - Discard Dakmor generating a TGM draw trigger
2 - Resolve TGM's trigger by replacing the draw with Dakmor's Dredge ability
3a - If the Shuffle Effect and another non-land card are put into the graveyard, resolve the shuffle trigger. Return to step 1 and repeat
3b - If a land is put into the graveyard by the dredge ability and produces another TGM trigger, with that trigger on the stack, return to step 1 and repeat
3c - If both a land and the Shuffle Effect are put in the graveyard, you put the draw trigger on the stack first, then the shuffle trigger. Resolve the shuffle and return to step 1 and repeat

  • Stack: Returns to starting state
  • Hand: Contains all non-exiled cards not on the battlefield
  • Battlefield: TGM and Discard Outlet
  • Library: Empty

Phase 2: Infinite Draw Triggers Show

If you have made it here to phase two, it is incredibly difficult for anyone to stop you regardless of what they have. Like most combo decks, if you have drawn your deck, its simply a matter of correct sequencing from there.

NOTE: You can skip this phase if you plan to use a sorcery speed loop to generate infinite black mana. The sorcery speed loops don't require infinite draw triggers as they generate the triggers as part of the loop so they can maintain an empty stack.

NOTE: Gaea's Blessing doesn't work as a Shuffle Effect for this part because it only triggers on going from library to graveyard and not when discarded.

Setup - If you used the Shortcut Loop in Phase 1, its End State is identical to this Starting State. If you used the Manual Loop, to get to this Starting State from the Manual Loop End State simply discard a non-dakmor land and in response to the draw trigger, discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle.

1 - Discard Dakmor, add a TGM trigger to the stack
2 - Resolve the TGM trigger to dredge two cards
3a - If you dredge two lands, put the TGM trigger on the stack and in response repeat from step 1
3b - If you dredge the Shuffle Effect, put the TGM trigger on the stack first, then the Shuffle Effect trigger, resolve the shuffle trigger and repeat from step 1

Cleanup - Once you have your "infinite" draw triggers, resolve two of them to draw the non-Dakmor land and the Shuffle Effect.

  • Stack: "Infinite" draw triggers on the stack
  • Hand: Contains all non-exiled cards not on the battlefield
  • Battlefield: TGM and Discard Outlet
  • Library: Empty

Phase 3: Infinite Black Mana Show

Easy mode: If you have Skirge Familiar as your discard outlet, you already have "infinite" black mana on accident just from creating "infinite" draw triggers.

Instant Speed Mana Sources:
1. Dark Ritual
2. Cabal Ritual

Sorcery Speed Mana Sources:
1. Lotus Petal
2. Culling the Weak+(Deathrite Shaman, Putrid Imp, or Dark Confidant)
3. Lion's Eye Diamond

NOTE: Putrid Imp can not be both your Discard Outlet AND part of your mana source, but if you have another outlet in play you can use it for Culling the Weak.

  • Stack: Any state for Instant Speed Loop, Empty stack for Sorcery Speed Loops
  • Hand: Contains deck including Shuffle Effect and Mana Source
  • Battlefield: TGM and any Discard Outlet
  • Library: Empty

Each Mana Source has different requirements to begin the loop:

Dark Ritual
Start cost:
Loop to use: Instant Speed Loop
When to use: This is the optimal Mana Source if you need to go off at instant speed

Lotus Petal
Start cost:
Loop to use: Sorcery Speed Loop
When to use: This is the optimal option if you have no mana but are able to do sorcery speed

Cabal Ritual
Start cost:
Loop to use: Instant Speed Loop
When to use: If you somehow don't have Dark Ritual anymore and need to go off at instant speed

Culling the Weak
Start cost: + Cost of creature (None if the creature is already in play)
Loop to use: Sorcery Speed Loop
When to use: Almost never, but if all your other options are exiled it is an option

Lion's Eye Diamond
Start cost:
Loop to use: Sorcery Speed Loop
When to use: Works like Lotus Petal, but WAY more work, so only when desperate

This loop converts two draw triggers to one black mana at instant speed allowing you to turn "infinite" draw triggers to "infinite" black mana at instant speed.

Setup - To prepare for this loop from the starting state, put "infinite" draw triggers on the stack using the loop from Phase 2

1 - Cast the Dark Ritual or Cabal Ritual
2 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve its trigger
3 - Resolve two draw triggers and repeat from step 1

These sorcery speed loops don't use the infinite draw triggers the way the instant speed loops do, but rather use a more limited draw as part of a bigger loop that can be shortcut to give you "infinite" mana.

Lotus Petal/Culling the Weak Loop
1a - Cast Lotus Petal and activate it, then discard a non-land card
1b - Cast a creature (Deathrite Shaman, Putrid Imp, or Dark Confidant) then cast Culling the Weak sacrificing it
2 - Discard Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
3 - Discard three non-dakmor lands and resolve the draws
4 - Discard Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
5 - Use the Instant Speed Draw loop from Phase 2 to generate generate four draw triggers
6 - Resolve the draw triggers to draw your library and repeat from step 1

Lion's Eye Diamond Loop
1 - Cast Lion's Eye Diamond and activate it discarding hand
2 - Put the Shuffle Effect trigger on the stack first and then the TGM trigger
3 - Resolve the TGM trigger to dredge Dakmor and then resolve the shuffle trigger
4 - Use the Manual Loop from Phase 1 to draw your deck again and repeat from step 1

  • Stack: Returned to starting state
  • Hand: Contains deck
  • Battlefield: TGM and any Discard Outlet
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: "Infinite" Black Mana

Phase 4: Infinite Green Mana Show

NOTE: You can skip this phase if you intend to win at sorcery speed with Praetor's Grasp, as it does not require any green mana.

There are three ways to do this depending on which cards you have available. Two are instant speed and one is sorcery speed. Use whichever you prefer if both instant speed options are available. One method uses Elvish Spirit Guide to make the mana, the other uses lands to do it. If those are unavailable the sorcery speed method is there as a backup.

This is the simplest loop to generate "infinite" green mana. It converts five draw triggers and four black mana to one green mana and four black mana allowing you to turn "infinite" draw triggers into "infinite" green mana.

  • Stack: "Infinite" draw triggers
  • Hand: Contains deck including Required Cards
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: At least

1 - Exile ESG from your hand to add
2 - Discard Riftsweeper
3 - Cast Necromancy targeting Riftsweeper
4 - Resolve Riftsweeper's etb trigger targeting ESG
5 - Cast Culling the Weak sacrificing Riftsweeper
6 - Discard the Shuffle Effect to shuffle back in ESG, Riftsweeper, Culling the Weak, Necromancy and the Shuffle Effect
7 - Resolve five draw triggers to draw your library and repeat from step 1

  • Stack: "Infinite" draw triggers
  • Hand: Contains deck
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: "Infinite" green mana and at least

This loop provides another option if you are missing a piece of the Elvish Spirit Guide Loop, but requires a single green mana to start. This loop converts two draw triggers, one green mana and (with Twilight Mire) one black mana to two green mana allowing you to convert your "infinite" draw triggers and "infinite" black mana to "infinite" green mana at instant speed.

Setup: If your Double-green Land is not in play yet and you do not have any more land drops for the turn (or are comboing at instant speed), look at the "TRICK: Land Swapping" in the Extra Tips and Tricks section for an explanation of how to get it into play.

  • Stack: "Infinite" draw triggers
  • Hand: Contains deck including Required Cards
  • Battlefield: Double-green Land
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: and if using Twilight Mire, "Infinite" black mana

1 - Discard Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
2 - Cast Crop Rotation sacrificing your Double-green Land
3 - Resolve the draw trigger from the Crop Rotation sac to draw the Shuffle Effect
4 - With Crop Rotation still on the stack, discard the Shuffle Effect
5 - Resolve the shuffle trigger to shuffle the Shuffle Effect and the Double-green Land into the library
6 - Resolve Crop Rotation by searching your library for the Double-green Land and putting it onto the battlefield
7 - Tap the land to add at least two green mana to your mana pool
8 - Resolve a draw triggers to draw the Shuffle Effect
9 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
10 - Resolve two draw triggers to return to the Starting State and repeat from step 1

  • Stack: "Infinite" draw triggers
  • Hand: Contains deck
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: "Infinite" Green Mana

You only need to use one of these loops if you are forced to go off at sorcery speed but don't have Praetor's Grasp for the black mana only combo (described in Phase 5), or if you don't have access to the necessary pieces for either the Crop Rotation Loop or the ESG loop.

Use the exact loops described in Phase 3 under "Sorcery Speed Loops". The loops that utilize the mana sources Lotus Petal or Lion's Eye Diamond can both be used to create green mana in addition to black.

Phase 5: Winning the Game Show

There are two "wincons" in this deck, one aimed for a sorcery speed win and the other capable of working at instant speed. They both use "infinite" loops to kill all your enemies at once, one by exiling all of their decks, the other by dealing damage to them.

This is the optimal loop for winning the game. Having an instant speed wincon means you can do things like win in your endstep or in response to removal on one of your combo pieces.

Setup: If your Rath's Edge and/or Dryad Arbor are not in play yet, look at the "TRICK: Land Swapping" in the Extra Tips and Tricks section for an explanation of how to get it into play.

1 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and shuffle
2 - Cast Crop Rotation sacrificing Rath's Edge
3 - Draw the Shuffle Effect from the TGM trigger and discard the Shuffle Effect with Crop Rotation still on the stack
4 - Resolve the shuffle and then resolve Crop Rotation to put Rath's Edge back onto the battlefield
5 - Activate Rath's Edge, sacrificing Dryad Arbor, to deal one damage to an opponent and draw the Shuffle Effect from the draw trigger
6 - If Necromancy was not enchanting Dryad Arbor, discard it
7 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve four draw triggers
8 - Discard Dryad Arbor and in response to the draw trigger cast Necromancy targeting Dryad Arbor and repeat from step 1

You Win! Congratulations!

If you have the luxury of doing your combo at sorcery speed (or are forced to because you don't have the pieces necessary for the instant speed win), you can win directly after producing infinite black mana by simply using the same loop as you did for the sorcery speed mana but with Praetor's Grasp instead. This will allow you to exile all your opponents decks face down so that they lose as soon as they draw for their next turn.

  • Stack: Empty
  • Hand: Contains deck including Required Cards
  • Battlefield: TGM and any Discard Outlet
  • Library: Empty
  • Mana: "Infinite" black mana

1 - Cast Praetor's Grasp targeting an opponent with cards still in their library
2 - Discard a non-land card, then discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
3 - Discard three non-dakmor lands and resolve the draw triggers
4 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
5 - Use the Instant Speed Draw loop from Phase 2 to generate four draw triggers
6 - Resolve the draw triggers to draw your library and repeat from step 1

You Win! Congratulations!


Tips and Tricks Show

This trick helps you get the combo piece lands into play in order to set up their respective "infinite" loops. It is most often used to put Twilight Mire, Gaea's Cradle or Rath's Edge into play, but you could use it to swap any two lands between your hand and the battlefield.

Setup: If you have zero lands in play you can get to this starting state at instant speed by doing the following: Discard Shuffle Effect and shuffle. Discard Dryad Arbor and draw. Cast Necromancy targeting Dryad Arbor.

NOTE: If got here with no lands in play, and thought "Oh that is convenient, but I already have Necromancy in play enchanting my Discard Outlet, how can I use it again??", just check out the TIP: "But I already used my Necromancy!".

1 - Discard a non-land and then the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
2 - Discard the Desired Land and resolve the draw trigger
3 - Cast Crop Rotation sacrificing any land in play and draw from the trigger
4 - With Crop Rotation still on the stack, discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve the shuffle trigger
5 - Resolve Crop Rotation putting the Desired Land into play
6 - Resolve two draw triggers to draw your library
7 - Discard the Shuffle Effect and resolve another two draw triggers to return to the starting state but with the Desired Land now in play

If your Necromancy is already in play enchanting your Discard Outlet, but you need it to put a land into play for the instant speed win combo because all your lands got Armageddoned away, or more likely, because you sacrificed them all to get to this point, you can use this simple trick to get access to Necromancy once more.

1 - Cast Nature's Claim (or anything similar) on Necromancy
2 - In response to the Necromancy trigger, use your extensive loop knowledge to generate "infinite" draws and "infinite" mana again, and finish off all the combos with the Necromancy trigger still on the stack.

NOTE: This does not work for the sorcery speed loops, but you don't need lands in play for the sorcery speed loops, so don't worry about it.

Special thanks to Razzliox for this tip.

Your endstep can be used as a discard outlet to filter through your deck and set up your instant speed combo. We will look at two different loops you can use in your endstep to filter to a winning hand.

NOTE: These loops work even through Necropotence (perhaps the most common way to end the turn with more than seven cards in hand) by simply putting the Necropotence trigger on the stack first and resolving the draw (dredge actually) first so Dakmor or the Dredger never get exiled. Be extra careful using the Dredge Tutoring loop with Necropotence out though because you will lose anything you discard that is not a Dredger. Don't discard anything you will need later.

First lets look at how you get Dakmor Salvage to your hand if you don't have it already. This loop filters through your deck and allows you to replace any lands in your hand with non-lands from your deck as well as potentially putting Dakmor Salvage into your graveyard (and then to hand). It is not infinite in any sense as it only works once for each land you have to be able to discard and can fizzle if you ever don't hit a land on your dredge.

  • Turn Phase: Cleanup Step
  • Hand: 8+ cards (including at least one land)
  • Battlefield: TGM
  • Graveyard: Dredger

NOTE: The Dredger can start in your hand instead of graveyard, you just need to have 9+ cards in hand so you can discard both the Dredger and a land.

1 - Discard a land (and Dredger if it is in hand) to cleanup
2 - Replace the TGM trigger with dredge
3a - Dredge X cards hitting Dakmor and dredge Dakmor back with the draw trigger - Congratulations you did it!
3b - Dredge X cards hitting zero lands - Oh no! You fizzled
3c - Dredge X cards hitting one or more lands and resolve the draw
4c - Once the stack clears, the game creates a new Cleanup Step bringing you back to step 1

Next we will look at the loop once you have Dakmor Salvage in your hand. This loop allows you to actually filter through your entire library and choose the hand you want. While you can do this and just pass with the "perfect" hand, the next section will look at what hands can win immediately in the endstep so you don't have to pass the turn.

NOTE: This has to be done manually and can take a while but should not be considered slow play because you are continually changing the cards in your hand.

  • Turn Phase: Cleanup Step
  • Hand: 8+ cards (including Dakmor)
  • Battlefield: TGM

NOTE: Dakmor can be in the graveyard instead of your hand, you just need to discard a different land in the first cleanup step to dredge it back to hand.

1 - Discard Dakmor and your least important other cards to cleanup
2 - Replace the TGM trigger with dredge
3 - If the dredge hits a land, draw a card
4 - The stack clears and you enter a new cleanup step with one more card in your hand bringing you back to step 1

Eventually you will end up with a hand of nine cards that you want to keep because you discard down to seven cards, then dredge back Dakmor and draw the ninth card you want off the dredge. You then enter your final cleanup step where you can choose to either discard your two extra cards and pass the turn or try to go for an endstep win. This will usually just depend on if you have the cards needed for your instant speed win left in the deck. If you need to use the sorcery speed win, you will have to pass and wait for your next turn.

NOTE: First you may be wondering why these are nine card hands. This is because the way you get to these hands is the Dakmor Filtering Loop above. While it starts with 8 cards (so you can discard Dakmor), when you hit a land with Dakmor it gives you another draw bumping your hand size to 9 which is why you are able to filter while still discarding Dakmor over and over. Each of the play instructions in this section will start with which two cards you discard and then a response to those discards so that you can combo in that end step. Don't forget to respond to the triggers because if your opponents pass priority and the stack clears your turn will end and you can't do anything about it.

When filtering your hand in your endstep or looking to win at instant speed via an Ad Nauseam or something, you have to know what you actually want in your hand to set up the win. You can use the Dakmor Filtering Loop above to set up your hand in the following ways to enable a win. All of these assume you have Dakmor Salvage in hand and The Gitrog Monster in play. They are instant speed so you can use them even in your cleanup step right after filtering the hand.

Most of your options depend on how much available mana you have. We will start assuming you have zero available mana and work up from there to show some more options with more available resources.

NOTE: Remember that you can't float mana into the cleanup step so these must be untapped land/creature/artifact sources.

Elvish Spirit Guide (ESG)
Crop Rotation
Dark Ritual
Cabal Ritual
Necromancy
Discard Outlet (preferably Skirge Familiar)
Oblivion Crown
Non-dakmor Land
Dakmor Salvage

How to play:
Discard your Discard Outlet and the Non-dakmor Land
In response to the TGM trigger, exile ESG for and cast Crop Rotation.
Tutor for an untapped black land and tap it to add .
Cast Dark Ritual to go to .
Cast Cabal Ritual to get .
Cast Necromancy targeting you Discard Outlet.

Now you have all the pieces to combo out using the Manual Loop in Phase 1.

NOTE: This hand "loses" to counterspells but can play around a single removal spell if they cast the removal any time after you cast your rituals. If someone uses removal on TGM in response to Necromancy, cast Oblivion Crown and go off in response. This hand also protects Dakmor by not discarding it until you have your combo ready.

Elvish Spirit Guide (ESG)
Crop Rotation
Dark Ritual
Necromancy
Discard Outlet (preferably Skirge Familiar)
Oblivion Crown
Dakmor Salvage
Choose 2: Autumn's Veil, Cabal Ritual, Non-dakmor land

How to play:
Same as above except now you get to choose two of the three protections based on what you think your opponents have. Autumn Veil protects you against blue/black counterspells and removal, non-dakmor land protects you against graveyard hate, Cabal Ritual gives you the mana to use the backup Discard Outlet.

Starting with black mana allows you to remove ESG and Crop Rotation from the hand freeing up more space. Enough mana give you the ability to take out Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual as well. There are a variety of different things you can do with those extra spaces depending on what you need or what kind of interaction you are expecting.

You can use Necromancy to put Sylvan Safekeeper or Dosan the Falling Leaf into play first to protect your combo and then use Oblivion Crown as the outlet. *Careful you don't give shroud to the creature you wanted to put Oblivion Crown on!

You can use Noxious Revival with Entomb (or Crop Rotation or even Culling the Weak if you have Dryad Arbor out) to return a spell to your hand after it gets countered. Entomb first and respond to the TGM trigger with Noxious Revival.

You can add removal if there is something stopping a later part of your combo.

If you aren't sure what you need to defend against, you can put Vampiric Tutor and Entomb to be able to grab anything you missed.


Coming Soon -
Chains of Mephistopheles Tips and Tricks
Resolving Ad Nauseam Tips
How to Necro (potence, not threads) Tips
Doomsday Guide
Coping with Haters: How to dodge the hate cards that stop the combo


Credits

Thanks to the following redditors for their work on this deck and their help discovering some of the various tips, tricks and loops that make this beautiful deck operate so fluidly.
/u/razzliox
/u/mazeTemporal
/u/Leptys207

Suggestions

Updates

Comments

Why Sunscorched Desert?

April 23, 2017 9:39 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #2

Sunscorched Desert is the instant speed wincon. You loop it into and out of play infinitely using Crop Rotation. I will be adding a primer for the wincons soon that will describe how all the combos work.

April 24, 2017 1:43 p.m.

AlexoBn says... #3

Damn my brain hurts :D :D . Maybe I will proxy some of the cards just to get the interactions. Seems like Gitrog is not the way I want to win :D although it is super amazing

May 10, 2017 4:38 a.m.

kiebitzen says... #4

AlexoBn Haha, yeah. It takes some practice and a lot of thinking, but it is super satisfying when you get the hang of it, and people are pretty surprised when you kill them with a land that does 1 damage. Or exile their entire library face-down.

alitabitiliterit Sunscorched has actually be swapped back for Rath's Edge because it has slightly more utility in that it can kill some hatebears that stop the combo.

May 10, 2017 6:34 p.m.

AlexoBn says... #5

Have you considered adding Krosan Grip? You can make your combo uncounterable when using Skirge Familiar because mana abilities don't use the stack and the rest works then too. When you have infinite mana the rest should be easy

May 11, 2017 1:24 a.m.

kiebitzen says... #6

AlexoBn That is definitely an interesting interaction, and worth considering, but the things people usually answer/counter are Gitrog herself or the discard outlet. After you have those there is usually very little people can do to stop you, but this does stop most of those few things. The main thing I don't like is the manacost. You usually do not have an extra three mana to spend on a defensive spell like that. I cut Dosan and City of Solitude for the same reason. Krosan Grip definitely has other utility as well, so it may be worth it.

May 11, 2017 2:59 a.m.

ThePrawnfessor says... #7

Hey man I also play a variation of TGM and ive put a significant amount of time into the deck as i see you having done. My build is different on a few fundimental points. I opted not to run the 1 drop mana dorks and cradle but instead focus on more of an artifact ramp base to accelerate into a t2 TGM more consistantly, as far as my win cons ive tried to keep them simple. i wen with tendrils of agony because few cards really stop tendrils, and at the point where youre drawing your deck storming off is really easy to do with lotus petal cylcing through hand to graveyard to library again. im running both of the shuffle effects you are as well. i win 90% of the games i play, and this isnt for lack of a competitive meta. Against stax players my build seems far superior due to only needing 1-2 critters on the board at maximum to combo off. i really think your build is interesting but youre overcomplicating it far more than it needs to be. i also dont really understand the purpose of necromancy in this light either i think you could free up both your land base and your spell slots if you just went the artifact build with things such as basalt monilith and mesmeric orb combo to get you started. With all the space building the way i have has given me ive found that i can run significantly more disruption for the cards that try to tell me no, leading for more consistent gameplay.

May 17, 2017 7:49 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #8

ThePrawnfessor: I'm glad you found my list, and I would love to see yours. The one on your profile looks like it hasn't been updated in four months and doesn't have either of the monoliths. I am curious what changes you have made from the existing list because it seems to be slow and clunky. I'll reserve my judgement until you send me your updated list. My only reservation is that with an artifact focused ramp package the deck becomes much weaker to Null Rod and co. which seems like a bad idea when the decks main combo is inherently weak to Cursed Totem. Forcing that reliance on a single type of ramp will definitely hold you back. The goal of my list is to utilize the best ramp of all types to make sure I am not overly affected by any one hate piece. The other issue with using the more mana intensive artifacts is that Ad Nauseam becomes even harder to use effectively. I am excited to see where you have taken the list.

May 18, 2017 3:10 p.m.

ThePrawnfessor says... #9

kiebitzen yeah i havent posted an updated list in quit a while. also null rod has yet to have a splash in my competitive community so i can see the relevance of that arugment. ill try to getan update list within the next 2 days or so if you want to compare.

May 18, 2017 8:45 p.m.

so i just uploaded the new and improved list of TGM as i am currently playing it. it feels very consistant, and as i stated before wins the majority of the games i play with it. feel free to take a peek when you get the chance

May 18, 2017 9:21 p.m.

solarPULSAR says... #11

The Gitrog Monster is female? Interesting

May 19, 2017 5:07 p.m.

I mean to be fair Species of frogs can change their gender at will so who are you to assume?!

May 20, 2017 4:15 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #13

solarPULSAR: I refer to her as female because I choose to, I don't believe she has a "canon" gender. Though Prawnfessor is right, some frogs change their gender as needed to balance the population. Also, the female frog is usually larger than the male, and while we don't have any comparison, The Gitrog Monster is certainly a larger frog.

ThePrawnfessor: I took a look at your deck and playtested it a bunch. It seems pretty dependent on getting the early fastmana. Games where I had t1 Mana Crypt or Vault or Exploration tended to goldfish at a good speed, but often I found myself with a bunch of slow cards stuck in my hand, ramping to the win around t5/6. While this is obviously not a bad deck, and always was able to get there pretty quickly, it definitely felt slower to not have all the other ramp sources. I am curious to see how it would perform in the cockatrice meta, I think it might have issues with the t3/4 4c combo lists as it has little interaction and can only race that about half the time. It may just be the particular way I like to play frog, but I think the strongest approach, since we lack blue and stax is to be as fast as possible. I'll leave a comment on your list later with some comments on my experience with specific cards when goldfishing (to be taken with a grain of salt).

May 20, 2017 6:11 p.m.

for sure man i appreciate the constructive criticism as well. im very unfamiliar with the meta on cockatrice.

May 25, 2017 10:01 p.m.

TheBeans says... #15

If you wouldn't mind, I've also built a competitive combo Gitrog Deck, but instead have focused all of my resources into guranteeing an Exsanguinate/Faith of the Devoted win. Give it a quick look! I'd love to see what you think of it, since you clearly have explored every nuance of The Gitrog Monster in you extensive playtime. Thanks and Upvoted!

July 9, 2017 11:20 p.m.

ancientskull says... #16

This Gitrog deck seems awesome! I'd love to give it a try some time! +1

July 11, 2017 9:58 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #17

TheBeans: I took a look at your list and left a comment. Thanks for the upvote and I am glad you like the deck!

ancientskull: It is by far my favorite deck, I am glad you like it! :) Thanks for the upvote.

July 11, 2017 10:14 p.m.

Pygmyrhino990 says... #18

Not exactly going for budget here are we, but I love the deck and for the sake of your wallet I hope you haven't built this IRL

July 22, 2017 11 p.m.

AlexoBn says... #19

Pygmyrhino990 the deck is for cEDH so budget was probably not an option but pure power was. The cEDH community is also pretty open minded regarding the use of proxies (because all that matters is your skill and your deckbuilding - although there are primers for budget decks too)

July 23, 2017 6:09 a.m.

AlexoBn says... #20

Plus you can get to lower price by just replacing the editions (beta and alpha duals are of course expensive af but revised will reduce the price a lot... same for city of brass.. still noch cheap though)

July 23, 2017 6:10 a.m.

Pygmyrhino990 says... #21

Have you calculated what the cost would be with the cheapest versions of the cards. I'm somewhat interested in making this deck if it can become cheaper

July 23, 2017 8:02 a.m.

kiebitzen says... #22

Pygmyrhino990: I have built this irl, only missing a few cards, though I do have FBB cards instead of the beta versions. As AlexoBn said, this is designed to be an optimized competitive deck, so card price is not factored into deckbuilding decisions. I threw together a version of the deck with the same list but with the cheapest version of each card which cut the deck price in half: Frog but with ugly printings to save money. I also have a version of the list I made with the restriction of no cards that cost over 15$ if that interests you as well: He's Just a Frog on a Budget. Feel free to let me know if you have any questions!

July 23, 2017 6:49 p.m.

DudelRok says... #23

Have you considered Drownyard Temple at all? I run it with the land outlets, Helldozer is a funny one by the way, and Bitter Ordeal to exile decks or with Retreat to Hagra for infinite life drain/kill. I also am currently running Last Laugh for the same thing.

I mean, even if they counter Laugh/hagra/etc, I can just redraw them unless they have been exiled and that just requires a single green to resolve with Riftsweeper.

August 6, 2017 3:39 a.m.

DudelRok says... #24

And no Realms Uncharted!?

August 6, 2017 3:50 a.m.

kiebitzen says... #25

DudelRok: Thanks for taking time to look at my deck, I am always open to new suggestions. I'll talk a bit about each of the cards you recommended for the list.

Drownyard Temple is useful but there is no need for it in the deck. It can give you value in grindy games, but this is a fast combo deck so a colorless land that doesn't ramp you and isn't part of the combo is not worth it.

Helldozer is about as casual a card as they come. Anything over 3 cmc has to be game winning or a combo piece to be worth including in the deck. Definitely not worth it.

Bitter Ordeal is a decent wincon for the deck. Due to the nature of the combo though, we only need a single sorcery speed wincon and I think Praetor's Grasp is the best card for the slot. It has the most utility outside of the combo and can randomly mise games against certain focused combo decks (like other Gitrog decks). You could definitely run Bitter Ordeal instead, but you probably don't want both.

Retreat to Hagra is a terrible card and not a strong wincon. This style of card does nothing to help the combo and is completely unnecessary to win once the combo is going. Because the combo draws your entire deck, you don't need much wincon redundancy and there is no need to run wincons that are not good on their own.

Last Laugh see Retreat to Hagra

Realms Uncharted is a card that has seen play in the deck before. It is a decent tutor for Dakmor Salvage but it costs 3 mana. It is nice that it is an instant, but I have found that there is no need to be running any of the 3 drop tutors (except Praetor's Grasp which is a wincon). In the more midrange version of the deck this card is a powerhouse. It is by no means a bad card, I may even put it in the maybeboard so people know it is worth considering.

August 7, 2017 3:58 a.m.

DudelRok says... #26

I currently can't make infinite green so I need ways to utilize the black, and Drownyard Temple does that. I was only suggesting it and Bitter Ordeal.

I think I'd still prefer Bitter Ordeal, though, to Grasp 'cause Bitter costs one, as well as always hitting more cards than Grasp.

The lack of Realms was weird to me, though. I kinda get why you don't run it... ish. My meta isn't aggressive enough to need to win the second Get Good hits play.

Also: I didn't say Helldozer was good, I said it was fun. XD

August 7, 2017 7:46 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #27

DudelRok: Ahh, well that is a different problem entirely. If you don't have Elvish Spirit Guide/Riftsweeper/Necromancy/Culling the Weak or Crop Rotation/(Twilight Mire or Gaea's Cradle) to make infinite green, the best wincons are Geth's Verdict or Ebony Charm. You want something that has utility other than its function as a wincon.

Drownyard works as well, but requires you to run other cards you would rather not run. The cost of Bitter Ordeal is definitely better and the card is decent, but you don't get to play the cards you exile, so it doesn't let you grab Pact of Negation or something else to protect your combo (or tutor for it).

Yeah, definitely a meta call. My list is tuned for speed above all else, but any list a little slower would likely want Realms.

Also: I didn't say Helldozer was bad, I said it was casual. :P

August 10, 2017 3:24 a.m.

Zyxan says... #28

Love the primer. I've learned a lot about comboing with the frog. My only question was why you use gaea's blessing instead of the second eldrazi titan. A pretty common move in my meta is to wait for my first titan to hit the graveyard and then attempt to exile it. In response I keeping dredging and hit the next titan so that the exile doesn't matter. I'm assuming you do the same thing with the blessing, but why take the chance of drawing it and being dead in the water!? Great guide!

August 16, 2017 11:19 a.m.

merrowMania says... #29

Great Primer!

Something to note, you can also produce 'infinite' green at instant speed (though ONLY instant speed/end step) with Lotus Cobra, Necromancy, Dryad Arbor, and Culling the Weak and 'infinite' black mana. Discard Cobra, then Necromancy Cobra. Go to cleanup and sac the Necromancy. With the Necromancy sac trigger on the stack, proceed to reanimate and sac Arbor for one green mana.

August 18, 2017 11 p.m.

merrowMania says... #30

Zyxan - Ad Nauseam is tough enough with one titan. Two makes it unplayable.

August 18, 2017 11:14 p.m.

kiebitzen says... #31

Zyxan: You are right about that being the purpose of having Gaea's Blessing in the list. As far as using another Eldrazi, merrowMania is right about Ad Nauseam being the main consideration. The other goal is to minimize the number of dead cards in the deck. Since rarely have enough mana to cast the titans, it is better to have the Gaea's Blessing, even if it is just a bad cantrip. Also sometimes you can mise value against reanimator strategies that are slow-rolling their combo. (Buried Alive pass. Feels really bad when we get to follow up with Gaea's Blessing lol)

merrowMania: Haha, that's a cool trick. I may add that to the primer if you don't mind. Nice if you don't have access to Riftsweeper or your double-green lands.

August 22, 2017 1:59 p.m.

merrowMania says... #32

Go for it! More knowledge for the collective that is HypnoToad!

I usually use it to combo through Root Maze after losing Riftsweeper.

August 22, 2017 6:06 p.m.

merrowMania says... #33

Just realized I forgot to give context to the loop. I went through this explanation several times, trying to write everything at once. It culminated in my giving up on explaining how to do it with Skirge Familiar still in play. Any part of my explanation that contains Skirge Familiar is basically superfluous, but I will leave it so you have the option of making it look pretty if you want to add it for when Oblivion Crown is exiled.......this kind of explaining is why I hate writing primers...reading what I have written, trying to make exceptions for Skirge Familiar makes the setup read terribly...

Setup:
You MUST (technically not, but you need 1 green mana in order to use Skirge Familiar) create your 'infinite' black mana by looping Dark Ritual/Cabal Ritual with your discard outlet. It is possible to perform this loop with Skirge Familiar, but you need to have a green mana as part of the startup cost (Elvish Spirit Guide does work). It is much easier to simply change the discard outlet with Oblivion Crown and loop rituals, since you will not need any green mana. If you used Skirge Familiar and are trying an end step kill, you must have used Necromancy already (otherwise you would be doing a sorcery speed kill because this kill requires using Necromancy twice (if you have access to two green mana, you can Nature's Claim the Necromancy twice to get it off the Familiar and on and off the Cobra so you can use it repeatedly on the Dryad Arbor)). It is not necessary since you can just change your discard outlet to Gitrog or a third creature with Oblivion Crown. Then you can go to cleanup, spend Green to Nature's Claim Necromancy, or cast Culling the Weak saccing Skirge Familiar (casting Oblivion Crown is mandatory for this line if you do not have another discard outlet) to get Necromancy back in hand. If you use the cleanup method to remove Necromancy, you must have a backup discard outlet or a green mana to cast Nature's Claim on the Lotus Cobra Necromancy. Regardless of your method, you must make sure to have 'infinite' black mana. Loop rituals into 'infinite' black mana again or use Skirge Familiar if applicable. Proceed to draw deck/graveyard with your discard outlet.

(Black and generic costs will be ignored for rest of explanation due to 'infinite' black mana)
Discard Lotus Cobra. Reanimate Lotus Cobra with Necromancy. If you have one green mana, cast Nature's Claim on Necromancy and continue in response to the sac trigger.

Beginning:
Step 1: Draw deck/graveyard.
2: Discard Dryad Arbor.
3: Reanimate it with Necromancy.
4: Landfall trigger from Cobra to produce one green.
5: Sac Dryad Arbor to Culling the Weak.
6: Return to Step 1.

August 23, 2017 12:47 a.m.

merrowMania says... #34

AAAAAAND my perfectionist nature kicked in. The following is a clean(er) version of the loop without Skirge Familiar:

Setup:
You MUST create your 'infinite' black mana by looping Dark Ritual/Cabal Ritual with your discard outlet. If you made mana with a Skirge Familiar reanimated by Necromancy, cast Oblivion Crown on The Gitrog Monster or a third creature. Then you can go to cleanup (aka use Necromancy's own ability to sac itself), spend one green mana to Nature's Claim Necromancy, or cast Culling the Weak saccing Skirge Familiar to get Necromancy back in hand. Regardless of your method, you must make sure to have 'infinite' black mana. Loop rituals into 'infinite' black mana again or use Skirge Familiar if applicable. Proceed to draw deck/graveyard with your discard outlet.

(Black and generic costs will be ignored for rest of explanation due to 'infinite' black mana)
Discard Lotus Cobra. Reanimate Lotus Cobra with Necromancy. If you have one green mana, you may cast Nature's Claim on Necromancy and continue in response to the sac trigger. Otherwise, go to cleanup to make Necromancy sac itself and proceed to combo off in response to the trigger to sac Lotus Cobra.

Beginning:
Step 1: Draw deck/graveyard.
Step 2: Discard Dryad Arbor.
Step 3: Reanimate it with Necromancy.
Step 4: Landfall trigger from Lotus Cobra to produce one green.
Step 5: Sac Dryad Arbor to Culling the Weak.
Step 6: Return to Step 1.

August 23, 2017 12:58 a.m.

kozad says... #35

Ramunap Excavator might be a good value add, so you have a fallback if someone exiles that Crucible of Worlds. ;) I see a ton of other ways to reclaim your lands in this deck, but it's still a cheap card, one that is guaranteed to cost more as time passes.

October 11, 2017 12:44 a.m.

kiebitzen says... #36

kozad I have actually cut Crucible from my paper version of the list because the way I play it is pretty combo focused, but in a meta where I needed to have that late game value grind power I would absolutely run both. I think if I add the Crucible effect back into my paper list I might actually just run Ramunap instead because it is much more tutorable for those games where I do actually need it. Double green makes it a tough call, but usually you are less tight on colored mana when going for Crucible-based lines of play rather than fast combo lines.

October 11, 2017 1:14 p.m.

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Date added 6 months
Last updated 1 month
Legality

This deck is Commander / EDH legal.

Cards 100
Avg. CMC 1.78
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Top rank #40 on 2017-08-16
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