- 2x Birds of Paradise
- 2x Bond Beetle
- 3x Borderland Ranger
- 1x Elderscale Wurm
- 3x Elvish Visionary
- 3x Roaring Primadox
- 4x Slumbering Dragon
That's right, just like poor Stan Marsh the idea here is for the opponent to try to catch the dragon. They can shoot up all they want, but they'll never catch it.
First off, I've gotten some awesome feedback, but I'm sure there are more ideas out there. Also +1s are appreciated.
So what's the plan?
Realistically, the plan is to drop one (or more) Slumbering Dragons early in the game and then either wait for my opponent to wake them up or do so myself. The best part being that there are numerous ways I could wake the li'l guys up: 1) Ring of Valkas is an obvious start; 2) Bond Beetle when paired with Roaring Primadox turns into an easy counter per turn for one G; 3) Increasing Savagery or Blessings of Nature will do the trick pretty quickly; or 4) I just let them attack me and rock a Fog, giving him the counters but not dealing the damage to me.
My biggest problems are as follows:1) I fear that I don't have enough removal or evasion. Am I going to get murdered by a counterspell deck or an aggro that's just faster than I am?
2) Should I drop anything to increase the consistency of the deck? I'm not big on 4x of everything because that leads to really predictable decks, but I'd be willing to drop a few things here or there if it will make the deck more consistent.
3) I've run a LOT of simulated hands, and am willing to mulligan down to three or four to make sure I have a Slumbering Dragon to start the game, but I've found a LOT of hands where I'll only have 3-4 mana through the first 7-8 turns. Do I just need more land?
I'm going to be extra receptive to input here as I haven't played anything competitive outside of drafts and releases (which it goes without saying are totally different).
The floor is open... Thoughts?
So Heroin Hero just made its first appearance at FNM and I have discovered quite resoundingly that it does NOT like the Mirrodin block or anything about it for that matter. In 4 rounds I went a solid 1-3, with those 3 losses coming faster than I think I ever remember losing games of Magic...
First Round: Mono-Red Goblin Burn (0-2) This had to be more burn than goblins as he never had more than two goblins on the battlefield (and none of any real consequence). Both games I had mana issues, game 1 too much, game 2 too little. Yet, in both games he manages at least one Shrine of Burning Rage (two in the first game). Yeah, he torches a few critters and blasts me with the shrines. Totally weak.
Second Round: U/W Miracle (0-2) Yeah, you could totally tell this kid net-decked the crap out of this one. This was the pro miracle deck without a doubt. Not much you can do when the first time he even attacks is with three or five 4/4 angels care of Entreat the Angels. I'll be sooo happy when Ponder and Pristine Talisman rotate out.
Third Round: Mono-black (0-2) Here was another case where the Mirrodin block can bite me. Not much you can do when Phyrexian Obliterator hits the board on turn four and is equipped with Lashwrithe the next turn (or the same on a Vampire Nighthawk until the Obliterator hit the field). I'm getting the distinct feeling that until Mirrodin is gone, this deck has ZERO potential.
Fourth Round: Grixis Control for Bolas (2-0) This was my shining moment of the evening, but also one that solidified the weakness of this deck. First game we played to something of a stalemate as he cloned my Silklash Spider and I simply couldn't get through for most of the game. I used Roaring Primadox and Borderland Ranger to pull pretty much EVERY land out of the deck until I finally drew Increasing Savagery, then it was just two turns (as I flashed it back too) and game. The second game came down to a poor draw for him and my dumping the savagery on an Elvish Visionary - sounds silly, but a 6/6 is never a laughing matter. In the end I chalk this one up to his deck having holes though, as we went through it after the games as he's still relatively new.
Conclusion: In four rounds I saw this deck soundly dismantled on numerous occasions. I could easily blame this on the Mirrodin block (which I do to some degree); however, the simple fact is that I never once awoke a Slumbering Dragon. The one time I managed to get one out and equip Swiftfoot Boots, Shrine of Burning Rage made it so he didn't have to attack and could simply wait (I also was land screwed, so that didn't help). Slumbering Dragon is a cool card, but it's just too slow. If I pull an ideal hand, I can have an 8/8 on turn three, but it's not very likely. I'm thinking I'll keep the deck around, but I'll likely be using pieces (Increasing Savagery)for my Golgari deck once RTR hits. Then again, this could be the fact that outside of the one victory match, almost everyone was playing complete net-decks (with at least four instances of U/W Delver... really folks? Do we even know what originality is?).
Have you thought about adding an Acidic Slime for land/artifact/enchantment destruction?
July 15, 2012 6:49 p.m.
The thought has definitely crossed my mind and I'll likely add two of them to the sideboard.
July 15, 2012 6:55 p.m.
I would drop the Sentinel Spider and replace it with Stingerfling Spider so you can keep on bouncing it everytime someone plays a flier. I would put Roaring Primadox to X4. Because your deck has so many card that give counters, you might want to look at Contagion Clasp . I have a couple green decks, you might want to look at for some more ideas.
July 15, 2012 7:05 p.m.
Well I love Red Green I don't run it anymore but I used too and it was good in my meta. With the Roaring Primadox Combo you should run Thragtusk if you can get any. He Will produce defenders and life. The Balefire Dragon , and the Planeswalkers well I personally wouldn't Run because they don't fit the combo. Acidic Slime would be a good sideboard card. And in my meta this deck would probably get a winning record in FNM so best of luck in the fall when you try out this deck.
July 15, 2012 7:09 p.m.
Also with Slumbering Dragon being a main Win condition you may have mulligan aggressively. I can tell that you that mulling isn't a bad thing it depends on the deck. I've got one deck that I consistently mull down to 4 with. You just need to know when to stop mulling.
July 15, 2012 7:14 p.m.
Thanks everyone for the good input.
Jon1337: I've removed Sentinel Spider and didn't think about Stingerfling Spider but I can see where that makes a lot of sense. I'll also look into shifting to 4x Roaring Primadox . Contagion Clasp is a great thought, I'd wondered about green proliferate. But when does it rotate out?
Korlan: I'd definitely like a few Thragtusk s, but wouldn't we all? ;)
The Balefire and Planeswalkers are in to provide other options in the event my slumbering dragons get taken out. The Balefire is just another big one for them to worry about and the Planeswalkers' effects are good, but they also provide a reason for my opponent to keep attacking.
I've run some hand sims on Deckbox.org and found that if I'm willing to mulligan 2-3 times, odds are I will have at least one Slumbering Dragon .
July 15, 2012 7:26 p.m.
July 15, 2012 8:47 p.m.
The rationale for Sheltering Word is to protect my Slumbering Dragon s from removal. If someone casts Doom Blade /Murder /(insert other removal spell here), I can essentially counter it with Sheltering Word - with a nice little life gain too. Beast Within is nice, but I think of it more as a removal card for green than a means to protect anything of mine.
July 15, 2012 8:52 p.m.
That's why, if somebody plays a titan you lose the game. Balefire Dragon is your only answer to one, and a bad one at that.
July 15, 2012 9 p.m.
Perhaps, but the titans are cycling out soon enough. Also, if one of my dragons wakes up, the titan isn't a problem. Or I can pump up a Primadox with the Bond Beetle s and Increasing Savagery . But with any luck, the dragon(s) would be awake before a titan would hit the battlefield.
July 15, 2012 9:17 p.m.
July 16, 2012 11:13 a.m.
If you want to keep it standard Whispersilk Cloak isn't the option. Swiftfoot Boots are an option. They can also protect your Roaring Primadox . If you like the instant speed though I'd run card:Ranger's Guile. But the boots are preferable.
July 16, 2012 1:58 p.m.
I would suggest using Elderscale Wurm rather than your dragon. It combos fantastically with Curse of the Nightly Hunt, a two-card win condition in many cases.
July 16, 2012 9:54 p.m.
Elderscale Wurm is a GREAT idea Pony! Especially when paired with [Mask of Avacyn]]. It gives me another way to win the game while also keeping them from winning it. Thanks!
July 21, 2012 8:53 p.m.
July 21, 2012 8:53 p.m.
This is very similar to a deck I have recently started.....my deck started to steer a little away from the counters, and more towards the 'bouncing'. All creatures, except the Slumbering Dragon have a 'when this creature comes into play' ability, or a 'when another creature comes into play' ability.
I went with a few card:Garruk's Packleader for the card drawing (thus, I can bounce the dragon to get a card for 1 red). This also gives me a card every time I use the +1 ability of Garruk, Primal Hunter .
I currently have 2 card:Conjurer's Closet's for the auto/free bounce ability of any creature.Adding to that 4x Mark of Mutiny , I am able to take control of a creature, bounce it, and have it not return to the other player (it's officially a different creature, so it does not return).
I'm now thinking of throwing in Mindclaw Shaman and/or Zealous Conscripts , so I can begin to use their deck against them. (I used 2x Murder against someone by casting the Mindclaw Shaman , then using the card:Conjurer's Closet to bounce it on the same turn.)
Right now, I'm working on a) improving the mana curve, and b) keeping it to cards that will still be around when scars and M12 phase out.
July 31, 2012 11:55 a.m.
Also useable to simply give my creatures haste.People around here seem to think this card is not that good, as it gives opponent a +1/+1 counter... I say, bah...! don't target your opponent's creatures then!
July 31, 2012 12:01 p.m.
So I've been doing some simulating and came up with some revisions.
To be specific, I've dropped one Bond Beetle , increased to 3x Elvish Visionary , put in 3x Borderland Ranger to ensure I don't get mana f'ed and they work nicely with Roaring Primadox , dropped Flames of the Firebrand in exchange for Searing Spear as it's an instant and costs one less, dropped to 1x Curse of the Nightly Hunt and added 3x Guise of Fire as it can serve as both small scale removal and force their vulnerable creatures to attack, added 2x Rancor to ensure that the Slumbering Dragon s won't get chumped once they wake up, threw in a Triumph of Ferocity as the dragons will keep growing, so hopefully it will help me draw more.
I'm liking it better for the time being as I'm not forced to just mulligan until I get a Slumbering Dragon with the current makeup. In one simulated hand I even ended up with a 7/6 trample BOP by turn three.
I think that's all. Thoughts as she now stands?
August 9, 2012 1:10 a.m.
August 9, 2012 7:58 a.m.
Oh I'll definitely run Swiftfoot Boots before rotation. I just have the Mask for the moment to plan for once they take that one away from us :( .
August 9, 2012 8:50 a.m.
August 12, 2012 2:24 p.m.
I'm not sure about Cloudshift. You would have to: 1. Add a third color 2. Take out card slots 3. Have at least two creatures out including one Beetle 4. Spend a card (and a mana) ALL to get a single +1/+1 counter.
August 12, 2012 11:29 p.m.
My only thought was if you only have Roaring Primadox out you are gonna have to bounce himself as a good control deck will be able to deal with your creatures. Where as Cloudshift allows you to capitalise on your other come into play abilities repeatedly like Elvish Visionary and if you were to add Acidic Slime . which could easily come in for cards like card:Ranger's Guile, Mask of Avacyn and Triumph of Ferocity which don't really do much as this is the sort of deck where you want to be more proactive than reactive. You would then get access to some better removal in the shape of Oblivion Ring and more bounce effects in the shape of Restoration Angel just my 2 cents is all :).
August 13, 2012 5:50 a.m.
I see where you're going rappo, but adding a third color really would complicate the entire scheme of the deck. I would likely benefit more from using blue, as Ghostly Flicker , Nephalia Smuggler , and Deadeye Navigator would all let me use the flicker mechanic. Pair Ghostly Flicker with Archaeomancer and you would be able to cycle the flickers while getting other ETB effects. But all that aside, I'm really not looking to add other colors as that would totally shift the focus and mechanics of the deck.
Roaring Primadox would be a problem if he's alone, but then he's at least a 4/4 blocker until I pull off another creature. Really though the Slumbering Dragon s (SDs) are the focal point, which will likely take some FNM players by surprise as I haven't encountered many who think SD is a good card. The Primadoxes let me cycle the Bond Beetle s, Elvish Visionary , and Borderland Ranger s. While Cloudshift or Ghostly Flicker might be quicker, they're one shot moves, whereas the Primadoxes will keep working.
August 13, 2012 2:45 p.m.
I have been thinking of a SD deck and this one is awesome. It has speed and durability which is key in today's environment. +1
Check out my Sublime Tal while your at it too and let me know what you think.