Tap: Add (1) to your mana pool.
(2), Tap, Sacrifice Terminal Moraine: Search your library for a basic land card and put that card onto the battlefield tapped. Then shuffle your library.
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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Latest Decks as Commander
Terminal Moraine Discussion
6 months ago
I know you said this is made of stuff from around the house, but I know you have some of these: Power Conduit, Urza's Factory, Coretapper, Walker of the Wastes, Ghostfire Blade, Champion's Helm, Tenza, Godo's Maul, Shadowspear, Basilisk Collar, Cloud Key, Wayfarer's Bauble, Ichor Wellspring, Mystic Forge, Karn's Bastion, Terminal Moraine, Crystal Vein, I know you don't have Mana Vault, but I would be willing to trade one of mine to you for a pile of cards TBD over time if you're interested.
10 months ago
Tzefick: I read through the original post, but I want to circle back to it later. And you will have to excuse the order in general, I was responding to this across the course of a day.
On artifact removal
There are a few points to unpack here. The first, and most importantly, is that removal is a big part of Magic, the Gathering and honestly, is what makes games (and deckbuilding) interesting. IF MtG was just about amassing board states and then slamming big creatures into other big creatures, the game would be much more boring (not to mention take much longer). But your argument here basically boils down to "artifacts are bad because they die to removal". I get that there are a bunch of good artifact removal cards, but that doesn't mean that we should stop leaning into artifacts because of it.
As for dealing with removal (especially mass removal) - there are still many options that white already has access to which does actually allow them to ramp. Wayfarer's Bauble , Burnished Hart , Solemn Simulacrum , Kor Cartographer , Knight of the White Orchid are all perfectly valid land ramp cards. Sure, the average CMC of these spells is higher than their green counterparts, however green is THE ramp colour, so it would be expecteded that there would be hihger costs/more contitions to be met for other colours to do a similar thing. And that's without even touching on cards like Sword of the Animist or Explorer's Scope which are both equipment and what white excels at.
In addition to this, while not ramping, white already has access to cards like Weathered Wayfarer , Land Tax , and Tithe which allow you to consistently hit your lands. While not as good as outright ramping, if you're hitting your lands each turn, you're genereally not doing too badly. And when combined with other ramp effects, by mid to late game you still end up with as much mana as most players.
Now onto the artifacts. Yes, there are a lot of good artifact removal effects which can slow players down. But I would also point out a few things here too.
Mana dorks are a very common form of ramp in commander. Most green decks will run a bunch of them and there are even strategies (elf ball) which almost solely relies on them. But just as artifacts can be hated on, white has some of THE best creature removal in the game. This includes both single target but also mass removal, which can severely hamper your opponents with regards to ramp. And unlike green (who is the main comparison point here), white doesn't rely on mana dorks, leaving you relatively unaffected from a mana standpoint.
In addition to this, white has a lot of ways of protecting your stuff from being destroyed, whether it's indestructible, hexproof, just an outright Teferi's Protection (which yes you did mention), or more importantly shutting down an opponent's removal source using Torpor Orb effects, of which white has many. Sure, this doesn't stop everything, but it can shut down a lot of (especially green) big bad ones. We are seeing a lot of these printed in new sets, to the point where WotC are really trying to drive home the point that "this is what white does".
Ok, now circling back (And I will do this more than once) and picking up on my previous paragraph. On the topic of land ramp - white is very good at shutting down this. between all of the MLD, Balance type effects and library shutdown effects like Aven Mindcensor , white hating on green's land ramp is to green hating on artifacts (i.e. white's main ramp source). Again I reiterate, this is what white does. It has been made abundantly clear, since we have time and time again seen printing of cards that equalise the board, to take away other players' advantages. So again I push the point that white is capable, however the issue here is that it's not the way you (or some other casule commander players) want it to be. But again, that's not white's shortfall.
On Graveyard Recursion
This topic follows on from the whole artifact removal thing. Yes, white is very strong in graveyard recursion. And just to touch on one of your points, even recently white got a bunch of graveyard recursion via cards like Daring Archaeologist and Restoration Specialist . Not repeatable sure, but still decent. And let's face it, any mono-white commander product is going to see Sun Titan reprinted. But back to the whole recusrion thing in general - while white is good at recursion, it's permanent based, not specifically land based. Yes, this overlaps (especially in the case of Sun Titan ) but here it's just a bit of nice value.
Land recursion is very much a green thing (I'm not even going to list the cards) and that makes sense. But for white, the recursion is generally symmetric if en masse. And again, this makes sense. White is good at wrecking stuff, so it's also good at bringing stuff back. But the point is that just because you wreck stuff and bring it back symmetrically doesn't mean that you can't exile a graveyard or two in the middle. Ok, but what's my concern with what you're recommending (both across the board but let's talk specifics)?
So, fundamentally I have no issues with the release of white cards which can return permanents from the graveyard to the battlefield, and fundamentally I have no issues with pairing these cards with any kind of fetchlands to ramp. As you mentioned, we have the new Sevinne's Reclamation and Brought Back alongside Sun Titan and Profound Journey .
Where I have issue in this case is not with the concept of having a cheaper spell that hits smaller stuff, but in this case your suggestion. Unforntunately, ther is a fine line between being able to be used early game for ramp purposes and just being broken. The card you proposed is similar in effect to Unearth , though it being able to hit any permanent for 2 mana (yes, even CMC 2 or less) is super good. That means that in legacy it can hit cards like Young Pyromancer , Snapcaster Mage (to get other spells even at sorcery, like itself for example), Thalia, Guardian of Thraben , Wasteland , etc. as well as potentially getting another permanent too. It just seems way too powerful. Sure, we could start tweaking the mana costs/effects but I think you would end up with effectively a functional reprint of Sevinne's Reclamation . And look, if that's what you're going for then that's fine. But that's the danger with working under the guise of returning permanents while focusing on lands.
As for the land sepcific recursion effect though, this just seems out of charater (and heavily moving into green's territory). Just because one card was printed, which again did a symmetric effect (almost seems good with Armageddon + Tormod's Crypt ...) does not mean that it's a shoo-in for more cards to be printed like that. Planar Birth was printed inthe same set as Catastrophe and it seems like those cards were designed to play well with each other. As for hitting land drops each turn, I have no issues with this (hell, I even mentioend it before) and to aid in the available "non-good fetch" fetches, you have Terramorphic Expanse , Evolving Wilds , Myriad Landscape , Grasslands , Flood Plain , Bant Panorama , Esper Panorama , Naya Panorama , Warped Landscape , Terminal Moraine and Thawing Glaciers . That's a pretty good collection of budget fetch effects that already exist. And between Scaretiller , Sun Titan , Sevinne's Reclamation and Crucible of Worlds (and in conjuction with other ramp) there are already options there.
Again, I will double down on my argument that if you look, these cards already exist and can be made to work together in a deck. Yes, Crucible of Worlds has ~$25 USD price tag (at the time of writing this) however that is not too exorbitant for a strong EDH card.
On Other Colours
I get that each colour has its strengths and weaknesses and that when you put all of them alongside each other there will always be a worst colour. But I don't think that's a bad thing. White is an incredibly powerful colour outside of commander, and as a second colour, white is still super good. But mono-white has to have a weakness. In this case, it's slow. Buat again, that's done for a reason - because white represents balance. White might be slow, but it will do a really good job of slowing you down with it. And again, I get that ther will be a group of players who don't want to play all of the stax cards for fear of getting other poeple's backs up. But what about the players who don't care about that? you've now just armed a bunch of people with ramp and draw with their existing supply of stax. Think of how much worse that will be.
Now onto red (since you touched on it) - yes, WotC have come up with a nice balance for red's card advantage (in that it matches red's ramp style) - momentary bursts of value. Rituals and exile - you use it or you lose it kind of effects, which makes sense (and which you pointed out). But it's all done within the bounds of the colour pie still. But everything about white screams that it's card advantage is making sure your opponents don't have cards.
While I believe that commander should be avaialble to anyone, there are some cold, hard facts: Some people can spend more than others, and, not everybody within a playgroup has the same budget.
The cards I listed before were budgetless and in most cases, the best of the best. And I understand that only a small portion of commander players actually own said cards. But there are always alternative cards at all budgets, they just may not be as desirable. But that's where my double standard comment came in, which is "if you want to play a colour that doens't have good ramp, but still want the best ramp then either pay the money to buy the good (read "expensive") stuff or deal with the fact that you can't/won't buy it." I don't think that's an unfair statement, and it's a slippery slope once you start pandering to it.
But again, if ther is a budget discrepency within a playgroup then I also don't think that it is WotC's responsiblity to fix it. This is something that the players have to own and is an entire discussion point in an of itself, so I will leave that there. But I think most players would agree with me on this.
On Other Players
Here's where we get to brass tacks (if we haven't already), I wouldn't agree with you on the comment that "a large portion of the commander community" thinks that mono-white needs fixing. Ther eare some poeple, sure. And those people might make a lot of noise about it, but that doesn't mean it's the majority of players. I know that most players who I interact with would agree wiht my viewpoint on it.
And don't get me wrong, I play both casual and competitive lists, I work full time and have funds available to afford nicer cards. A casual list for me sits in the $400-500 range. But before you discount my opinion becasue fo that, hear me out. I have looked at many, many, many lists on tapped out, ranging from <$100 to >$5000 and have learnt a lot over the years. Typically the things I notice is that the kinds of poeple who complain about a lack of XYZ have also employed a lot of bad deck-building practices (no, I'm not implying this on your lists). Really heavy mana curves, little ramp to begin with, high CMC ramp, lack of focused win conditions, all that good stuff. And I'm not saying that the decks are completely unplayable, but a lot of them are really clunky and slow. And I won't begrudge people for building those decks. But if your average CMC is 4.5 and then you're complaining that your deck is slow, that's becasue of the card choices you made. However bad deckbuilding is not WotC's fault.
So compared to those poeple, I will be a bit arrogant and say I undstand balance better than them, yes. But, and more importantly, so does WotC - because they seem to be printing more stax cards for white as sets come out, but not more ramp and card advantage which would fix the non-problem.
1 year ago
Cards to replace: Fungal Sprouting Evolving Wilds hearthstone Thallid Shell-Dweller Sporesower Thallid Nullmage Shepherd Caustic Caterpillar Fungal Sprouting Thallid Fecundity Warped Landscape Fungal Sprouting Thallid Germinator Terminal Moraine Fungal Sprouting Jund Panorama Savage Thallid
1 year ago
With you having a critical mass of Elementals, both tokens and actual creature cards, a good finisher such as Overwhelming Stampede would be a good idea, I think. If you don't mind winning through infect, Triumph of the Hordes is also good. It gets bonus points since it gives Omnath infect, so his bolt effect when a creature dies will deal infect damage too.
Also, Pyroblast is strictly better than Guttural Response, since it counters any blue spell and can also blast blue permanents.
1 year ago
I never understood why so many people build Karametra as an enchantress deck. Her strength is clearly Creatures and Landfall! So I'm glad you are running Courser of Kruphix , Lotus Cobra , Emeria Shepherd , Emeria Angel , Rampaging Baloths , Admonition Angel , Tireless Tracker , and Avenger of Zendikar .
But in a deck that takes so much advantage of landfall, why only 1 fetchland? If you added more fetchlands, and then Azusa, Lost but Seeking , Ramunap Excavator . . . suddenly your Lotus Cobra is getting you 6 mana per turn completely for free, Rampaging Baloths is dropping 6 beast tokens per turn completely for free. Plus the extras you'll get for playing creatures and triggering Karametra.
Obviously fetchlands plus Karametra/Creatures triggers will run you out of basics to fetch. But when that happens you should be so far ahead that you can find a wincon.
If you put in Quirion Ranger , Scryb Ranger , Jungle Basin , and Karoo , and you don't even need lands in your deck to keep getting the land drop triggers.
If you wanted even more land drops you could of course run Wayward Swordtooth , Oracle of Mul Daya , Llanowar Scout , Sakura-Tribe Scout , Walking Atlas , probably others I can't think of off the top of my head.
More ways to take advantage of so much landfall: Retreat to Kazandu , Grazing Gladehart , Oran-Rief Hydra , Retreat to Emeria , Stone-Seeder Hierophant (toss in a Wild Growth , Utopia Sprawl , or Overgrowth and watch what Stoneseeder can do in this deck!)
Fetchlands Available to G/W: Terramorphic Expanse Evolving Wilds Myriad Landscape Flooded Strand Bloodstained Mire Wooded Foothills Blighted Woodland Bant Panorama Esper Panorama Grixis Panorama Jund Panorama Naya Panorama Marsh Flats Verdant Catacombs Arid Mesa Misty Rainforest Terminal Moraine Thawing Glaciers
1 year ago
That's a cool interaction, hadn't thought of that. I tend to stay away from lands like Vesuva that ETB tapped (unless their stand-alone ability is amazing), this one enters tapped, and requires an "enabler" land. In the scenario I have a Flagstones of Trokair it works great (but remember too that Flagstones of Trokair also puts the plains in tapped.). It's much less utility (especially T1-T4 when trying to win) than a Fetch land. Plus no tutors for land to pull the combo (like Expedition Map) even if I draw into 1 or 2 pieces of it. Crucible of Worlds + Vesuva + Flagstones of Trokair too much random drawing needed, and Vesuva isn't strong enough to stand on it's own.
Thespian's Stage enters untapped for colorless, so it's a bit better. Still has the same 3-card combo requirements, and it's CMC to pull the plains. Warped Landscape can do it for same price (but only 2 targets in my build), Terminal Moraine, Myriad Landscape, Esper Panorama, Etc. Only pull basic, which i don't have many because of Tainted Pact.
Too much uncertainty for me to test. if i had lots of basics could run the Panoramas that pull , , or .
2 years ago
i would suggest Jadelight Ranger,Skyshroud Ranger for creatures and also maybe consider running Bant Panorama, Terminal Moraine, Warped Landscape,Blighted Woodland or Undiscovered Paradise to replace the dual colored sac-lands you can only tap for one color because of your commander colors.
2 years ago
Since you're playing Azusa, you're gonna want more lands to play your threats more quickly. I would go up to at least 44 as a starting point and then add up to (usually no more than) 50 lands.
My first comment doesn't work with spoilers so here it is.
Cuts and Additions
I see you have an eldrazi theme. That being sad, you should only add the important eldrazi to free up slots that will help you achieve your goal.
Desolation Twin - Two big dudes with no trample or ETB
Eldrazi Devastator - Big dude with trample for 8 is not worth it
Sakura-Tribe Elder - Replace with land
Solemn Simulacrum - Replace with land. Sad robot is used in decks with no ramp or card draw like boros. You're green so this isn't necessary
Vorapede - Medium sized dude that comes back, no central to your game plan
While I personally don't like Nature's Spiral, you might as well replace it with Recollect. It costs 1 more but can get you back cards like G-Wave or Tooth and Nail. Huge difference for 1 mana, worth it.
Renegade Map - Replace with land 100%
Beastmaster Ascension - Best in a token build, not your deck
Song of Freyalise - No idea why this is here, you're not a token build
Warriors' Lesson - Weak
Plummet - Limited removal (meta dependent)
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth - Card draw, threat, HIGHLY recommend.
Kozilek, the Great Distortion - Super card draw. You will need colorless mana for him. Given that you're mono green, I would replace some basic forests with some non basic lands for both utility AND so you can run him. Azusa decks NEED card draw and he is one of the best
Conduit of Ruin - Helps you find threats, cost reducer
Emrakul, the Promised End - Big dude, cost reduced, cast trigger/mind control and protection with evasion. HIGHLY recommend.
Fierce Empath - Finds threats or either kozileks for card draw
Multani, Yavimaya's Avatar - Read it, run it. Love it. works well with fetches.
Ramunap Excavator - You should run some fetches (cheap ones or expensive ones) to help ensure and fuel land drops, thin out deck and provide recursion for utilty lands.
Tireless Tracker - Provides card draw, gets big, works well with fetches (I mentioned fetches many times, they are probably important. RUN THEM!)
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger - Removal wincon. Green doesn't have much permanent removal so ulamog helps.
Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre - See above
Woodland Bellower - Utility in finding whatever you need. Ramunap Excavator for recursion, e-wit for general recursion, courser of kruphix for ramp, reclamation sage (if you chose to add it) for artifact/enchantment removal, fierce emmpath to find eldrazi bombs, etc.... Depends on if you have enough targets (note: NON-legendary)
World Breaker - Works with your eldrazi idea, can recur itself, removal all in 1.
Yavimaya Elder - Dont need to run it but it helps with card draw and ramp, up to you.
Greater Good - Remember, card draw is azusa's biggest issue. This card basically makes it no issue. Also is a nice sac outlet against exile and steal effects. RUN THIS!!
Song of the Dryads - You need permanent removal in green, this is great to use on their commander (particularly on red or black generals who have difficulty removing enchantments). Also see Beast Within if you prefer instant speed interaction and actually destroying something. Up to you, but I like song of dryads more (it also a permanent to go with g-wave)
Survival of the Fittest - Creature tutors are HUGE. Helps you find bombs or key utility (see ramanup excavtor). Lastly, protects against graveyard exile effects by tossing a create, getting an eldrazi like Kozilek or Ulamog that shuffles your grave back in.
Sylvan Library - Like sensei's but you can pay the life to draw more cards. I can't tell you how many times this has helped me. TOP DECK MANIPULATION with FETCHES = GOOD TIMES/SMOOTHER DRAWS!!! RUN THIS!
Garruk, Primal Hunter - Card draw, can make tokens and ult is relevant. Although I just minus him right away (can use Soul's Magesty instead, but it isnt a permanent for g-wave).
Rishkar's Expertise - Card draw AND casts a 5 cmc or less spell for free. Run it either instead of or in addition to the above (usually in addition to).
Nissa, Vital Force - +1 is ok, -3 is relevant, and just read the ult. Protect it for one turn and you'e golden
Boundless Realms - The ramp is strong with this one
Rude Awakening > Sylvan Awakening. Yes they arent indestructible, but it's utility in becoming a wincon late game or ramp mid game is great. Also works well with mana doublers like Zendikar resurgent or Mana reflection.
Horn of Greed - BEST CARD IN YOUR DECK. You will get WAY more value than your opponents.
Crucible of Worlds - To work with fetches!! ADD THIS (and the ramanup excavtor)
Thaumatic Compass - Helps ensure land drops, turns into a better maze of ith. Should consider but not necessary
Momentous Fall - Very useful but not necessary. Helps prevent exile/steal effects. Can also use in response to removal (creature dies anyways but you get insane benefit).
Here are some fetches, these are your primary ones to acquire
Terminal Moraine - Nice but not neccesary if you run above
Warped Landscape - Same as above
Cavern of Souls - Anti blue (meta dependent)
Eldrazi Temple - Fuel eldrazi
Eye of Ugin - Tutors AND fuels eldrazi. SUPER Important card. ADD THIS! Helps you find the eldrazi you need for card draw, removal and to win.
Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx - Ramp
Reliquary Tower - No max hand size
Sanctum of Ugin - Find other eldrazi
Thawing Glaciers - Ensures land drops! ADD THIS! I underestimated it at first too but it's pulled some weight
Yavimaya Hollow - Regen
You can add land destruction like strip mine if you want but idk how your playgroup is. There are other utility lands too but I feel like this is enough for now
When/if you accept/like some of these ideas, I would like to present you with cards for finding the important utility lands (like eye, which in turn can find your creatures needed to win, ensures consistency!)
If you have any questions, want more feedback or cuts, let me know!