|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Scars of Mirrodin (SOM)||Common|
|Promo Set (000)||Common|
Combos Browse all
Creature — Insect Horror
Infect (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters and to players in the form of poison counters.)
Plague Stinger Discussion
1 week ago
To start, I think you are running too many creatures with infect. Infect works best when you can drop a creature on turn 1, pump and swing for large amounts of damage turn 2, then finish them off on turns 3 and 4. Generally, competitive decks run around twelve creatures - 4x Glistener Elf , then run Blue, not Black, for the unblockable Blighted Agent and combination pump/ramp creature Noble Hierarch .
The rest of your deck should be focused on pump spells. Here are some great options:
- Increase to 4x Mutagenic Growth
- Run 4x Scale Up - note that scale up does not modify abilities, so you can swing with a 6/4 with infect on turn 2.
- Blossoming Defense and Vines of Vastwood both are great cards for pumping your creatures and keeping them safe from enemy kill spells.
- Might of Old Krosa gives your creature +4/+4, a huge boost for 1 mana.
- Groundswell is fairly easy to enable, so it also gives +4/+4.
- One or two copies of Become Immense , which you can delve your previously-cast pump spells for cost reduction.
For removal, you can use Assassin's Trophy and Dismember , both of which are great spells. I would mostly sideboard these options--you want to come out swinging early and fast on game one, and any non-pump-spell is going to slow you down.
Some more sideboard options: Perhaps some artifact removal ( Viridian Corrupter is removal on a body; Nature's Claim is a one-mana removal spell); and anti-Dredge hate ( Grafdigger's Cage and Ravenous Trap ).
1 month ago
I like it! I have a couple of work in progress Glissa Tiny Leaders decks that are meant to have more theme than competitive bite. One is my "Drow" deck ( elves, spiders and infect). The other is my Phyrexian-themed "Herald of Compleation" deck (artifacts, zombies, horrors, recurring Perilous Myr and such). I see a few familiar cards from both here. I'll admit I hadn't even thought of the mill option. Love the Plague Stinger combo.
Most of us play multiplayer TL when we don't have the time or access for Commander, and I love brewing Tiny decks.
1 month ago
Efficient creatures with Infect is a strange thing to discuss because of Infect's inherent massive difference between damaging creatures and damaging players. And I think this is the reason why Infect is such a hated mechanic by many.
You can keep playing new creatures to block Infect-sources, that's a "renewable" resource. Poison counters is not something you can interact with (in a positive way) so once it's there, you cannot really do anything about it.
Infect also has the fundamental flaw that it plays its very own sub genre of a win condition and doesn't interact well with many other mechanics in the Magic universe. It plays extremely well with pump effects, because it basically has a hard cap of 10 damage dealt to a player and we're home safe.
However most Infect creatures are either blockable or are too heavy to play around as a win condition. I guess that's why you say the only efficient Infect creatures are Glistener Elf and Blighted Agent . One can win by turn two with pump spells before the opponent can reasonably have a chance to put down a blocker or deal with it, and the other the opponent cannot block, so it doesn't have to be thrown down before the match really starts.
You could just as easily have said Blight Mamba , Flensermite , Ichorclaw Myr , Lost Leonin , Necropede , Plague Myr or Plague Stinger . All of those are 2 CMC 1 power creatures with Infect (well Lost Leonin has 2 power). They have all the same basic characteristics as Glistener Elf , except they cost 1 mana more. Is the difference between a 1 mana and 2 mana creature with the same basic characteristics with Infect really that big? Apparently so, as those creatures requires a whole turn more to get in position to whack for lethal and they don't have evasion (with exception of Plague Stinger , who is just in the wrong colors for efficient fast lethal smacks). In this time the opponent have had a fair chance to drop a blocker or kill the creature and that's just not good enough for Infect. Because Infect is all about dropping a low cost creature with Infect and win the turn after. If it cannot do that, it doesn't function all too well.
Such a huge margin is present for Infect and that's a contributing factor to why the mechanic is such a blow out for many players.
I'm a huge fan of Shadowmoor and Eventide's Wither mechanic. It was an interesting way to interact with large creatures, but as Berry notes, the mechanic kinda felt too weak to actually matter.
It was interesting as well to have spells with Wither Puncture Blast as it effectively read; deal 3 damage to a player or planeswalker or give a creature 3 -1/-1 counters.
I do hope they consider bringing Wither back, but you wont see me hold my breath for Infect's return. The mechanic is in my eyes fundamentally flawed.
According to MaRo and his Storm Scale article (https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/storm-scale-mirrodin-and-scars-mirrodin-blocks-2018-06-11) , he is more optimistic about Poison counters return than he is Infect.
6 months ago
Hi itachi45 !
First of all, thanks for your comment !
I've always liked Infect but never was a big fan of the usual aggro/combo variant. So i played a Mono Black style since a long time because i love Phyrexian Crusader and think it can be a very efficient win-con in Modern. B/G should be the way to go but i'm pretty sure a Rakdos variant could have decent results : casting Anger of the Gods when you have a Crusader on the board is pretty enjoyable and Blood Moon is still a thing in Modern.
I have only play-tested the deck on MTGO for now and made some choices :
- Plague Stinger eats all the removals of the format and needs a big boost to be efficient ( Lashwrithe , Become Immense ...)
- Still not sure about the non-inclusion of Inkmoth Nexus , but i never missed them. I also want to keep the colorless lands at their minimum because of Anger of the Gods and because i wanna keep two Cathedral of War as they turn Phyrexian Vatmother , Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon and an equipped Phyrexian Crusader into a two turns clock.
- I love Phyrexian Arena and would like it to works, but Night's Whisper comes a turn earlier and it makes a big difference IMO.
I will still give a go to different things on MTGO and refine the deck to try to find the best options ! I usually play another deck in FNM but if my attempts are conclusives i will try it IRL ;)
(Sorry if my english isn't perfect, i'm french^^)
6 months ago
Greetings, fellow Phyrexian!
itachi45, High Counsel of Jin-Gitaxias, coming in for a comment.
I love a lot of what you have going on here. You’ve taken a non-conventional, or rather non-typical, route of dealing Infect damage.
I think the only thing I worry about is with the amount of removal and the counter magic available in modern, I don’t know that your six creatures will be enough to get the job done. I know you have a lot of disruption for that, but sometimes that’s just not enough, especially in matchup’s we are going to have to grind your opponent out.
I think I might like to see some copies of Plague Stinger just as a cheap, invasive infect creature that you can then try and protect.
Other than that, I really do like what you have here. I would love to hear about some results that you may have had or to see if you can take it to some tournaments and get some results. I know the traditional blue/green infect deck does pretty well, but I would love to see what a variant could do in the right metagame
6 months ago
A lot of the things you mentioned is just meta calls and personal choices. The two main Spell Pierce is to counteract Burn and control decks. There isn't really a situation where they aren't helpful just in case, and I take them out against decks with fewer spells. I used to play Distortion Strike however I feel like it's not super necessary. 8/14 Infect creatures come with built in evasion, and creature heavy decks where blocking is a problem aren't a bug problem right now. Looking on mtgtop8.com, in the Modern meta for the past 2 weeks we have mostly Burn, Storm, Control, Izzet Phoenix, and Dredge. Other than Dredge, Spell Pierce is far favored over Distortion Strike . Basically the Strike 's are better when the meta has more Humans, Elves, Goblins, Spirits, or Toolbox decks floating around, but currently Pierce is better now.
I used to play Dryad Arbor too but it always sucked to draw. Having a land that effectively enters tapped is unacceptable, and currently, there are no Lilliana players in my home meta. However I'll be bringing my copy to the GP I'm going to in a few weeks. This one is more of a personal choice than anything, but Arbor is usually really good, but I don't feel like it's 100% necessary.
I'll assume "it Kirkland Murder" was a typo for Ichorclaw Myr . To be honest, I thought these guys were kinda trash for a while. However, I experimented with Sultai Infect for around a year or so, and I liked having 4x Plague Stinger . Against decks with more removal, more creatures is better. Plus, he's good swinging into blockers because you don't have to waste pumps to save him in most cases and he's a beast with a Rancor . I would never play more than 2 though.
I don't really like Mishra's Bauble . I haven't tested it but to me it just seems like a waste of space. It doesn't even replace itself as you don't draw until the next turn. After Git Probe was banned, I tested a few different cantrips, including Sleight of Hand , Serum Visions , Slip Through Space , and Street Wraith . None of them really suited my needs. Gitaxian Probe was banned not because it draws cards but because it gives "perfect information" about your opponents hand for free. Probe could make or break games because you could see if it was safe to attack or not. Mishra's Bauble doesn't do that or anything even close. I'd rather add more creatures and protection to cushion against removal heavy decks than play cantrips that don't do that good of a job.
Pithing Needle is straight up meta call, but it's actually pretty good. It will stay in my side because I think the Prime Speaker Vannifar decks may take off. It's a decent way to slow down Kiki-Chord decks, as well as Tron and other planeswalkers.
Have you seriously not seen Shapers' Sanctuary in action before? Its powerful. Control players groan when I play it. Often if I have it in my opening hand I play it turn 1 as insurance for a Glistener Elf turn 2 so I can draw into a Blossoming Defense or the like if I need it. I really encourage you to try this out if Control ever gets you down. They're only a dollar, trust me, it's worth it.
Thanks for your comment, I look forward to further discussion!
6 months ago
Phyrexian Altar, has never been printed in a Modern legal set and a similar effect simply won't be, it's broken. Of late there has been discussion around Krark-Clan Ironworks (probably the closest thing) and its namesake deck KCI, essentially KCI is the most likely deck to be hit with a ban for doing the sort of combo your talking about, all be it with colourless mana.
That out of the way, normally it isn't wise to mix infect creature with non-infect creatures, even something like Necroskitter which has a degree of synergy. Infect wants to kill fast and normally uses evasion Plague Stinger and Inkmoth Nexus for example to deliver that damage. You seem to want something more in the Blood Artist style, but with infect... I guess a Grim Lavamancer granted infect would be close, or a card like Jaya Ballard, Task Mage or Magus of the Scroll that plays in a similar space.
As a competitive casual deck, this is fine, probably even fun, but I'm not sure what you want to do is really that viable in Modern. I am not a fan of the dies to removal argument, but Anger of the Gods is quite likely to scrub your whole board and it is played. This just feels a little unfocused, your not building an all out infect deck and your not building a legal combo deck. Sticking with your idea though I suspect your best plan is a bit more control and use cards like the Lavamancer to deliver your damage. I hope this was of help, good luck with your brew.
7 months ago
You have a low curve, so you don't need 23 land, at the same time you have 62 cards in the deck, I'd suggest you cut the two Yavimaya Coast to bring you down to 60 cards. Still on the subject of lands, I'd add 2x Cathedral of War, unless you want to pay for Noble Hierarch, cut 2x of Windswept Heath to make the space. An infect deck isn't normally interested in interaction, it wants to deliver its 10 damage as quickly as possible, so Duress, Thoughtseize, and Dismember wouldn't normally be here. I'd also say Apostle's Blessing, is overkill, you already have 4x Blossoming Defense, that opens 5 slots. I'd suggest +1 Spellskite +2 Ichorclaw Myr and your choice of +2 Serum Visions, Mystic Speculation or Reason / Believe, they all fill a similar role, or Mission Briefing.
I wouldn't recommend Silent Gravestone when Grafdigger's Cage or Relic of Progenitus exist. I'm not sure you need to go 3 colours, but black would give you access to Plague Stinger. Hope this helps, good luck brewing your deck.
Plague Stinger occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%